John Kerry and Abortion

[Esoteric_Illuminati]

John Kerry is pro-choice, yet believes life begins at conception. Now this position just doesn't make sense to me personally.

"I oppose abortion, personally. I don't like abortion. I believe life does begin at conception."

Source:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/ar ... 4Jul4.html


Kerry's Pro-Choice position:
http://www.issues2000.org/2004/John_Kerry_Abortion.htm
http://www.johnkerry.com/issues/women/

Essentially Kerry argues that an unborn child's life ought not undermine a woman's right to privacy.

Now I don't believe any normal person in his right mind would be pro-choice IF they sincerely believed abortion was murder (or intentional killing of a human being if one wants to get into semantics).

If Kerry believes life begins at conception, consistant his Catholic beliefs, as he says he does, then he must certainly believe abortion immoral and an unjustified act of taking human life. So how can he be pro-choice and condone abortion?

My idea of Kerry's position on abortion is reduced to 2 conclusions:
1.) Kerry sincerely believes abortion is murder and an immoral act, yet condones it and fights for pro-choice anyways.
2.) Kerry does not believe abortion is murder/immoral, but says he believes it is.

The implication of #1 is that Kerry is a madman. One must be morally insane to sincerely believe that an unborn child is being killed, yet politically fight for and justify the killing of unborn children.

The implication of #2 is that Kerry is a liar. Perhaps he's just saying he believes life begins at conception to appease Catholic and pro-life voters?

Kerry's position on stem-cell research also seems to have these same troubling either/or implications. He is an advocate for advances in embryonic stem-cell research. And of course this kind of research ought to greatly trouble people who believe life begins at conception.

Is John Kerry putting politics over morality? Aren't politics supposed to be based on morality? I have heard John Kerry claim we need a leader with "strong values." Given his position on abortion and stem-cell research, are we supposed to believe Kerry is talking about himself?

[Titan]

Yes Titan, you have narrowed in on the crux of my argument. You see, there were people - Ghandi comes to mind - who opposed WW2 on purely pro-life grounds - that killing will never result in good. We may argue with this specific application of non-violence, but it represents to me a pure position.

Then I disagree with Ghandi, good came out of violence because what we did was stop the Nazis from murdering innocent people, we also rebuilt an economy, ended a cruel dictatorship, and began a change in racism.

There was another man who advised us - I'm paraphrasing here - that the old "eye for an eye" mentality was fruitless; that we should turn the other cheek to those who attack. This is a very difficult path to follow, and I don't pretend to follow it myself.

The government is very different in that respect. Someone murders your kid, should you hand them your other kid? The police catch a murderer, should they congradulate him or punish him.

Yes, there is. But to my way of thinking, an honest pro-life position would not acknowledge it. That is, if you say, "That life has value, but this life does not," then this is not a pro-life position. It is something else.

We are entering the realm of justice. This is what we say "If you take a life, you sacrifice your right to live" or that basic concept. You see we stop a person speeding on the street because he is endangering others. We put a murderer in jail because he is killing people.

[perfessor]

Then I disagree with Ghandi, good came out of violence because what we did was stop the Nazis ... <snip>

The government is very different in that respect. Someone murders your kid, should you hand them your other kid? The police catch a murderer, should they congradulate him or punish him. ... <snip>

... This is what we say "If you take a life, you sacrifice your right to live" or that basic concept.

Titan, I agree with you on these points (mostly). My point is, it seems odd that many will call Bush the "pro-life president", when many of his policies and actions directly contradict the teachings of Jesus. Yet Kerry is reviled for reasons similar to those in which Bush gets a pass.

[Titan]

My point is, it seems odd that many will call Bush the "pro-life president", when many of his policies and actions directly contradict the teachings of Jesus.

Don't get me wrong, you make an excellent point. I feel that the idea behind the theology is that the Bible gives the government certain powers. So certain things should be a concern to the religious but some things should be accepted, such as taxes.

[perfessor]

My point is, it seems odd that many will call Bush the "pro-life president", when many of his policies and actions directly contradict the teachings of Jesus.

Don't get me wrong, you make an excellent point. I feel that the idea behind the theology is that the Bible gives the government certain powers. So certain things should be a concern to the religious but some things should be accepted, such as taxes.

Thank you, Titan, for an interesting conversation.