Pro. 25: 2
It is the glory of God to conceal a matter, But the glory of kings is to search out a matter
I love the above verse and find such an awesome deepness in God in things that are hidden. I find the Bible full of hidden mysteries (Greek Sacred Secret) and what amazes me are some many brothers and sisters in the Lord actually believe there are no mysteries in scripture.
God Himself hides Himself from man. This was not the case in the Garden of Eden; but once man became naked our perception of God changed. When Adam died; he did not die at that moment as we all know death. He died phyically at the age of 930 years old. But what did happened is he died spiritually at that moment he became naked which has nothing to do with not having clothing in the natural sense.
You see a dead man cannot see, hear, touch etc. A spiritual dead man is dead to the realm of the spirit and cannot see, hear, touch God as Adam did in the garden.
WHY DOES God HIDE HIMSELF.
Moderator: Moderators
Post #71
BUT that has been my point. God is clear and concise and something we can understand if you are a spiritual man. God does not lower himself down to man made vision of science; even through He created every small bit of science to include all things in the natural realm; but His realm is higher.
But it you are a natural man, a sciencetific man you do not have the proper vision. There is no debate with these rules. You dismiss scripture as a source of reference; you dismiss the spirit realm because it cannot be seen, heard, touched; you even dismiss the fact that God exist.. But what scripture declares carnal man cannot comprehend the realm of the spirit and does this in a multiple of ways. There is physical evidence; be it an oak leaf; you see God is one; and all of His creation is one; just like God who created all things in harmony. There are the Constitutions of the Zodiac; but even carnal man or religious men dismiss this fact. God hides Himself and does it because He does not want flesh men to see His glory.
But it you are a natural man, a sciencetific man you do not have the proper vision. There is no debate with these rules. You dismiss scripture as a source of reference; you dismiss the spirit realm because it cannot be seen, heard, touched; you even dismiss the fact that God exist.. But what scripture declares carnal man cannot comprehend the realm of the spirit and does this in a multiple of ways. There is physical evidence; be it an oak leaf; you see God is one; and all of His creation is one; just like God who created all things in harmony. There are the Constitutions of the Zodiac; but even carnal man or religious men dismiss this fact. God hides Himself and does it because He does not want flesh men to see His glory.
Post #72
There is no speech, and there are no words- their voice is unheard- yet their rule and direction is gone out through all of the earth, and their words, their teaching, their instruction to the end of the world."
Yes, the starry heavens are constantly telling and prophesying their message to man. They reveal marvelous knowledge, and their testimony is universally heard, yet without a spoken word. All this indicates something far beyond the simple wonder of the stars as dazzling objects twinkling majestically against the inky blackness of the night sky.
Yes, the starry heavens are constantly telling and prophesying their message to man. They reveal marvelous knowledge, and their testimony is universally heard, yet without a spoken word. All this indicates something far beyond the simple wonder of the stars as dazzling objects twinkling majestically against the inky blackness of the night sky.
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otseng
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Post #73
Benoni wrote: But it you are a natural man, a sciencetific man you do not have the proper vision. There is no debate with these rules. You dismiss scripture as a source of reference; you dismiss the spirit realm because it cannot be seen, heard, touched; you even dismiss the fact that God exist..
Moderator warning:
Again, this is a debating forum that relies on presenting evidence and logical arguments. If you cannot present these, then please do not post.
Post #74
Again..... READ my whole post.
otseng wrote:Benoni wrote: But it you are a natural man, a sciencetific man you do not have the proper vision. There is no debate with these rules. You dismiss scripture as a source of reference; you dismiss the spirit realm because it cannot be seen, heard, touched; you even dismiss the fact that God exist..
Moderator warning:
Again, this is a debating forum that relies on presenting evidence and logical arguments. If you cannot present these, then please do not post.
Post #75
Moderator Warning
Benoni,
Please be aware that any challenges to moderator actions must be made via PM. Posting within the thread is against the rules.
Secondly, it seems there is still some disconnect on the guidelines and rules. You can quote scripture. But you seem to be arguing from the point of view that scripture should be accepted as authoritative and that the problem is with those who do not accept this. However, even those of us who are Christian are obliged by the rules not to debate as if the Bible is authoritative in this forum, the Christianity and Apologetics forum.
You could debate by qualifying your statements with phrases like "if we assume the Bible is true" or "under this particular interpretation, it follows that . . . " However, if you make positive claims you cannot expect the Bible to be considered the sole evidence to support that claim, at least in this forum.
Because of the nature of the debate and the opening post, I am moving this thread to the Theology Forum.
Benoni wrote:Again..... READ my whole post.otseng wrote:Benoni wrote: But it you are a natural man, a sciencetific man you do not have the proper vision. There is no debate with these rules. You dismiss scripture as a source of reference; you dismiss the spirit realm because it cannot be seen, heard, touched; you even dismiss the fact that God exist..
Moderator warning:
Again, this is a debating forum that relies on presenting evidence and logical arguments. If you cannot present these, then please do not post.
Benoni,
Please be aware that any challenges to moderator actions must be made via PM. Posting within the thread is against the rules.
Secondly, it seems there is still some disconnect on the guidelines and rules. You can quote scripture. But you seem to be arguing from the point of view that scripture should be accepted as authoritative and that the problem is with those who do not accept this. However, even those of us who are Christian are obliged by the rules not to debate as if the Bible is authoritative in this forum, the Christianity and Apologetics forum.
You could debate by qualifying your statements with phrases like "if we assume the Bible is true" or "under this particular interpretation, it follows that . . . " However, if you make positive claims you cannot expect the Bible to be considered the sole evidence to support that claim, at least in this forum.
Because of the nature of the debate and the opening post, I am moving this thread to the Theology Forum.
" . . . the line separating good and evil passes, not through states, nor between classes, nor between political parties either, but right through every human heart . . . ." Alexander Solzhenitsyn
Post #76
I find that difficult to believe too!Flail wrote:The bible can contain as many 'mysteries' as one would desire to conjure. It is a mystery to me how anyone can find a God in printed words taken from ancient hearsay legends.
Post #77
Again. I did not challenge the moderator I only asked the Moderator why did he not read my whole post. I made reference to the Constitution of the Zodiac in my second paragraph which is the scriptures in the heavens; but for some reason this paragraph is still being ignored.
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Jester
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Post #78
Moderator Comment
Responding to a moderator comment with anything other than an apology and/or promise to do better is against the rules. This includes asking questions.
If you feel there was a problem with a moderator comment, send a private message, it is not difficult, and is also the only way your question will be considered.
Responding publicly to this post - or any other moderator comment is very likely to get you placed on probation then, if it continues, banned from the site.
To clarify, then:Benoni wrote:Again. I did not challenge the moderator I only asked the Moderator why did he not read my whole post. I made reference to the Constitution of the Zodiac in my second paragraph which is the scriptures in the heavens; but for some reason this paragraph is still being ignored.
Responding to a moderator comment with anything other than an apology and/or promise to do better is against the rules. This includes asking questions.
If you feel there was a problem with a moderator comment, send a private message, it is not difficult, and is also the only way your question will be considered.
Responding publicly to this post - or any other moderator comment is very likely to get you placed on probation then, if it continues, banned from the site.
We must continually ask ourselves whether victory has become more central to our goals than truth.
Post #79
He Hide His Word in the Stars.
In the first chapter of the Bible we read, "And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: He made the stars also" (Gen. 1:16). Again, "And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years' (Gen. 1:14). Of the four things set before us in this verse did not one of them seem strangely out of place? Some one is asking, "What four?" Notice again: "...and let them be for SIGNS, and for SEASONS, and for DAYS, and YEARS." Does one of them seem out of place? It would be obvious to everyone with even an elementary knowledge of astronomy that the heavenly bodies have a great deal to say about our YEARS, our DAYS and our SEASONS. But what about the relationship of the celestial bodies to that word SIGNS? How are they SIGNS? What is a SIGN? Perhaps the best way to answer our question is by answering another question first. What precisely is the purpose of a "sign"? Is it not to bear a message? To give information? To tell a story which is of importance to the one who put up the sign? If so, then let us observe that this verse is saying that God placed the sun, moon, and stars in the heavens to tell a story, to declare a word of utmost importance.
The word for "signs" as found in Gen. 1:14 is OTH in the Hebrew. A sign is a mark to indicate something greater than the mark itself. Musical notes are symbols, or signs, to the pianist sitting at his instrument. If the pianist interprets the notes together in proper sequence, then the audience hears what the creator of the music intended when he wrote the composition. Likewise, the heavens are signs, as notes on a sheet of music. If we interpret the signs in the heavens correctly, then we can understand and appreciate the symphony of God's creation from the beginning to the end. Signs in the heavens can also be compared to notes of music in another way. As the pianist plays a concerto, the music, like a constant revelation, is heard in its proper sequence. Similarly, "signs" in Gen. 1:14 mean that the heavens are the unfurling of God's revelation to man. In other words, the heavens tell the story of things to come--they PROPHESY
In the first chapter of the Bible we read, "And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: He made the stars also" (Gen. 1:16). Again, "And God said, Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days, and years' (Gen. 1:14). Of the four things set before us in this verse did not one of them seem strangely out of place? Some one is asking, "What four?" Notice again: "...and let them be for SIGNS, and for SEASONS, and for DAYS, and YEARS." Does one of them seem out of place? It would be obvious to everyone with even an elementary knowledge of astronomy that the heavenly bodies have a great deal to say about our YEARS, our DAYS and our SEASONS. But what about the relationship of the celestial bodies to that word SIGNS? How are they SIGNS? What is a SIGN? Perhaps the best way to answer our question is by answering another question first. What precisely is the purpose of a "sign"? Is it not to bear a message? To give information? To tell a story which is of importance to the one who put up the sign? If so, then let us observe that this verse is saying that God placed the sun, moon, and stars in the heavens to tell a story, to declare a word of utmost importance.
The word for "signs" as found in Gen. 1:14 is OTH in the Hebrew. A sign is a mark to indicate something greater than the mark itself. Musical notes are symbols, or signs, to the pianist sitting at his instrument. If the pianist interprets the notes together in proper sequence, then the audience hears what the creator of the music intended when he wrote the composition. Likewise, the heavens are signs, as notes on a sheet of music. If we interpret the signs in the heavens correctly, then we can understand and appreciate the symphony of God's creation from the beginning to the end. Signs in the heavens can also be compared to notes of music in another way. As the pianist plays a concerto, the music, like a constant revelation, is heard in its proper sequence. Similarly, "signs" in Gen. 1:14 mean that the heavens are the unfurling of God's revelation to man. In other words, the heavens tell the story of things to come--they PROPHESY
