"What are you going to say if your God Father (an Episcopal priest) asks 'do you believe in God?'" said my mother.
"In short... no." I responded.
Thus began the whirlwind of drama that I now find myself in.
Questions:
How did it take place for you?
What were the reactions from family members?
What were the concerns they had, and how did you respond to them?
I am recently engaged to a fantastic girl. She was raised in the church and continues to feel comfortable on her current path with Christianity. She and I have talked to great lengths and respect one another, and more importantly, love one another for who we are. That being said, the following is an excerpt from an email from my father regarding my mother and this "new" news:
"She isn't sleeping well. Extremely concerned. Just as I stated, very worried that R and D can and will exert a tremendous amount of pressure on E should they find out you now proclaim yourself to be an atheist.
Again as I told you...I don't understand why one has to have "hard" proof one way or the other in order to proclaim I'm this or that. For me, my religious beliefs are very private. I believe there is some higher order that provides a form of discipline that leads me to be a better person in life. Is it a God....do I know for sure...no. Do I want to think there is a God??? For me, yes.
In my opinion, you get focused on something and you research and read to come up with a "definitive" answer...almost to the point of being obsessive/compulsive. For me, I don't feel the need or compulsion to have a definitive answer. I believe there are and can be "mysteries of life."
You need to get with a spirtual advisor/marriage counselor ASAP. This is and will be a problem going forward. Your mom and I realize we can't change what you believe and I don't think I am capable nor educated enough to change what you believe or should believe. That is up to the individual. I have a lot of "grey" areas in my life....everything doesn't have to be black and white as it is with you. I don't have answers for everything nor do I have to look for answers for everything. As the old trite saying goes....shit happens.
There are things that I share with people and then there are things that are better left unsaid. Know when to share and when not to share thoughts/feelings make life a lot easier to get through.
That's my two cents worth. Mom is headed back this afternoon so you need to decide how you work through this. This is a mess that you have opened up and I think you have huge areas of vulnerability with E, your friends and your future in-laws.
Good luck!"
I already have a pretty good idea in regards to a response, but this whole ordeal had me interested in what you all might have been through on this journey.
Being honest with family
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sirjacksonpeaks
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McCulloch
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Post #2
What were you thinking? This is the kind of question which in certain circumstances deserves honest evasion.sirjacksonpeaks wrote: "In short... no." I responded.
How about "I'm not sure that I even know what the word god means anymore" ?
Or "Look at that [something noteworthy going by]!"
Anyway the damage is done. The nice theists in your life know that you don't believe.
At this point I agree with your future in-laws. You and your fiancée should seek counseling. If her religion is an important thing in her life, then she owes it to herself to seek a life-partner that shares the essentials of her values and beliefs with her. If her religion is not, then her church-going is a hypocrisy and a sham. What if she later awakens to the divine truth? What about the kids?
Examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good.
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
Post #3
I'm confused, what precisely is sleep being lost over? I assume she knew you were an atheist already from your opening paragraph and I don't know how she would know about the exchange with your mother unless your parents told her or you did. Is she upset that others might find out who you are and what you believe?
This is one of those times I am going to have to disagree with McCulloch. If you have talked things over before, she does respect you for who you are, loves you for who you are, I don't see a therapist, and most certainly not a spiritual advisor as helpful. Sounds to me like she already made her choice, that she would be with you even though you did not share her faith. As it appears to me, she is a Christian but it is not an all consuming force in her life. I do not think that religion has to be the dominant force driving an individual for the faith to be legitimate.
To me, I don't understand this idea that atheists have to be ashamed of their (lack of) faith, to pack it away from others because they might not understand or might disagree. I'm not saying they should go looking to start fights over it but hiding in the closet is no solution either. You have to be who you are. You said it yourself, she loves you for who you are. If she loves you for who you are, I can't imagine she wants you to not be who you are or act like someone else.
Best case scenario, he never asks. If he does you have three options, tell the truth, lie, or divert. I dislike lying so I am going to remove that from the table here and now. You can tell the truth, it might be difficult but I don't see how putting things off is necessarily better. Will the pressure and damage be less if he hears about it a month from now? A year? When you already have children? You could divert, and I will give some pointers on carefully constructed sentences below, but then you just live with it hanging over your head until he either finds out or dies, whichever happens first.
If you must divert though, I recommend something along these lines:
"Now tell me son, are you a Christian?"
"The teachings of Christ are an important part of my life. Love, forgiveness, and charity are all cornerstones of my belief. Could you imagine a world where those values and the word of Christ were rejected? I can't."
Empahsis on the teachings of Christ instead of faith and whatnot allows you to be technically honest, though deceptive, and still say more or less what everyone wants to hear. Me though, I think honesty is better.
This is one of those times I am going to have to disagree with McCulloch. If you have talked things over before, she does respect you for who you are, loves you for who you are, I don't see a therapist, and most certainly not a spiritual advisor as helpful. Sounds to me like she already made her choice, that she would be with you even though you did not share her faith. As it appears to me, she is a Christian but it is not an all consuming force in her life. I do not think that religion has to be the dominant force driving an individual for the faith to be legitimate.
To me, I don't understand this idea that atheists have to be ashamed of their (lack of) faith, to pack it away from others because they might not understand or might disagree. I'm not saying they should go looking to start fights over it but hiding in the closet is no solution either. You have to be who you are. You said it yourself, she loves you for who you are. If she loves you for who you are, I can't imagine she wants you to not be who you are or act like someone else.
Best case scenario, he never asks. If he does you have three options, tell the truth, lie, or divert. I dislike lying so I am going to remove that from the table here and now. You can tell the truth, it might be difficult but I don't see how putting things off is necessarily better. Will the pressure and damage be less if he hears about it a month from now? A year? When you already have children? You could divert, and I will give some pointers on carefully constructed sentences below, but then you just live with it hanging over your head until he either finds out or dies, whichever happens first.
If you must divert though, I recommend something along these lines:
"Now tell me son, are you a Christian?"
"The teachings of Christ are an important part of my life. Love, forgiveness, and charity are all cornerstones of my belief. Could you imagine a world where those values and the word of Christ were rejected? I can't."
Empahsis on the teachings of Christ instead of faith and whatnot allows you to be technically honest, though deceptive, and still say more or less what everyone wants to hear. Me though, I think honesty is better.
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sirjacksonpeaks
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Post #4
To those that have posted above, thank you for taking the time to chime in on this. It appears I need to be a little more clear in the current scenario.
The quoted email was from MY father, regarding the issues MY mother currently has with MY beliefs (or lack thereof). I am engaged to marry a great girl, we will call her E. Her parents, R and D, are good people, but also pretty closed off in their own beliefs (almost fundamental).
The original question that my mother posed to me was done because my God Father is an Episcopal priest and will be the Officiant for our wedding. In order for him to have permission from the church, we must complete premarital instruction as a couple with him or another priest. I honestly don't have an issue with this because I'm pretty comfortable in what I believe and why. I know it is important not only to my family and E's family, but to E herself, that we have a priest as our Officiant.
In reply to McCulloch: What was I thinking? I was thinking that I am not ashamed of how I feel and so would rather be honest than lie or evade. Obviously, certain situations might call for a different response, I did not feel this to be one of those times. My God Father is very aware of where I am in my beliefs (I guess to the shock of my mother) as he has pointed me in the direction of studies, books, essays, passages, and has even had lengthy conversations with me in order to help me grow... no matter what direction that growth takes me.
My fiance, E, and myself have talked at length on the subject. Though she still doesn't "get it" she is trying to understand why I am where I am. We both made sure prior to getting engaged that this was an issue that we could learn from one another on, and not allow it to be a wedge between us.
The point of my initial post was: 1. how did your family react when they finally realized where you stand? 2. what has changed since then? 3. Do you have any advice for those of us that are just now entering this family scenario?
I agree with Abraxas... I also do not understand why Atheists (or anyone) should have to be ashamed for what they believe or do not believe. It is a belief, it is an opinion... we have our own reasons for having such.
Abraxas: My mother is apparently losing sleep because she is afraid that this "lack of belief" will somehow cause my future in-laws to apply pressure to E to end our relationship. E and I both disagree completely with this idea, and don't believe this issue will blow up into something as severe as my mother fears. In all honesty, I believe my mother is simply shocked, scared, worried she failed as a parent, among other emotions. A lot of people tend to be afraid of things they don't understand... I think this is one of those cases.
Thanks to all.
The quoted email was from MY father, regarding the issues MY mother currently has with MY beliefs (or lack thereof). I am engaged to marry a great girl, we will call her E. Her parents, R and D, are good people, but also pretty closed off in their own beliefs (almost fundamental).
The original question that my mother posed to me was done because my God Father is an Episcopal priest and will be the Officiant for our wedding. In order for him to have permission from the church, we must complete premarital instruction as a couple with him or another priest. I honestly don't have an issue with this because I'm pretty comfortable in what I believe and why. I know it is important not only to my family and E's family, but to E herself, that we have a priest as our Officiant.
In reply to McCulloch: What was I thinking? I was thinking that I am not ashamed of how I feel and so would rather be honest than lie or evade. Obviously, certain situations might call for a different response, I did not feel this to be one of those times. My God Father is very aware of where I am in my beliefs (I guess to the shock of my mother) as he has pointed me in the direction of studies, books, essays, passages, and has even had lengthy conversations with me in order to help me grow... no matter what direction that growth takes me.
My fiance, E, and myself have talked at length on the subject. Though she still doesn't "get it" she is trying to understand why I am where I am. We both made sure prior to getting engaged that this was an issue that we could learn from one another on, and not allow it to be a wedge between us.
The point of my initial post was: 1. how did your family react when they finally realized where you stand? 2. what has changed since then? 3. Do you have any advice for those of us that are just now entering this family scenario?
I agree with Abraxas... I also do not understand why Atheists (or anyone) should have to be ashamed for what they believe or do not believe. It is a belief, it is an opinion... we have our own reasons for having such.
Abraxas: My mother is apparently losing sleep because she is afraid that this "lack of belief" will somehow cause my future in-laws to apply pressure to E to end our relationship. E and I both disagree completely with this idea, and don't believe this issue will blow up into something as severe as my mother fears. In all honesty, I believe my mother is simply shocked, scared, worried she failed as a parent, among other emotions. A lot of people tend to be afraid of things they don't understand... I think this is one of those cases.
Thanks to all.
