Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 ... 22, 23, 24  Next

Reply to topic
logical thinking
First Post
PostPosted: Wed Jul 06, 2016 12:33 pm  Why do you believe in God? Reply with quote

Why do you believe in God?

What specific argument or evidence is it, that persuades you?

Can you please outline the argument or piece of evidence that you believe is the STRONGEST reason to believe in God?

For example, is it the beauty and majesty of trees? Is it the Kalam Cosmological argument? Pascal's wager? Is it that you witnessed what you believe is a miracle? Is it the fact that you think the Bible contains prophecies? Is it because it feels good to believe in something greater than yourself?

Why do you believe in God?
Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 41: Thu Jul 07, 2016 12:31 pm
Reply
Re: Why do you believe in God?

Like this post
logical thinking wrote:

Why do you believe in God?


HE talked to me, somehow. It was words and sometimes conversion but the how was unclear though the meaning was clear. A knowledge that if GOD was talking to me it was exactly what HE wanted me to hear.

The difference between hearing HIM and my own thoughts in my head was that I learned new stuff I would never have thought up myself.

The most important thing was that as I was "becoming" you might say, a Christian, I knew I was a fake Christian loving sin and so I prayed daily throughout each day for a year to be given a repentant heart. It ended with a massive and overwhelming experience, an understanding with huuuuge emotional content, of my guilt and how much suffering I had caused everyone around me. I came to believe this guilt killed me spiritually and then I was reborn and life carried on as the weight and feelings of all consuming sorrow of guilt slowly lifted over the months until I realised I had a strength and a bit of new natural(?) way to not be so cruel, hateful nor as much a user.

That cemented it. I have never been the same and thank GOD for that! I'm certainly no Dalai Lama or even saintly but I am a new person who is getting better. This is my witness and why I accept that the Spirit who did this for me is YHWH....no one else was around at this time.

It has little value to anyone else of course so I don't talk about it much.

Goto top, bottom
View user's profile 
Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 42: Thu Jul 07, 2016 12:37 pm
Reply
Re: Why do you believe in God?

Like this post
JLB32168 wrote:

RonE wrote:
Please provide a list of a few of these miracles "that occurred that cannot be scientifically/naturally explained".
Okay
Fr. Dimitrios Moraitis of St. Paraskevi Greek Orthodox Shrine Church in Greenlawn, NY shared his personal experience of a blind man being miraculously healed in 1990.
In the 1980's, Father Dorotheos was acquainted with the abbot of a small skete on Mount Athos near Karelia where there is a church dedicated to St. Nicholas; however, on the feastday there was no fish, and the monks were left with only beans and bread for the celebration. The abbot prayed and asked forgiveness and two hours later a man brought a bag of fish into the monastery after being told by a man to take them to the monastery. He pointed to the icon saying that the figure in it was the one who told him to take it.
Dr. Sean Thomas George was proclaimed dead after one hour and 10 minutes. Ten minutes after all attempts of resuscitation that stopped, his wife came and prayed for his life to be restored, which it was and w/o any brain damage.
Archbishop Dmitri Royster of Dallas’ unembalmed body was exhumed after being dead for four years to be interred in a crypt that was contributed to the Cathedral that he built. His body smelled of incense and was incorrupt in spite of the casket having been breached by water and filled.
St. Herman of Alaska stopped a tsunami from inundating the village of Sitka by running to the beach w/an icon of the Madonna and Child. The wave did not pass the icon but stopped at a line before it.
What makes a source “credible?” I have a feeling that no source that attests to a miraculous event will be regarded as credible.

My grandma used to have a limp, but then she prayed to Allah and the limp was gone!

My friend's neighbor died in a car crash, but then his cousin prayed to Zeus, and he came back to life!

My high school teacher's boyfriend's cousin was abducted by aliens and they probed him anally. When they brought him back to earth, he was able to read minds!!!!

My mailman's second cousin's dentist once had a cat who could talk, and the cat said that Mitrah is the only one true God! It must be true, because usually cats don't talk, so the only explanation for the fact that this one could talk, has to be that Mitrah is real!

Now that we've both gotten out of our system the desire to make everybody laugh with our absurd fictional stories, can we please go back to the topic at hand, and discuss any actual evidence for actual miracles that actually happened?

No? All you got is silly stories about alien abductions and men who magically bring bags of fish to monks?

Goto top, bottom
View user's profile 
Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 43: Thu Jul 07, 2016 12:42 pm
Reply
Re: Why do you believe in God?

Like this post
JLB32168 wrote:

RonE wrote:
If all you've got is personal testimony, as in the cases you cite, I would agree. There is nothing here for science to examine, so I'd say it is not that science cannot explain these events, it is that you've presented nothing for science to even comment on. Even in this forum personal testimony is not considered evidence.
Okay – so once we exclude all evidence that cannot be explained scientifically, there’s no evidence for miracles – which are by definition events that cannot explained scientifically.

I would win every argument I made on this board if I excluded all evidence contra my argument.

What are you talking about? We are not excluding evidence that cannot be explained scientifically!

The evidence you provided can be EASILY explained scientifically, like this: PEOPLE TEND TO MAKE STUFF UP.

There you go. Perfectly simple and easy scientific explanation for bigfoot, alien abductions, bleeding statues of the virgin mary, men bringing fish to monks, flying zombies and other silly fairy tales.


Can you please explain why we should exclude the simplest most obvious explanations ever, for silly fairy tales? Somebody made it up. Why should we ignore that obvious answer to your question?

Goto top, bottom
View user's profile 
Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 44: Thu Jul 07, 2016 12:46 pm
Reply
Re: Why do you believe in God?

Like this post
[quote="JLB32168"]
Zzyzx wrote:
Those are excellent STORIES. Can they be verified as being true and accurate?
How does one verify as being true and accurate, “I was blind. Now I’m not?” [quote]You test with a flashlight and other medical tools if somebody is blind. If the results are verified positive before, and verified negative after, you've proven that somebody was cured of their blindness.

Considering that there are about a dozen perfectly normal medical reasons for temporary blindness, I wouldn't get my panties in a bunch over that.

Quote:
How does one verify today an event that was written down in the 18th Century?
You asses the reliability of the documents ascertaining the veracity of the narrated event.

Quote:
None of this can be done; therefore, they’re hoaxes – right? [eyeroll]
Well, yeah. Why are you rolling your eyes?

Why do you not believe my unverified claim that I can move small objects with my mind?

It's probably for the same reason I am not impressed by your story of the guy bringing fish to the monks.

Goto top, bottom
View user's profile 
Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 45: Thu Jul 07, 2016 12:47 pm
Reply
Re: Why do you believe in God?

Like this post
ttruscott wrote:

logical thinking wrote:

Why do you believe in God?


HE talked to me, somehow. It was words and sometimes conversion but the how was unclear though the meaning was clear. A knowledge that if GOD was talking to me it was exactly what HE wanted me to hear.

The difference between hearing HIM and my own thoughts in my head was that I learned new stuff I would never have thought up myself.
What did you learn?

Goto top, bottom
View user's profile 
Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 46: Thu Jul 07, 2016 1:05 pm
Reply
Re: Why do you believe in God?

Like this post
logical thinking wrote:

Why do you believe in God?

What specific argument or evidence is it, that persuades you?

Can you please outline the argument or piece of evidence that you believe is the STRONGEST reason to believe in God?

For example, is it the beauty and majesty of trees? Is it the Kalam Cosmological argument? Pascal's wager? Is it that you witnessed what you believe is a miracle? Is it the fact that you think the Bible contains prophecies? Is it because it feels good to believe in something greater than yourself?

Why do you believe in God?


When people encounter a question for which there is no immediate or obvious answer, there is a tendency to make up an answer that they find appealing, and then to declare the question answered. Others however prefer to seek for the actual answer, even though the actual answer may be too big or too complex to be answered all at once. Many a curious investigator has passed on not knowing the entire answer to the puzzle, but having themselves contributed a piece to the puzzle.

And, no we do not yet possess all of the pieces to the puzzle. But we do have enough in place to determine that the answer to the puzzle probably has very little in common with any answer that was simply made up and declared to be true. Which really should come as no surprise to anyone. And yet many still find the possibility that their particular made up answer is not true to be unthinkable. One reason for this of course is that the actual answer is so complex, the number of it's pieces so vast, that it is very difficult for everyone to comprehend. Which makes the simplicity of the comforting made up answer more appealing and easier to cling to.

Goto top, bottom
View user's profile 
Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 47: Thu Jul 07, 2016 2:06 pm
Reply
Re: Why do you believe in God?

Like this post
[Replying to post 6 by RonE], [Replying to post 21 by marco], [Replying to post 33 by logical thinking]

RonE wrote:

I'm curious what "great knowledge and wisdom" you think we would not have but via the bible? Examples?


logical thinking wrote:

Can you give me an example f knowledge in the Bible that could have only come from God?


First I want to say, you don’t have to agree that Bible has great wisdom and knowledge. That is anyway subjective opinion. I just answered to the opening question why I believe. If you have read the Bible and don’t see the wisdom and knowledge, there is not much that I can do to change your opinion.

But still, here are few things that I meant with great wisdom and knowledge and reasons why I think it is great book.

1. Knew impressively what will happen to Jews long before the thing has begun. Bible says Jews will be scattered and later gathered back, as we may nowadays see happening.

I will scatter you among the nations, and I will draw out the sword after you: and your land will be a desolation, and your cities shall be a waste.
Leviticus 26:33

…then Yahweh your God will turn your captivity, and have compassion on you, and will return and gather you from all the peoples, where Yahweh your God has scattered you. If any of your outcasts are in the uttermost parts of the heavens, from there will Yahweh your God gather you, and from there will he bring you back:
Deuteronomy 30:1-4

2. Knowledge about the great flood and how it happened. Best explanation for why for example continents, oil fields, certain fossils, ancient coast lines, orogenic mountains exist as we can observe.

http://www.kolumbus.fi/r.berg/index_eng.html

3. But I tell you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who mistreat you and persecute you, that you may be children of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the just and the unjust.
Mat. 5:44-45

4. Is allegedly book written by Jews and still paint picture that tells also the bad things about them not only good as usually people do.

5. And maybe the greatest thing is how by examples Bible tells how things go, if for example person does something wrong. In my opinion the great teachings are not always simple lines, but longer story that tells truth about humans. For me Bible has been great teacher and helped me to cope with many situations and helped me to understand many things also about myself. But obviously you could say that any book could do the same. I don’t believe that.

6. Bible seems to be the most hated book in the world. That also tells in my opinion that it has something truthful in it that some people don’t want to accept. If it would be just ordinary book, people would not care about it so much.

7. Bible has promises that I feel has come true. For example Bible promises wisdom for everyone that asks it. Of course you could say that I have no wisdom, or that I would have it anyway. However, I believe things go just as the Bible tells.

But if any of you lacks wisdom, let him ask of God, who gives to all liberally and without reproach; and it will be given to him.
James 1:5

8. And I think it has been correct about future and people also in this:

But know this, that in the last days, grievous times will come. For men will be lovers of self, lovers of money, boastful, arrogant, blasphemers, disobedient to parents, unthankful, unholy, without natural affection, unforgiving, slanderers, without self-control, fierce, no lovers of good, traitors, headstrong, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God; holding a form of godliness, but having denied the power thereof. Turn away from these, also.
2 Tim. 3:1-5

Goto top, bottom
View user's profile Visit poster's website 
Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 48: Thu Jul 07, 2016 2:07 pm
Reply
Re: Why do you believe in God?

Like this post
Justin108 wrote:

1213 wrote:

For me Bible is the greatest reason to believe. And that is because it has great knowledge and wisdom that I think people would not have without God.

In order to call something "great knowledge", you must first demonstrate that it is in fact knowledge (i.e that it is in fact true)

Name one piece of knowledge or wisdom in the Bible that would not exist if the Bible was never written?


I think this would not exist without Bible:

But I tell you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who mistreat you and persecute you, that you may be children of your Father who is in heaven. For he makes his sun to rise on the evil and the good, and sends rain on the just and the unjust.
Mat. 5:44-45

Goto top, bottom
View user's profile Visit poster's website 
Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 49: Thu Jul 07, 2016 4:41 pm
Reply

Like this post
logical thinking wrote:
You're absolutely right! The idea that God simply happened or always existed, without any form of intelligent direction, is an absurd idea.
What makes it absurd? Most modern scientists believe that “the singularity” always existed w/o beginning and that matter/energy will have no end. I’ve got a strange feeling that you’re response will be a simple, facile dismissal of “well that’s different.”

logical thinking wrote:
Me: Evolution selects for traits that help the species. Religions, specifically Christianity, teach us to care of the sick. No other species does that.
Thee: AAAAAAAAAAAHHHHH the ignorance! It hurts so much!
You mock rather than rebut. That’s an argumentum ad ridiculum and you’ve produced one source who says that compassion among the primates exists. I’ll grant you that but what other species of animal shows empathy or compassion and if primate’s intrinsically possessed those traits then why would they create religions that teach the practice of the virtues as the way to heaven?

logical thinking wrote:
Yes, religion is totally useless, I agree.
Why did man create them, since he already possesses compassion and empathy, if they serve no biological purpose?

logical thinking wrote:
Miracles that HAPPEN may or may not be an interesting piece of evidence.
The OP asked for one argument for why people believe in God. I countered that no one bases their belief in God upon one thing but upon several – one of those being miracles. Whether or not you find it interesting is irrelevant to the question.

logical thinking wrote:
But miracles that didn't actually happen, and instead are just SAID to have happened by ignorant superstitious people, fall squarely under the category of make-believe.
And had it been proved that these alleged miracles were really just fabrications then your point would have merit. As it stands, they’re only make-believe fairy-tales if they didn’t occur and you can’t prove your assertion. I of course don’t have to prove anything because I’ve not asserted anything (which really pisses some of you off since I rarely have to concede anything to you.)

logical thinking wrote:
Can you point to a single miracle that actually happened?
I listed several that occurred recently. One doctor said he was blind and then he said he wasn’t and that example was summarily dismissed because miracles don’t happen [eyeroll]
logical thinking wrote:
No buddy. there are no miracles. It's all make believe.
Hey [shrug] . . . you’re entitled to your opinion.

Goto top, bottom
Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 50: Thu Jul 07, 2016 4:56 pm
Reply

Like this post
[Replying to JLB32168]

A singularity is easy...
You know that photons (light particles) pass through each other without interacting. An infinite number of photons can pass through the same place at the same time and not interact.

Photons are bosons, and bosons have this property that they can be in the same place at the same time.
So, there are these things called Z bosons, that have mass. So, if you get enough massive bosons together, gravity forces them into a single point or singularity.

Cool, huh?

Goto top, bottom
View user's profile 
Display posts from previous:   

Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 ... 22, 23, 24  Next

Jump to:  
Facebook
Tweet

 




On The Web | Ecodia | Hymn Lyrics Apps
Facebook | Twitter

Powered by phpBB © phpBB Group.   Produced by Ecodia.

Igloo   |  Lo-Fi Version