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Andre_5772
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 15, 2008 9:10 pm  Morality of Suicide Reply with quote

For quite some time, I have been of the opinion that suicide is always immoral. This intuition arises out of my awe at how complicated and delicate the human body is, yet how elegantly all these systems work together, for the most part.

However I read something the other day which was to the effect of, "Life is for learning and growing, not for suffering through." I have to admit that this makes a lot of sense to me, too. But this leads to the possibility that at times suicide is justified. Specifically, when one can reasonably expect an excess of suffering in the future, and this condition will prevent any significant growth as a person, contribution to society, or whatever that person finds meaningful.

When I thought about this further, I realized that I probably wouldn't begrudge someone who committed suicide, provided they had rationally come to the conclusion that these criteria were satisfied. While I would never advise suicide, I think my view has changed to the point where I can accept it in certain circumstances without condemning it. I'm wondering what others think about the morality of suicide. Is it on par with murder because it ends a human life? Or is it a different act because rational beings are free to choose death for themselves although not for others?
Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 81: Sat Aug 24, 2013 8:42 pm
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Re: Morality of Suicide

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Andre_5772 wrote:

For quite some time, I have been of the opinion that suicide is always immoral. This intuition arises out of my awe at how complicated and delicate the human body is, yet how elegantly all these systems work together, for the most part.

However I read something the other day which was to the effect of, "Life is for learning and growing, not for suffering through." I have to admit that this makes a lot of sense to me, too. But this leads to the possibility that at times suicide is justified. Specifically, when one can reasonably expect an excess of suffering in the future, and this condition will prevent any significant growth as a person, contribution to society, or whatever that person finds meaningful.

When I thought about this further, I realized that I probably wouldn't begrudge someone who committed suicide, provided they had rationally come to the conclusion that these criteria were satisfied. While I would never advise suicide, I think my view has changed to the point where I can accept it in certain circumstances without condemning it. I'm wondering what others think about the morality of suicide. Is it on par with murder because it ends a human life? Or is it a different act because rational beings are free to choose death for themselves although not for others?


Honestly, what does it matter? Why do we care if suicide is morally justified? What good is justification when you're dead? So we can judge the person who commits it? So that we can say that he or she will be damned to hell for doing it? What is the purpose of knowing the answer to this question? Is it so that you can justify your own thoughts of suicide? People do what they have to do. That's it. Some people don't want to live. It's their choice. Trying to decide whether or not what they've done is justifiable is useless speculation, unless it applies to you.

Do the dead care if they are justified by men? Do the dead care if they are forgiven by mere men?

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 82: Sat Aug 24, 2013 8:49 pm
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Fallibleone wrote:

ChristianGuy wrote:
Well, as an atheist you are not going to like my response, but you just have to trust God. No matter what the situation is.


I guess that I would find it hard to trust in a being who feels it would be better for my children to watch me slowly and painfully deteriorate into a senseless vegetable who needs to be fed through a tube than to have to come to terms with my absence, but remember me as a functioning human being who knew who they were.


You don't have to be fed through a tube. Let me rephrase this into a question. Is it suicide to refuse to be fed through a tube, if you are incapable of eating through your mouth?

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 83: Sat Sep 12, 2015 3:15 pm
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Suicide is a personal choice, if not induced. When it is, it's homicide.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 84: Sat Jan 14, 2017 9:30 am
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Mask of the Devil wrote:

Suicide is a personal choice, if not induced. When it is, it's homicide.



That seems a bit oversimplified. If person x (or group x) is torturing someone (mentally or physically) when is that line crossed? There are several naturally occurring phenomena (certain toxins in flora and fauna) that almost always cause a person to commit suicide. The anguish is unbearable. Most people call such instances "suicide," but they grasp the reality of it being something much different than "normal" suicide. The toxin/torture caused the death as surely as the person himself.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 85: Sun May 21, 2017 9:55 pm
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Suicide is never ok. That doesn't mean I don't understand why a person might do so, but no, it is never ok.

Most people who think there might be situations where suicide is acceptable do not IMO understand man's purpose or the meaning of suffering.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 86: Sun May 21, 2017 10:40 pm
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Rather in Heaven than living under Satan and for Satan...

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I think the Golden Rule supports suicide if it's done under justifiable circumstances.

If life is unbearable then suicide should be ok. Perhaps one has the duty to flag one's situation first so that the good people can have a chance to amend your situation. That should be fair.

Conclusion: I'd rather see a person who has committed suicide in Heaven than serving Satan on Earth. If the sanity/soul is threatened then suicide is fine! Golden Rule, that is, as well as 10.(?) Command: Respect your neighbour etc. so that they are allowed to go if situation requires it!

PS: I agree that induced suicide is a kind of homicide!

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 87: Mon May 22, 2017 7:38 am
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Re: Rather in Heaven than living under Satan and for Satan..

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[Replying to post 86 by Aetixintro]

What is unbearable? Many people have had to endure what a great many of us would consider 'unbearable' and yet they do because well quite frankly anything if you really think about it is bearable -- that is until it's not and results in psychical death.

"Conclusion: I'd rather see a person who has committed suicide in Heaven than serving Satan on Earth. If the sanity/soul is threatened then suicide is fine!"

If the person was serving Satan on Earth, you will not see them in heaven. And insanity or mental illness is not a sin. Are you saying it would be better off if those among us who suffer from mental illness/depression/even psychotic tendencies were encouraged to kill themselves?

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 88: Mon May 22, 2017 7:45 am
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RightReason wrote:
Suicide is never ok.


Thank you for unsupported opinion on this matter. I know some people who have a painful terminal illness who disagree with you. I hope that you are never in their situation, but if you are, I hope that you would be allowed to choose your own end.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 89: Mon May 22, 2017 7:55 am
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[Replying to McCulloch]

I know some people who have a painful terminal illness who disagree with YOU. I too hope you are never in a similar situation. If I ever am, I pray that I will have the strength and hope to endure until the end offering up my pain and suffering for others.

IMO, suicide sends the message that human beings are only of value if we are strong and healthy.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 90: Mon May 22, 2017 9:27 am
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I have no problem with those who choose to endure to the bitter end. If unnecessary pain and suffering is what they want, I won't object to their choice. So long as it is their choice. If your religious philosophy teaches that your pain and suffering is somehow an offering for others, then hey, knock yourself out (not literally because that would defeat the purpose).

But it should be a matter of choice. It is not immoral for someone who does not share your massocistic philosophy to be allowed to choose when and how to end their suffering. I'm not saying that a healthy life is worth more than an unhealthy life. I'm saying that we all should be allowed to determine when our lives are not worth living anymore.

Where do you draw the line? Isn't a DNR (do not resuscitate) ethically the same as suicide?

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