If god was female?

[JJ50]

If god had been created as a female by the authors of the Bible instead of a male, would women have been treated very differently over the centuries? In my opinion, god was only given the male gender because in the ancient world men were considered to be superior to the female. If any god does exist it is more likely to be genderless.

Women featured in the Bible aren't treated well on the whole, but as reproductive machines for the most part.  Solomon's many concubines obviously played a big part in keeping his dangly bits busy! Did they do it willingly, or more likely did they have no say in the matter? Whilst most Christian women these days demand to be treated as equal to men, more extreme male members of the faith still expect them to be subservient to their wishes using the Bible as an excuse.

There is very little woman can't do that men can, and visa versa. You never know, one day men might evolve enough to become pregnant!

Is there anyone on this forum who thinks men and women should stay trapped in the traditional roles society and religion had placed upon them?

[JoeyKnothead]

From the OP:

If God was female

Adam ate the apple.

Added commentary should some folks think I done did me a one liner, when really, the most vociferous voices against it are them religious folks who think they know what it is a god they can't show exists to have him an opinion on it, has him one on it. That they can't show she does.

[William]

[Replying to William]

You raised some interesting questions.

I think the subject is very interesting.

I view everything as in a constant state of flux. You can't put your foot in the same stream twice, and no th8inker thinks twice. The "self" is really an illusion. In point of fact, it is a name for a society of perishing occasions or selves. As I said before, moment to moment, we are new persons, if not for the fact you are I are one moment wiser. That does not mean there is no consistency, no carry-over. There is. A personality is a synthesis of both consistency and change. For example, I have been a lifelong train buff. However, now that I am part of teh operations crew for a real steam locom0otive, I'm a very different buff than I was, say, 20 years ago, before I had any hands-on experience with a real locomotive. The same holds for God. There is an absolute side to God, what God always does, that God is always loving, empathic, creative, etc. But there is God in the concrete, as a concrete personality, which is God as continually changing. Why? God is continually responding to an ever-changing world; and the world is ever-changing because God is eternally creative, always introducing new creative possibilities for both our and his or her own self-actualization.

I have no particular problem with this notion at all. You are using human experience in order to explain god experience.
I see human experience as god experience and do not differenciate.

It terms of learning etc, I see the Earth Entity (EE) as being the local 'god experience' in which the critters created on the planet are not only outward expressions of creative ability and finely honed for that, but these forms are purposefully made and act as a means for the EE to continue that creativity through the forms by incarnating aspects of [Her] consciousness into those forms, giving life to those forms, just as She gave life to that planet form, by being that life, within said forms. (no differentiation)
The process is indeed one which shows how a GOD does indeed ever change and evolve.

I may have confused you about the "group mind." By "group mind," I mean the idea that, say a group of people, constituter one overarching mind, not just people sharing common ideas or goals. Wit a tree, for example, I find no brain, not dominant member present, supervising all the others. Same with the earth. The cells of the tree are alive and have experiences, but are not in themselves conscious, and there is no "mind" ort psyche governing the tree as a whole, from within the tree. Same with the planet. All the parts of teh planet are experiencing entities, but there is no "mind" or "psyche" of the earth per se.

This amounts to missing link, and relies on assumption.

One has evidence of the fact of conscious life on the planet but has no answer to the proces of how it got there.


IF
The planet form holds the conscious self awareness of an Entity capable of incarnating into said form

THEN
One can understand why the planet is teaming with life-forms.

I would like to revisit what I said in an earlier post and expand on the notion.

Locally speaking, it would be fair to say, the Earth Entity is more a 'god in the making' in relation to Her parts - but imo doing well enough for that - lots of making things up as 'we' go along, and lots of blood and terror also - but the word is, respect one another as if indeed we were all aspects of GOD, and understand what good science is showing us re nature - that GOD isn't likely something which we have made it out to be since ancient times.

The GOD you think of as free-flowing and wears the form of the universe began from a point of complete ignorance as to any former experience of any former universe.

The pattern repeats itself internally throughout the lifespan of the universe, in that each time the GOD imbues any aspect of Its consciousness within form such as Galaxies, stars and planets, the same thing occurs - there is no memory of prior experience.

So when the EE went into the planet it thus experienced a new beginning, and from that (still inheriting Its creativity and intelligence) slowly and surely using that in relation to the planets materials, designed and improved form through the process we understand as being biological evolution.

(this process must have to be going on throughout the universe, to different degrees - some have long since evolved from even needing a planet, while others are just starting out - and all these Entities within planetary forms are 'gods' and derive from the one GOD, in relation to this universe).

As we know, there are many 'ages' - and we know there were once the dinosaurs - so we understand that there is a lot of timespace for a planet to be useful to an entity for this purpose.

This is not to say that the EE hasn't worked out it came from a prior state of existence, and hasn't already connected to that greater consciousness it derives from - indeed it has had plenty of timespace to work that out, and this is connected to the myths of gods which have come through the human species.

As far as the EE is concerned, IT is the mind of the planet, and in that, trees are connected with her, as is every other living thing.

There is likely a process too which is necessary for the creation of life forms on the planet as aspects of the EE consciousness are assigned various creative tasks and no doubt there has also been an internal conflict of self identity as the EE has evolved into its understanding of self and reinvented that self identity as the understanding has increased...and the forms are an artistic representation of that reinvention.

From the human perspective, this process equates to gods and devils, good and evil. myths and legends etc et al.

Re your belief that the universe and GOD are on a continuous looping of begginings and ends, this presumes that Consciousness never has enough time to work out how to deliver itself from that looped fate, as well as doesn't take into account the possibility that there are - perhaps an infinite number- of universes as per Quantum math and the ongoing theory developed through those equations. The universes may even be attached to each other, and there is nothing which currently forces us to have to accept that any consciousnesses developed in one universes cannot eventually become adept at traversing between universes - indeed, there is nothing to say that this is not how the [GOD- Consciousness] became involved with this universe - not by evolving from it, but but moving into it from another one.

[hoghead1]

[Replying to post 51 by William]

Interesting; but in my view, God never forgets anything, least of all, all past universes. God guarantees the meaning of life, by God's eternal memory, which preserves all of the past and enjoys all of the past forever.

I don't know about other universes existing alongside ours. If there are, I would simply posit that God can have more than one body or universe at a time. That would be a key way in which God transcends ourselves. Because I understand reality as all interconnected, I would not hold that the other universes are all separate from one another. I would hold they interrelate, constitute one mega-universe.

I'm not sure I follow what you mean by the "God experience." Are you saying each planet is a "god"? See, I still have trouble here because I see no evidence of a brain or dominant member in the earth. Overally, yes; in the earth or organisms such as trees, no, I just don't see it. Also, if there are these other "gods," then do they not constitute on God? The basic rhythm I see in reality is that the many always become one. So at some point the many gods constitute aspects of one transcendental God.

[William]

[Replying to post 52 by hoghead1]

I detect a possible contradiction?

You said in an earlier post that god begins and ends along with the universe and then begins again with the next universe which evolves.

If that is the case, then how does GOD store Its memories? How does this 'eternal memory' exist once the universe ends before the next begins?

I'm not sure I follow what you mean by the "God experience." Are you saying each planet is a "god"?

Each planet system related to life bearing planets are essentially 'gods', yes. Basically anything which is obviously conscious is a form in which a 'particle of GOD' (consciousness) derives.

Consciousness may appear to be separate from 'other' consciousnesses (such as we individuals are, because of the nature of the form we occupy) but that is illusion.

See, I still have trouble here because I see no evidence of a brain or dominant member in the earth.

I don't think you have answered my request of you to clarify your use of the phrase "dominant member"

But yes - My last post did go some way in answering why the earth is the form of an actual self aware entity.

Overally, yes; in the earth or organisms such as trees, no, I just don't see it.

Do you see no intelligence in trees? I am not suggesting that a consciousness self awareness experiencing being a tree would be obvious or even particularly useful on its own of course. What I am attempting to convey is that all things to do with biological life are connected through the Entity which is experiencing them, and the Entity experiences all these things - not as separate things but as one whole thing. Its 'Body'. Its 'Self'.

Also, if there are these other "gods," then do they not constitute on God?

Yes. This is what I was conveying in my last post. I as an individual have a limited grasp of things due to my subjective pov in relation to the form I am experiencing.

The EE as an individual has a far vaster grasp of things due to its subjective point of view being the sum total of all our individual subjective experiences, and not just human experiences but every experience to do with living things on the planet...and going back millions of years...

The basic rhythm I see in reality is that the many always become one.

In reality the many are the one. The illusion of separateness comes fthrough the experience of form.

So at some point the many gods constitute aspects of one transcendental God.

They do now. They always have done, even that they may not have realized it until some point in time when they were able to do so. The 'one transcendental God.' as you referr to that, has always known this to be the case. But then ITS pov is somewhat able to do so.

Some of these Gods no doubt (as I mentioned in my last post) have gone through the process to the point where they have essentially left the cocoon of their planet habitat and the planet that was their cocoon has long since been consumed by the stars of their particular systems.

Others are only just starting out.

We are some place in between, closer to the beginning of that process than the completion of it.

So it is plausible that some such now-planet-less God has indeed come into contact with us - the planet God we are connected most intimately with (EE) and may have even given Her some insight in regard to the bigger picture which in turn has to be translated into something we can grasp at some time in our evolution of human experience by the EE to Her 'particles of consciousness' in form, on the face of the planet.

Religion etc, has been one such way in which she has attempted this.

[hoghead1]

[Replying to William]

What's unique about God, what distinguishes God from us creatures, is that God's eternal memory constitutes unlimited storage space that entails no loss. And I view it as an actual physical entity, not something immaterial. Where is it? I view it at the center of the universe, deep within all things. It's a lot like asking where are our memories. Moment to moment, I'm a new person, yet I share the memories of all the past selves I have been. Tomorrow, you and I will be different persons, if not just a day wiser, but we will remember today. Of course, our memories involve loss over time. God's does not.

Also, I view the beginning of the universe as a kind of universe, or created order.

I see intelligence in the design of the tree. That is one of my arguments for God. Complex order requires an intelligent designer. However, I don't believe all the cells in a tree or my body, for tat matter, had a discussion and decided, to become me or a tree. Something beyond themselves, i.e., God, had to lure them into becoming a me or a tree or a you.

By "dominant member," I mean a central control agency, a brain. I do not see that in trees, etc. I can point to the brain in my body. OK, where is the brain in the tree?

Also, I don't think all experience is conscious experience. In fact, I think consciousness is only the tip of the ice berg, to use the old cliché. Atoms, cells of trees, etc., are subjective, do feel things, but are not conscious. They feel, but they do not feel their feelings, evidence no self-awareness. That comes only with higher organisms. Indeed, with ourselves, most of our experience is subconscious or unconscious. Consciousness being the end product of countless unconscious feelings and experiences deep within us.

[William]

[Replying to post 54 by hoghead1]

If you are going to stick with your model you will have to adjust it. You cannot have an infinite memory+ a GOD/universe which begins and ends.

Also you seem unable/unwilling to ponder the possibility of the EE. You should understand that A to Z has to include BCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXY as well - leave those out and you haven't included everything.

My model is inclusive of your one, but your model is not inclusive of mine.

[hoghead1]

[Replying to William]

Think of yourself. Now, moment to moment, you are I are different people, if not just a moment wiser. But our memories persist. Same with God; only, God's memory entails no loss, as does ours over time. A personality is a synthesis of both consistency and change. Hence, there is carry-over from the past, much of which is accomplished through memory.

Also, all past universes are objective facts with dates. Therefore, they have to be somewhere, in some actual entity, and that entity is the memory of God.

I don't agree with you on the earth as a god, simply because I find no evidence of a world mind or soul, anymore that I find a stomach mind or soul, though I do agree the cells that constitute the stomach are tiny minds, subjective unities of unconscious experience.

[William]

[Replying to post 56 by hoghead1]

As well as the contradiction I pointed out which you haven't explained adequately other than to say the GOD is stored in 'memory' otherwise unspecified as to position once GOD and universe cease to exist as they start the loop again...where does the memory go while awaiting the new incarnation of GOD and universe?

...You are claiming not to 'see' any sign of 'leader/brain' in relation to certain biological life forms on the Earth but are happy to claim that at the 'center of the universe' the mind of GOD exists - even that you cannot 'see' that.

You see one but no the other?

I say, look at what is in your face to 'see' here on this planet before making the leap into uncharted territory.

Also, what are you saying about a 'subjective unconscious experience'? How can anything subjective experience be had unconsciously?

(the memory of such would be *blank*)

[hoghead1]

[Replying to post 57 by William]

I view God as one ever-growing entity or personality. Hence, God never ceases to exist. God can exist in any environment, whereas we can't. And, as I said, there has always been some sort of created order. If you think of our present universe as starting off with something extremely tiny, then God was experiencing what it was like to be in that tiny state. Hence, God did not cease to exist. God simply underwent a new experience.

As I said, I view the universe as an organism, a complex organism; and an organism that complex requires a brain or dominant member or mind in control of it. However, specific parts, may not constitute a single mind, just like I have a brain, but my heart qua heart does not. I also see evidence of God in the complex order or design of the universe. Where there is a watch, there is a watchmaker. I also see God as necessary to guarantee the meaning of life, as I explained in a previous post. In addition, I posit validity to the Christian or Love mystical tradition, which focuses upon direct, immediate experiences of God as present.

Most of our experience is unconscious experience. As I explained before, our consciousness is just the tip of the ice berg, the end product of countless unconscious experiences in our brains and bodies. So there shouldn't be anything surprising or wild about speaking of unconscious experience.

[William]

[Replying to post 58 by hoghead1]

Your heart does have a brain.

Both are contained in your body.

As to the unconscious, I understand what you are saying now. You are speaking about an aspect of your consciousness to which your dominant conscious experience is normally not privy to.

As to your theory re the universe as an organism, you are aware that planets and stars and galaxies are part of the universe right?

So if GOD can experience through human form, there is nothing to prevent IT doing so through galaxies, stars and planets.

Your own theory allows for that, even if you cannot presently see it.