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2Dbunk
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2017 2:51 pm  Does "Gut Feeling" count for something? Reply with quote

Mark Twain once said: "Faith is believing something you know ain't true." -from his book Following the Equator, 1897. As a self-claimed anti-intellectual, is this quote of his a gut feeling? Feel free to extrapolate any thoughts you might have on what he said.
Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 11: Sun Mar 12, 2017 6:48 pm
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amortalman wrote:

[Replying to 2Dbunk]

Being the highly talented writer that M. T. was I think he simply had another of many flashes of creative prose. For this clever saying to ring true it has to strike a chord with many of his readers, which it does. He was playing on people's natural suspicion of beliefs without empirical evidence.


I will disagree; Mark Twain himself was known for atheist and anti-religious ideas.

"Man is a marvellous curiosity . . . he thinks he is the Creator's pet . . . he even believes the Creator loves him; has a passion for him; sits up nights to admire him; yes and watch over him and keep him out of trouble. He prays to him and thinks He listens. Isn't it a quaint idea." - Mark Twain: Letters from the Earth

When he states that 'Faith is believing something you know ain't true.' is his way of trying to point out cognitive dissonance. Accepting that things that are real must be demonstrable; except for those things that don't have to be because of faith.

I don't have anything to add to the initial argument; I'd just like to straighten out Mark Twain's demeanour in that he was an avid atheist. Less 'playing on his audience' and more attempting to express his view point.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 12: Sun Mar 19, 2017 6:17 pm
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Re: Does "Gut Feeling" count for something?

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[Replying to post 10 by amortalman]

Quote:
Being the highly talented writer that M. T. was I think he simply had another of many flashes of creative prose. For this clever saying to ring true it has to strike a chord with many of his readers, which it does. He was playing on people's natural suspicion of beliefs without empirical evidence.


Since when has logic (logical philosophical ideas) been required to pass Scientific Method empirical testing? Mark Twain's prose is philosophic, not scientific. His is a gift of Western thought, not necessarily Eastern or anything in between; logic is interpreted many ways by many cultures across this globe. Whereas, the Scientific Method is interpreted universally, ONE way, at least on this planet.

I welcome the remarks of Demented_Literature in highlighting and interpreting what Mark Twain said. (In deference to religionists "Letters from the Earth" was published posthumously, by M. T.'s request, in an era that was anathema to progressive ("demented") literature, no matter the source.)

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 13: Sun Mar 19, 2017 7:08 pm
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Re: Does "Gut Feeling" count for something?

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2Dbunk wrote:
Does "Gut Feeling" count for something?



Defining gut feeling...

1. An awareness of an event that happened or was about to happen that cannot be easily accounted for by the physical senses. My wife was driving on a one lane country road when she pulled over and stopped for no reason. When I asked her why she stopped, she looked confused and said 'I don't know...' a huge garbage truck careened around the blind corner in front of us, almost on two wheels and leveled out to roar past us...we were in a mini. Did she hear the truck? Did she see something thru the dense hedge that covered the road past the corner? If she did, it was all subconscious.

2. Being given knowledge telepathically. I was driving home from work with the same lady when we came around the corner and I saw a house across the field that I just knew I was going to live in someday. As I turned to tell her about my "feeling" I stopped because it was plain to me that she wouldn't be with me.

20 years later with a new wife we actually bought this house but I did not recognize it until we were coming home a week or so later from the same direction as the time of the "feeling" and there it was, just as I knew 20 years before. Ohhhh kayyyy....

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 14: Tue Mar 21, 2017 3:22 pm
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Re: Does "Gut Feeling" count for something?

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[Replying to post 13 by ttruscott]

I can't say anything like those events you describe ever happened to me. My wife leaves the door open for ESP -- she does seem to have a sixth sense in detecting bad things, allowing us to circumvent them. And I've heard anecdotes similar to yours occasionally.

Like I said in my last post, I appreciate Demented_Literature's "cognitive dissonance" in explaining Twain's quote. Through our individual collection of experiences I do think we acquire a sense of where to go from here. Unfortunately, some of us are not as fortunate as others in avoiding the same mistakes -- personally and in general history.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 15: Wed Mar 22, 2017 1:35 am
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2Dbunk wrote:
Through our individual collection of experiences I do think we acquire a sense of where to go from here. Unfortunately, some of us are not as fortunate as others in avoiding the same mistakes


Ummm, sorry - I think it was our pre-conception existence choices that did all of this. Those who can seek GOD will seek GOD. Those who cannot...

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 16: Thu Mar 30, 2017 3:11 pm
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Re: Does "Gut Feeling" count for something?

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[Replying to post 15 by ttruscott]

Well, for what it's worth, humanity is going to continue behaving as if we have a choice, and defeatist perspectives like yours will have relatively no impact on either philosophy or the rest of human endeavors. Unless you can back up your assertions in a way that is relevant to human philosophy.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 17: Fri Mar 31, 2017 8:45 am
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OP:Gut feelings.
I would suggest that "gut feelings" are the internalized understandings we have, based on accumulated life experiences. An example might be an athlete who "anticipates" his opponents next move. An experienced soccer goalkeeper who establishes a perfect position in goal as opposed to a young goalkeeper who may have better reflexes but does not have the experience yet. The experienced athlete has , in his memory, similar situations which he unconsciously calls on to establish a great position in goal.
Another point about "gut feelings" and "psychic" abilities. We may nave plenty of "esp-like" experiences which never come true. But we only remember the very few that do come true. Every time I get on a plane I have a "gut feeling" that something will go wrong and it will crash. Hasn't happened yet.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 18: Mon Apr 03, 2017 9:47 pm
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Re: Does "Gut Feeling" count for something?

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[Replying to post 1 by 2Dbunk]

I can't prove my roommate is not upstairs plotting my demise this very night. I could go upstairs and knock, or simply jump in. But most likely I will find him reading in bed or apparently asleep. But in a assumed worldview with him plotting my demise, anything can be fitted quite snugly.

Faith governs all worldviews, atheists, Muslims, agnostics, christians etc.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 19: Tue Apr 04, 2017 2:23 am
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Re: Does "Gut Feeling" count for something?

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liamconnor wrote:

[Replying to post 1 by 2Dbunk]

I can't prove my roommate is not upstairs plotting my demise this very night. I could go upstairs and knock, or simply jump in. But most likely I will find him reading in bed or apparently asleep. But in a assumed worldview with him plotting my demise, anything can be fitted quite snugly.

Faith governs all worldviews, atheists, Muslims, agnostics, christians etc.


I don't think one's peculiar belief that a roommate is planning murder exemplifies a world view, unless one suffers from paranoia. The view, presumably, would arise from certain unfortunate suspicions.

Nor am I sure that worldviews always arise from faith, though in many cases they do,
but long experience and knowledge of history and its repetitiveness fix our human ideas. Still, as a provocative statement designed to generate conflict, like the throwing of the golden apple, it's a nice piece of contention, Liam. Go well.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 20: Tue Apr 04, 2017 11:55 am
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Gut feelings and ego.

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I have come to understand "Gut Feelings" are like the initial stirrings which can lead to a connection with a deeper aspect of one's self (introspection) which is generally ignored or misunderstood.
Normally/generally humans seem to operate mainly at the ego level and this seems sufficient {and even more appropriate} for them to get by, in most circumstances.

"Gut feelings" are signals from a deeper aspect of the self to that shallow ego aspect in the drivers seat.

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