Boycot the Christianity and Apologetics forum?

[ttruscott]

Since the premise of all responses in the Christianity and Apologetics forum is empirical data offered as proof even if the RULE is 5. Support your assertions/arguments with EVIDENCE. Do not persist in making a claim without supporting it. All unsupported claims can be challenged for supporting evidence. and

Since Christians are to live by faith, an unproven hope, (not by sight) then

it seems that no Christian answer can be acceptable and must break the social morés of the forum.

While it is stated that evidence only is necessary, the rule of the forum seems to be often co-opted to accept only proof as reliable evidence. No proof = no evidence for many secularists even if this is a logical fallacy called the black swan. I also see far fewer non-theists venturing into the Theology forum outside the security of the Apologetics forum.

My other issue with this forum is that the non-theists are creating inflammatory topics but by adding in a question, even one asking for a person opinion and not a question for debate, it is accepted. WE are not called to answer every derogatory remark about our GOD or religion: Proverbs 26:4 Do not answer a fool according to his folly, or you yourself will be just like him. so topics which have no substance for belief but are mere japes can be ingnored.

IF we boycotted this forum and forced the secular materialists to engage only in the Theology forum, then they would have to 'debate' our Christian logic only and not every scurrilous accusation they can think of to denigrate us or our Religion. Since I think a lot of our orthodoxy is not logical, and I see that the secularists are very adept at noticing our logical lapses, I think they would push our boundaries much further than harassing commentaries about the psychopathy of GOD stated as fact and not opinion, sigh.

Why we must answer questions about the flood in Apologetics and not Theology? WE know their pov is wrong so why not stand up for our pov? I bet far far fewer believers would feel so beat up and quit... It is not Scripture that we must battle under their rules but as Christians:
Ephesians 6:10-18
10 Finally, be strong in the Lord and in his mighty power.
11 Put on the full armor of God, so that you can take your stand against the devil’s schemes.
12 For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.
13 Therefore put on the full armor of God, so that when the day of evil comes, you may be able to stand your ground, and after you have done everything, to stand.
14 Stand firm then, with the belt of truth buckled around your waist, with the breastplate of righteousness in place,
15 and with your feet fitted with the readiness that comes from the gospel of peace.
16 In addition to all this, take up the shield of faith, with which you can extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one.
17 Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.

18 And pray in the Spirit on all occasions with all kinds of prayers and requests. With this in mind, be alert and always keep on praying for all the Lord’s people.

This advice is much more suited for the Theology forum than the secularist haven Apologetics because to stand like this in Apologetics will get you banned and silenced.

So that is what I am thinking....they outnumber us what, 10 to 1 so we need to use this place to our every advantage. What do you think?

[otseng]

Since the premise of all responses in the Christianity and Apologetics forum is empirical data offered as proof even if the RULE is 5. Support your assertions/arguments with EVIDENCE. Do not persist in making a claim without supporting it. All unsupported claims can be challenged for supporting evidence.

Note that the rules do not say only empirical evidence is acceptable. It does not qualify the type of evidence. More info here in the section "Empirical/Non-empirical evidence."

Since Christians are to live by faith, an unproven hope, (not by sight)

Yes. Christians are to live by faith, but that does not mean our faith is unfounded. If we have absolutely no evidence or arguments to defend the faith, then we might as well hang up our hat and shut down the forum. But, I do not believe that to be the case. There are evidence and arguments to support the faith. To prove the faith? That would be impossible. To demonstrate that it's plausible. I think that definitely is possible.

No proof = no evidence for many secularists even if this is a logical fallacy called the black swan.

There is no rule that says anyone has to prove anything. If someone insists you must prove something, challenge them where is it a requirement on the forum that something needs to be proved.

WE are not called to answer every derogatory remark about our GOD or religion

Right, there's no need to answer every derogatory remark made against Christianity. Please do not fall into this trap.

IF we boycotted this forum and forced the secular materialists to engage only in the Theology forum, then they would have to 'debate' our Christian logic only and not every scurrilous accusation they can think of to denigrate us or our Religion.

This is not a good strategy. If someone only wants to participate in TD&D, it's up to them. But, what does it mean to boycott meeting atheists in C&A? Atheists will still continue to post there. And it would only reinforce the stereotype that Christians are unable to defend Christianity on a level playing field.

Since I think a lot of our orthodoxy is not logical, and I see that the secularists are very adept at noticing our logical lapses

Sure. I don't see anything wrong with that, even as a Christian.

I think they would push our boundaries much further than harassing commentaries about the psychopathy of GOD stated as fact and not opinion, sigh.

So what if they make derogatory comments about God? I think God can handle whatever slander people throw at Him. And why should it affect us? If we believe God is real and powerful, it should have no negative affect on us. It should not be a reason to run from the fight, but to run into the fight like David.

Why we must answer questions about the flood in Apologetics and not Theology?

Actually, I prefer to answer questions about the flood in Science and Religion.

It is not Scripture that we must battle under their rules but as Christians:

On this forum, we are all under the same rules.

This advice is much more suited for the Theology forum than the secularist haven Apologetics because to stand like this in Apologetics will get you banned and silenced.

Only by violating the rules will people get banned.

So that is what I am thinking....they outnumber us what, 10 to 1 so we need to use this place to our every advantage.

I don't know what you mean by use this to our advantage. But, I find it invigorating and challenging for 10 people to gang up on me. What fun is there if you and nine of your friends beat up one person? But, what if you stand alone against a dozen people and are able to stand your ground? That is where the fun is at.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 1 by ttruscott]

I disagree, there are many Christian beliefs which are based historical or scientific facts. For example that Jesus existed, that Jerusalem had a temple, that bible writers recorded historical facts, that the earth had a beginning, that living things are grouped according to similar features etc etc.

True faith, even about unseen persons or events is still also based on evidence, the bible being one source of such evidence. Personal experience is also a source of evidence.

EVIDENCE: the available body of facts or information indicating whether a belief or proposition is true or valid.

Besides, the only reason I go to C&A is by FAR the vast majority of questions are in fact theological ones that actually belong in TD&D (Is God good? Does God love us? Did God perform a miracle etc etc all based on the supposition of a god and asking questions for which the only source of information is ones personal opinion or established theological thought. Otherwise every single question in C&A without exception would be

- Can God move a mountain
- Prove God
- Can't prove God
- END OF THREAD

In short, regardless ofthe intial question all threads in C&A always, without exception end up as theological opinion based exchanges NOT factual examinations.



JW

[JehovahsWitness]

IF we boycotted this forum and forced the secular materialists to engage only in the Theology forum, then they would have to 'debate' our Christian logic only and not every scurrilous accusation they can think of to denigrate us or our Religion.

As I said again, I'd be happy to do this but that there are interesting theological questions asked in C&A that in reality actually belong in TD&D. Also newbies often don't know where to post and they will post "Why does God allow suffering?" or "What happens when we die" over in C&A and since these are the kinds of questions I come here to answer I have to keep my eye out for them in that subforum.

That said, I cannot tell you how TIRED I am of trying to engage in a bible based theological debate only to find the thread littered with "God is imagination" "Jesus was gay" and the bible writers were drunk idiots high on drugs. If I wanted that kind of nonsence I would pass my time in C&A but a lot of the problem is with believers using this that subforum to defend topics that don't belong there. This results in the whole forum being a place for atheists to post that God is a pedophile while there is pretty much nowhere to have a serious debate without having to wade through blasphemy to have it.

In short, Holy Huddle is not a debating forum but TD&D is flooded with"the bible is nonsence and Jesus was gay if he existed a all" rubbish. I think the answer must be to refusing to address blasphemy and ignoring debate issues that belong in C&A as well as being very precise when posting topics in TD&D ie

"What was the original sin?" in this debate the bible account is to be considered as accurate and true and the question is what did the bible writer mean rather than who wrote Genesis and does Genesis belong in the bible canon at all.

Tedious but what else can one do to stay on track and avoid "Genesis was actually written by Adloph Hitler in 1939"?


JW

[Overcomer]

JehovahsWitness wrote:

That said, I cannot tell you how TIRED I am of trying to engage in a bible based theological debate only to find the thread littered with "God is imagination" "Jesus was gay" and the bible writers were drunk idiots high on drugs.

I came across this very old thread this afternoon and highlighted the above comment because that's the way I'm feeling these days -- tired of ridiculous topics being started by atheists and deists that offer them the opportunity to insult, besmirch, disdain, ridicule, lampoon, mock, scorn, deride, disparage, denigrate (have I used enough verbs to make my point? LOL) God, Jesus, the Bible, Christianity, and Christians. And they don't bother to back up what they say with anything concrete. They just offer insults and opinions as if they're fact.

To be honest, I think it's pretty sad that there are people who have that much hatred and anger in them that they have to spend hours and hours and hours here tearing down instead of building up.

This is why I took a four-year hiatus from this forum and didn't return until a few months ago. I left it because I felt it was just a Christian-bashing forum, not a Christian debating forum.

What really bugs me are the people who say they can't be bothered looking at any of the articles/videos/books for which I provide links. They obviously really don't care about learning anything. Nor are they willing to honestly consider that there may be validity in an argument that goes against what they believe. It seems they are only here to vent their spleens.

And then there are the ones who, if they don't have an intelligent response, just post a couple of insults or make a few derogatory comments and think that's acceptable.

However, I am aware of the fact that there are many lurkers who visit this forum. Sometimes when I log on, I see there are as many as 70 or 80 anonymous visitors here. Perhaps THEY are interested in BOTH sides of an argument.

Just wanted to get that off my chest. Onward and upward, eh?

[jgh7]

I concur with the sentiment of being tired over the backhanded disrespectful insults towards Christians, Christianity, and God. If they phrase them properly, they can sneek by under the rules. But Otseng makes good points. And honestly, the skeptics will use the same tactics on TD&D if we boycotted C&A. It is not going away. It has been around since the start of Christianity and is the nature of people.

[Overcomer]

jgh7 wrote:

It is not going away. It has been around since the start of Christianity and is the nature of people.

Amen to that!

I won't boycott sub-forums, but I just might boycott some people! LOL! And I'm already boycotting some topics. Religion as a mental illness -- really?!!!! How desperate some people are to justify their rejection of God! They'll try just about anything.

I just keep reminding myself that Christ died for them, too.

[Overcomer]

Just heard a sermon on the topic of love found here:

https://livingtruth.ca/

It reminded me that everything I do should be out of love and, therefore, the insults and unreasonableness of others shouldn't turn me off, but make me pray that I can manifest the fruit of the Spirit in conversations here.

Gal. 5:22, 23: But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law.

I can't change other people, but I can certainly work with the Holy Spirit to change myself for the better.

[Overcomer]

This is still on my mind. And it doesn't surprise me that God gave me yet another "message" through a podcast this afternoon. It was on the topic of C.S. Lewis. The discussion centered on Lewis' suggestion that, when people offend and annoy us, we should use our imaginations and think of ourselves loving that person, thinking kindly of that person, imagining a better conversation going a more positive way. He said it can actually change a person's attitude when he/she does that.

I'm going to give it a try here. It certainly can't hurt.

Additionally, it occurred to me that some of the hostility aimed at God and Christians probably comes from pain. I know there are people who have been really hurt in this life, suffering tragedies that have absolutely floored them. And sometimes that hurt has come in a church from somebody who they didn't think would hurt them because that somebody was supposed to be a Christian. It might even have come from the person in the pulpit. And then they blame God when it's actually the devil that is at the root of all evil.

So if I remember that, and think that maybe I'm dealing with somebody who has been hurt to the core, and it's their pain talking, then that will make me less frustrated and less likely to lose my patience.

[Wootah]

[Replying to post 1 by ttruscott]

Personally I post on what interests me to reply to.