Is the God of Jesus a merciful forgiving Father?
Or a bloodthirsty deity who must be appeased by the blood of animals, then later, by the blood of His favorite Son?
I realize these are loaded questions, and that my bias is apparent.
But which is it, merciful Father or Judge who demands blood?*
Which kind of God did Jesus himself teach? (not Paul, but Jesus)
What kind of Father demands the blood of his favorite Son in order to be able to forgive his other children?
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(note.. this thread is about forgiveness and atonement, not about the wars of YHVH's people etc.)
*if you answer "both" then please demonstrate how the two notions are compatible.
What kind of Father demands the blood of His Son?
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What kind of Father demands the blood of His Son?
Post #1 My theological positions:
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
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Re: What kind of Father demands the blood of His Son?
Post #121Elijah John wrote:Just how pervasive, Clarie, do you suppose that Satanism actually is?Claire Evans wrote: Do I know everyone to call them a Satanist? Satanism is very pervasive. And don't give me the straw man argument re the moon landing and 9-11. I never made those claims.
Very. Satan dominates the world. Satanism is even in the Christian churches. It's not hard to deduce what Satanism is. It's devil worship.
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Re: What kind of Father demands the blood of His Son?
Post #122Satanism is a religion what worships Satan. Where is Satanism in Christian Churches?Claire Evans wrote:Elijah John wrote:Just how pervasive, Clarie, do you suppose that Satanism actually is?Claire Evans wrote: Do I know everyone to call them a Satanist? Satanism is very pervasive. And don't give me the straw man argument re the moon landing and 9-11. I never made those claims.
Very. Satan dominates the world. Satanism is even in the Christian churches. It's not hard to deduce what Satanism is. It's devil worship.
You seem to be saying that even many Christians worship the devil? What is your evidence that this is so?
Please prove this ridiculous accusation. And please do so without appeal to ridiculous conspiracy theories or ridiculous conspiratorial links.
My theological positions:
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
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- Guru
- Posts: 1153
- Joined: Mon Apr 06, 2015 3:40 am
- Location: South Africa
Re: What kind of Father demands the blood of His Son?
Post #123The Vatican is a example. Much Satanism there but the Vatican is known to be Christian.Elijah John wrote:Satanism is a religion what worships Satan. Where is Satanism in Christian Churches?Claire Evans wrote:Elijah John wrote:Just how pervasive, Clarie, do you suppose that Satanism actually is?Claire Evans wrote: Do I know everyone to call them a Satanist? Satanism is very pervasive. And don't give me the straw man argument re the moon landing and 9-11. I never made those claims.
Very. Satan dominates the world. Satanism is even in the Christian churches. It's not hard to deduce what Satanism is. It's devil worship.
You seem to be saying that even many Christians worship the devil? What is your evidence that this is so?
Please prove this ridiculous accusation. And please do so without appeal to ridiculous conspiracy theories or ridiculous conspiratorial links.
There are people called sleepers, who are Satanists, who infiltrate the Christian church posing as Christians. There was a sleeper in my church when I was a child. He was a Satanist who became a Sunday School teacher and he was teaching the children about Satanism, getting the children very interested. When he was chastised, he beat a hasty retreat.
The infiltration is very shocking.
http://www.rense.com/general66/satanici ... offund.htm
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Re: What kind of Father demands the blood of His Son?
Post #124Prove it. Prove to us that there is "much Satanism" in the Vatican, as you say. And please do so without resort to any of your nonsensical, bigoted and conspiratorial websites.Claire Evans wrote:
The Vatican is a example. Much Satanism there but the Vatican is known to be Christian.
There are people called sleepers, who are Satanists, who infiltrate the Christian church posing as Christians. There was a sleeper in my church when I was a child. He was a Satanist who became a Sunday School teacher and he was teaching the children about Satanism, getting the children very interested. When he was chastised, he beat a hasty retreat.
The infiltration is very shocking.
Linking to such websites is not honorable debate.
My theological positions:
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
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Post #125
Moderator CommentClaire Evans wrote:The Vatican is a example. Much Satanism there but the Vatican is known to be Christian.Elijah John wrote:Satanism is a religion what worships Satan. Where is Satanism in Christian Churches?Claire Evans wrote:Elijah John wrote:Just how pervasive, Clarie, do you suppose that Satanism actually is?Claire Evans wrote: Do I know everyone to call them a Satanist? Satanism is very pervasive. And don't give me the straw man argument re the moon landing and 9-11. I never made those claims.
Very. Satan dominates the world. Satanism is even in the Christian churches. It's not hard to deduce what Satanism is. It's devil worship.
You seem to be saying that even many Christians worship the devil? What is your evidence that this is so?
Please prove this ridiculous accusation. And please do so without appeal to ridiculous conspiracy theories or ridiculous conspiratorial links.
Please do not make derogatory remarks against another group unless you can also provide strong evidence to support your claims.
Please review the Rules.
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Moderator comments do not count as a strike against any posters. They only serve as an acknowledgment that a post report has been received, but has not been judged to warrant a moderator warning against a particular poster. Any challenges or replies to moderator postings should be made via Private Message to avoid derailing topics.
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Re: What kind of Father demands the blood of His Son?
Post #126Claire Evans wrote:Satanism is even in the Christian churches. It's not hard to deduce what Satanism is. It's devil worship.
Claire, you repeatedly make strong claims. But you've made no attempt to back up your claims with facts or evidence. Do you know any Satanists? Do you know what they teach, what their principle doctrines are? Does any of your information come from Satanists themselves? What motivates people to become Satanists? Does it make sense that they would infiltrate the highest levels of Christian denominations?Claire Evans wrote:The Vatican is a example. Much Satanism there but the Vatican is known to be Christian.
Examine everything carefully; hold fast to that which is good.
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
First Epistle to the Church of the Thessalonians
The truth will make you free.
Gospel of John
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Re: What kind of Father demands the blood of His Son?
Post #127Elijah John wrote:Prove it. Prove to us that there is "much Satanism" in the Vatican, as you say. And please do so without resort to any of your nonsensical, bigoted and conspiratorial websites.Claire Evans wrote:
The Vatican is a example. Much Satanism there but the Vatican is known to be Christian.
There are people called sleepers, who are Satanists, who infiltrate the Christian church posing as Christians. There was a sleeper in my church when I was a child. He was a Satanist who became a Sunday School teacher and he was teaching the children about Satanism, getting the children very interested. When he was chastised, he beat a hasty retreat.
The infiltration is very shocking.
Linking to such websites is not honorable debate.
Is the "conspiracy website" I linked to what you are referring to? Please look at the mainstream media sources they linked to.
A pictures says a thousand words
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Re: What kind of Father demands the blood of His Son?
Post #128The upside down cross is an allusion to the chair of St.Peter, which the Pope holds. Tradition holds that Peter was martyred by being crucified upside down.Claire Evans wrote:Elijah John wrote:Prove it. Prove to us that there is "much Satanism" in the Vatican, as you say. And please do so without resort to any of your nonsensical, bigoted and conspiratorial websites.Claire Evans wrote:
The Vatican is a example. Much Satanism there but the Vatican is known to be Christian.
There are people called sleepers, who are Satanists, who infiltrate the Christian church posing as Christians. There was a sleeper in my church when I was a child. He was a Satanist who became a Sunday School teacher and he was teaching the children about Satanism, getting the children very interested. When he was chastised, he beat a hasty retreat.
The infiltration is very shocking.
Linking to such websites is not honorable debate.
Is the "conspiracy website" I linked to what you are referring to? Please look at the mainstream media sources they linked to.
A pictures says a thousand words
If you see this as evidence that the Vatican is Satanic, what about all the upright crosses that can be seen on Catholic property? They represent Jesus' sacriifce on the cross, neither cross position represents "Satanism" in Roman Catholic context.
Why assume the worst instead of giving people who differ with you the benefit of the doubt?
Assuming the worst, when there are more benevolent, factual and probable explanations, is at the heart of conspiratorial thinking.
That and hatred born of ignorance.
My theological positions:
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
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Re: What kind of Father demands the blood of His Son?
Post #129Peter was not crucified on an upside cross but upside down on a X-shaped cross.Elijah John wrote:The upside down cross is an allusion to the chair of St.Peter, which the Pope holds. Tradition holds that Peter was martyred by being crucified upside down.Claire Evans wrote:Elijah John wrote:Prove it. Prove to us that there is "much Satanism" in the Vatican, as you say. And please do so without resort to any of your nonsensical, bigoted and conspiratorial websites.Claire Evans wrote:
The Vatican is a example. Much Satanism there but the Vatican is known to be Christian.
There are people called sleepers, who are Satanists, who infiltrate the Christian church posing as Christians. There was a sleeper in my church when I was a child. He was a Satanist who became a Sunday School teacher and he was teaching the children about Satanism, getting the children very interested. When he was chastised, he beat a hasty retreat.
The infiltration is very shocking.
Linking to such websites is not honorable debate.
Is the "conspiracy website" I linked to what you are referring to? Please look at the mainstream media sources they linked to.
A pictures says a thousand words
If you see this as evidence that the Vatican is Satanic, what about all the upright crosses that can be seen on Catholic property? They represent Jesus' sacriifce on the cross, neither cross position represents "Satanism" in Roman Catholic context.
Why assume the worst instead of giving people who differ with you the benefit of the doubt?
Assuming the worst, when there are more benevolent, factual and probable explanations, is at the heart of conspiratorial thinking.
That and hatred born of ignorance.
http://holyangels.com/apostles/img8.html
Of course there are upright crosses. You can't say the upside cross refers to Jesus because Jesus was not crucified that way. Peter's crucifixion, on the other hand, was a more insidious way of displaying Satanism.
And of course, Peter has nothing to do with the worship of Jesus yet his "upside cross" appears in the signing of the cross.
Pay attention to 1:48 min
Satanism in Vatican:
http://harvest-trust.blogspot.co.za/201 ... tican.html
Pay attention to eye inside the pyramid behind the priest. That is the eye of Lucifer. It's prevalent in the occult.
http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20 ... wo_eye.htm
Why should I give the Vatican the benefit of the doubt when it is crawling with paedophiles?
http://www.vatileaks.com/vati-leaks/pop ... ic-priests
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Re: What kind of Father demands the blood of His Son?
Post #130[Replying to post 128 by Claire Evans]
Why do you seem to want to cling to your conspiracy theory nonsense? Why do you seem want to believe the worst about the cherished beliefs of others and their religion? (Namely Catholicism)
It is one thing to critique other faiths or belief systems, quite another to literally demonize them.
It is one thing to suggest that others are wrong, quite another to suggest they are evil.
Even in the light of very realistic explanations which are far more benign and far more plausible, you persist?
Sorry, Ms Evans, Satan does not reside under every rock, nor does he lurk in every corner.
And people are not lizards and reptiles. And they are not "shape-shifters".
The Pope does not have horns nor does he have scales.
Why do you seem to want to cling to your conspiracy theory nonsense? Why do you seem want to believe the worst about the cherished beliefs of others and their religion? (Namely Catholicism)
It is one thing to critique other faiths or belief systems, quite another to literally demonize them.
It is one thing to suggest that others are wrong, quite another to suggest they are evil.
Even in the light of very realistic explanations which are far more benign and far more plausible, you persist?
Sorry, Ms Evans, Satan does not reside under every rock, nor does he lurk in every corner.
And people are not lizards and reptiles. And they are not "shape-shifters".
The Pope does not have horns nor does he have scales.
My theological positions:
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.