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Donray
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 06, 2017 4:11 pm  Where was god???? Reply with quote

SUTHERLAND SPRINGS, Tex. — The massacre here that killed more than two dozen people — the youngest of them just 18 months old — occurred amid an ongoing “domestic situation” involving the gunman and his relatives, at least one of whom had attended the church, law enforcement officials said Monday.

People must have been prying to God then they were killed in his church.

Why did God allow this and not listen to prays?
Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 31: Wed Nov 08, 2017 1:53 pm
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Here we go again with the JWs spouting the heresy that the trinity is false.

The topic is does god interfere with humans and therefore pray for something is useless and fall on the deaf ear of god. God does not help anyone no matter how hard they pray for something. God does not save anyone from dying.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 32: Wed Nov 08, 2017 3:37 pm
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[Replying to post 30 by Donray]


Quote:
Without knowing good and evil how could one have free will?


When I observe an animal in the wild, I see the animal is excising free will in relation to the limitation of its environment, but I do not think that animals have the same type of knowledge if good and evil as humans are capable of.

I do not think that having the knowledge of good and evil is what free will is.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 33: Wed Nov 08, 2017 3:42 pm
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Donray wrote:

You have a major problem with your logic of your god creating things with fee will. He did not create Adam or Eve with free will. He created Adam and Eve without knowledge of good and evil and therefore did not allow them free will.


Donray wrote:
You should read the bible. Genesis 2:17 17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."


Are you attempting to misquote the bible? The words you said (in blue above) are not in Genesis 2:17; the words " He created Adam and Eve without knowledge of good and evil" are not found in Genesis 2:17. Indeed the words "created" and "without" are nowhere to be seen in that scripture.


Last edited by JehovahsWitness on Wed Nov 08, 2017 3:51 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 34: Wed Nov 08, 2017 3:46 pm
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[Replying to post 31 by Donray]

Quote:
God does not save anyone from dying.


From GODs perspective, no one dies. Indeed, many Christians believe that they go to a far better place.

So in that case, the dying is something of an illusion. Sad from the perspective of our dominant reality nonetheless, but it is what it is, and evil actions do not mean that GOD does not exist or that GOD is indifferent.

Perhaps as well as praying, Christians could gather together in support of doing something about the insane number of guns which exist in the USA...but maybe the problem is far too great for any practical solution to be injected through laws and this will just have to play itself out.


Last edited by William on Wed Nov 08, 2017 4:25 pm; edited 1 time in total

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 35: Wed Nov 08, 2017 3:49 pm
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Donray wrote:
Here we go again with the JWs spouting the heresy that the trinity is false.


I don't recall mentioning the word trinity at all in this thread. I don't think tim has either. From what I can see the only person bringing up the topic of the trinity here is you. If I were of a mind to discuss the trinity (which I am not) I would go start another thread so as not to deraille the topic at hand.

JW

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 36: Wed Nov 08, 2017 4:05 pm
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Re: Where was god????

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[Replying to post 29 by JehovahsWitness]

http://i.cubeupload.com/qrY6R4.png :
Quote:
Luke 1:34-36New International Version (NIV)

34 “How will this be,” Mary asked the angel, “since I am a virgin?”

35 The angel answered, “The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called[a] the Son of God. 36 Even Elizabeth your relative is going to have a child in her old age, and she who was said to be unable to conceive is in her sixth month.


And what was the source of knowledge of Luke, he was not there when the dialogue took place. Right, please?

Regards

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 37: Wed Nov 08, 2017 8:02 pm
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JehovahsWitness wrote:

Donray wrote:

You have a major problem with your logic of your god creating things with fee will. He did not create Adam or Eve with free will. He created Adam and Eve without knowledge of good and evil and therefore did not allow them free will.


Donray wrote:
You should read the bible. Genesis 2:17 17 but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."


Are you attempting to misquote the bible? The words you said (in blue above) are not in Genesis 2:17; the words " He created Adam and Eve without knowledge of good and evil" are not found in Genesis 2:17. Indeed the words "created" and "without" are nowhere to be seen in that scripture.


You seem to not read post correctly and try to write what I did not. Show be the quotes where I said that is in the bible?

Here is what I wrote:
"You should read the bible. Genesis 2:17 17but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

Since god did not want to eat from the tree and thus have knowledge of good and evil. Without knowing good and evil how could one have free will?"

Why can't you read what I wrote.

What you are saying I said is in the bible I did say was in the bible. Like you and many others the comment after the bible entry is my impartation. Just like you interpret the bible to say there are two gods.

Again, you fail to answer my question. How can one have free choice when you have no idea of good and evil. God created man without a lot of knowledge that would be used to make a free choice. But god in his wisdom created man without a lot of knowledge and therefore in my opinion man could not use free will to do evil. And when they did use what could be free will to eat the fruit what did god do when they used free will? He got pissed that they used free will and punished them.

Again getting back to the original question do you agree that your god does not respond to any pray from help. For example: There is no such thing as faith healing.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 38: Wed Nov 08, 2017 11:50 pm
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Donray wrote:

Like you and many others the comment after the bible entry is my impartation.


So let me get this straight, what you said is NOT what the bible says, its just what you personally think that passage means. Is that what you mean by your "impartation"*... Your own personal interpretation of what you believe in your heart the passage is saying but not what is actually written in the verse. Is that right?



JW


* impartation: Type of: transmission. communication by means of transmitted signals.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 39: Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:40 am
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[Replying to post 37 by Donray]
Quote:
Donray
Here is what I wrote:
"You should read the bible. Genesis 2:17 17but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

Since god did not want to eat from the tree and thus have knowledge of good and evil. Without knowing good and evil how could one have free will?"


One's point is reasonable. Knowledge of good and evil and then to decide for the right on one's own free-will is a sign of maturity and is praisworthy.
The narrators/scribes/translators/clergy seem to understood the phenomenon incorrectly. Moses was given both the Law and the Discrimination by YHVH , please:

[2:53] Then We forgave you thereafter, that you might be grateful.
[2:54] And remember the time when We gave Moses the Book and the Discrimination*, that you might be rightly guided.
[2:55] And remember the time when Moses said to his people: ‘O my people, you have indeed wronged yourselves by taking the calf for worship; turn you therefore to your Maker, and kill your evil desires; that is the best for you with your Maker.’ Then He turned towards you with compassion. Surely, He is Oft-Returning with compassion, and is Merciful.
[2:56] And remember when you said: ‘O Moses, we will by no means believe thee until we see Allah face to face;’ then the thunderbolt overtook you, while you gazed.
https://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/showChapter.php?ch=2&verse=53
* knowledge of good and evil to exercise free-will.

Regards

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 40: Thu Nov 09, 2017 11:17 am
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[quote="JehovahsWitness"]
Donray wrote:

Like you and many others the comment after the bible entry is my impartation.


So let me get this straight, what you said is NOT what the bible says, its just what you personally think that passage means. Is that what you mean by your "impartation"*... Your own personal interpretation of what you believe in your heart the passage is saying but not what is actually written in the verse. Is that right?

No since the your does not do any thinking you cannot be correct. Thanks for correcting my auto correct to the correct word.

Again you net pick and fail to respond to the real issue. This is typical of religious people that cannot really justify there religion.

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