Pope Innocent III (circa 1160 - 1216 ) wrote at Fourth Lateran Council (a.k.a. the General Council of Lateran, and the Great Council)
"There is but one universal Church of the faithful, outside of which no one at all can be saved."
Pope Eugene IV, (1388-1447 AD)
"The Council of Florence (AD 1438-1445)," at: http://www.catholicism.org/pages/florence.htm
"It [the Church] firmly believes, professes, and proclaims that those not living within the Catholic Church, not only pagans, but also Jews and heretics and schismatics cannot become participants in eternal life, but will depart 'into everlasting fire which was prepared for the devil and his angels' [Matt. 25:41], unless before the end of life the same have been added to the flock; and that the unity of the ecclesiastical body is so strong that only to those remaining in it are the sacraments of the Church of benefit for salvation, and do fastings, almsgiving, and other functions of piety and exercises of Christian service produce eternal reward, and that no one, whatever almsgiving he has practiced, even if he has shed blood for the name of Christ, can be saved, unless he has remained in the bosom and unity of the Catholic Church."
Pope Boniface VIII (1235-1303 CE) promulgated a Papal Bull in 1302 CE titled Unam Sanctam (One Holy).
"Urged by faith, we are obliged to believe and to maintain that the Church is one, holy, catholic, and also apostolic. We believe in her firmly and we confess with simplicity that outside of her there is neither salvation nor the remission of sins….
Furthermore, we declare, we proclaim, we define that it is absolutely necessary for salvation that every human creature be subject to the Roman Pontiff."
Are there only Catholics in heaven? Popes say yes!
Moderator: Moderators
Re: Are there only Catholics in heaven? Popes say yes!
Post #2Your “Roman Pontiff�, got his position of power, of being the Pontifex Maximus, through the “beast with two horns like a lamb�, Constantine, who instituted the pope’s Roman church as his convened Council of Nicaea. Constantine was passed that position down through the Augustus Caesars, who got it from Julius Caesar, the 5th head of the beast of Revelation 17:10, who usurped that position of being head of the gods and calendar, from the pagan head priests. Any one “hanging� on to the heir of Peter, which is claimed by the pope, “in that day�, such as the day of the LORD, will be “cut off� (Isaiah 22:25). I would say, you don’t want to be too close to the pope, or to Peter, the “worthless shepherd� of Zechariah 11:16-17. The Roman heads of the beast, got their authority through the "dragon"/Satan (Revelation 13:4). Ergo, the pope gets his power from Satan. No one has gone from the grave to heaven, even Mary, despite what the pope says. The next step in the progression is the millennium, and those with the mark of the beast remain in their graves (Revelation 20:4).
-
Elijah John
- Savant
- Posts: 12235
- Joined: Mon Oct 28, 2013 8:23 pm
- Location: New England
- Has thanked: 11 times
- Been thanked: 16 times
Post #3
[Replying to post 1 by polonius.advice]
Moderator Action
Please formulate a question for, or a point of debate. Otherwise this thread will remain in Random Ramblings.
______________
Moderator actions indicate that a thread/post has been locked, moved, merged, or split.
Moderator Action
Please formulate a question for, or a point of debate. Otherwise this thread will remain in Random Ramblings.
______________
Moderator actions indicate that a thread/post has been locked, moved, merged, or split.
My theological positions:
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
-God created us in His image, not the other way around.
-The Bible is redeemed by it's good parts.
-Pure monotheism, simple repentance.
-YHVH is LORD
-The real Jesus is not God, the real YHVH is not a monster.
-Eternal life is a gift from the Living God.
-Keep the Commandments, keep your salvation.
-I have accepted YHVH as my Heavenly Father, LORD and Savior.
I am inspired by Jesus to worship none but YHVH, and to serve only Him.
Re: Are there only Catholics in heaven? Popes say yes!
Post #4[Replying to post 1 by polonius.advice]
Innocent said this before there were any Methodists. Surely there is a Methodist heaven too. some of my best friends are METHODISTS. If there are no Methodists in heaven I DON'T WANT TO GO THERE.
Innocent said this before there were any Methodists. Surely there is a Methodist heaven too. some of my best friends are METHODISTS. If there are no Methodists in heaven I DON'T WANT TO GO THERE.
-
dianaiad
- Site Supporter
- Posts: 10220
- Joined: Sun Oct 24, 2010 12:30 pm
- Location: Southern California
Post #5
Moderator Commentshowme wrote:Your “Roman Pontiff�, got his position of power, of being the Pontifex Maximus, through the “beast with two horns like a lamb�, Constantine, who instituted the pope’s Roman church as his convened Council of Nicaea. Constantine was passed that position down through the Augustus Caesars, who got it from Julius Caesar, the 5th head of the beast of Revelation 17:10, who usurped that position of being head of the gods and calendar, from the pagan head priests. Any one “hanging� on to the heir of Peter, which is claimed by the pope, “in that day�, such as the day of the LORD, will be “cut off� (Isaiah 22:25). I would say, you don’t want to be too close to the pope, or to Peter, the “worthless shepherd� of Zechariah 11:16-17. The Roman heads of the beast, got their authority through the "dragon"/Satan (Revelation 13:4). Ergo, the pope gets his power from Satan. No one has gone from the grave to heaven, even Mary, despite what the pope says. The next step in the progression is the millennium, and those with the mark of the beast remain in their graves (Revelation 20:4).
Be careful. Statements like "Ergo, the pope gets his power from Satan." When your conclusion is based upon a begged question "Your “Roman Pontiff�, got his position of power, of being the Pontifex Maximus, through the “beast with two horns like a lamb�, Constantine, who instituted the pope’s Roman church as his convened Council of Nicaea. " it can come across as unfounded bigotry. It was certainly not necessary to your point.
Please review the Rules.
______________
Moderator comments do not count as a strike against any posters. They only serve as an acknowledgment that a post report has been received, but has not been judged to warrant a moderator warning against a particular poster. Any challenges or replies to moderator postings should be made via Private Message to avoid derailing topics.
Last edited by dianaiad on Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-
WebersHome
- Guru
- Posts: 1789
- Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 9:10 am
- Location: Oregon
- Been thanked: 24 times
Post #6
[font=Verdana]-
Roman Catholics cannot be guaranteed a fail-safe passage to heaven due to a number of factors; one of which is mortal sin.
According to the Catechism, (CCC 1035), Catholics are just inches from the sum of all fears, because if it should happen that they leave this life with just one(1) un-absolved mortal sin, they go directly to Hell and eternal suffering; no stop-over in a purgatory. No, their trip is a direct flight. Even if they've been a faithful Catholic for 49 years, they will miss the boat just as if they had been a Hindu, or a Muslim, or an atheist. All their years as a faithful Catholic will be stricken from the record and count for naught.
Another factor is perseverance.
According to the Council of Trent, (Session 6, Chapter 16, Canon16), if anyone says that he will for certain, with an absolute and infallible certainty, have that great gift of perseverance even to the end, unless he shall have learned this by a special revelation, let him be anathema.
Roman Catholicism is a difficult religion. In order for its followers to obtain a passing grade they have to consistently comply with everything in the Catechism, plus all of Rome's traditions, and every Bull, every Holy Day of Obligation, every Encyclical plus all of the Sermon On The Mount and everything taught in the epistles of Paul, Peter, James, Jude, and John; along with every ruling of Rome's Church Councils including Nicaea 1 & 2, Constantinople 1 & 2 & 3, Ephesus, Chalcedon, Lateran 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 5, Lyons 1 & 2, Vienne, Constance, Florence, Trent, and Vaticans 1 & 2.
/[/font]
Roman Catholics cannot be guaranteed a fail-safe passage to heaven due to a number of factors; one of which is mortal sin.
According to the Catechism, (CCC 1035), Catholics are just inches from the sum of all fears, because if it should happen that they leave this life with just one(1) un-absolved mortal sin, they go directly to Hell and eternal suffering; no stop-over in a purgatory. No, their trip is a direct flight. Even if they've been a faithful Catholic for 49 years, they will miss the boat just as if they had been a Hindu, or a Muslim, or an atheist. All their years as a faithful Catholic will be stricken from the record and count for naught.
Another factor is perseverance.
According to the Council of Trent, (Session 6, Chapter 16, Canon16), if anyone says that he will for certain, with an absolute and infallible certainty, have that great gift of perseverance even to the end, unless he shall have learned this by a special revelation, let him be anathema.
Roman Catholicism is a difficult religion. In order for its followers to obtain a passing grade they have to consistently comply with everything in the Catechism, plus all of Rome's traditions, and every Bull, every Holy Day of Obligation, every Encyclical plus all of the Sermon On The Mount and everything taught in the epistles of Paul, Peter, James, Jude, and John; along with every ruling of Rome's Church Councils including Nicaea 1 & 2, Constantinople 1 & 2 & 3, Ephesus, Chalcedon, Lateran 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & 5, Lyons 1 & 2, Vienne, Constance, Florence, Trent, and Vaticans 1 & 2.
/[/font]
-
RightReason
- Under Probation
- Posts: 1569
- Joined: Sat May 20, 2017 6:26 pm
- Been thanked: 16 times
Post #7
[Replying to WebersHome]
“The Christian ideal has not been tried and found wanting. It has been found difficult; and left untried.� ― G.K. Chesterton
A bit oversimplified. The beauty of the Catholic Church is the prodigal son is always welcome to come home.
*************
This whole thing about what we “ought� to do and whether it’s worth doing comes down to two things: the true and the good. If Catholicism—or any religion for that matter—is true and if it is good for us then we ought to want it; and we ought to do it. After all, we want everything else that is true and good. Nobody likes to be lied to, and nobody wants to be unhappy. We want to live in the real world; and we want to be happy while we’re at it.
This is precisely what the Catholic Church teaches. It promises to be the indestructible “pillar and bulwark of truth� as the one institution established and empowered by God himself. It also promises hope in this life, and everlasting joy in the next to those who persevere in love. Sounds like a good deal; if it’s true.
Why be Catholic? Because to be Catholic is to be in full union with the one thing that can make you most sane and most happy. A tall claim, to be sure; but it’s not an arrogant claim. It’s a truth claim. I am Catholic because I am convinced the Church is the only place I will find the fullness of truth and joy. That’s why I’m Catholic: because I believe Catholicism is true.
G.K. Chesterton believed that often the first step for a convert is the decision to be fair to the Catholic Church. That’s right—fair. All too often those who are skeptical towards Catholicism are quick to give their objections and are, perhaps, too caught up in admiration of their own objection to hear the Catholic response. In effect, the skeptic becomes like the golfer who is too busy admiring his long drive to realize it’s headed straight for the water trap—the golfer who looks away in self-contentment before he sees where his ball is about to land. The water trap gets the best of the long drive; but the golfer isn’t paying attention.
Catholicism is both logical and evidence-based; but most skeptics just haven’t been listening. Shortly after his full entrance into the Catholic Church, Chesterton wrote in his book The Catholic Church and Conversion:
“It is impossible to be just to the Catholic Church. The moment a man ceases to pull against it he feels a tug towards it. The moment he ceases to shout it down he begins to listen to it with pleasure. The moment he tries to be fair to it he begins to be fond of it.�
https://www.wordonfire.org/resources/bl ... olic/5262/
Catholics do not believe they are guaranteed a fail-safe passage to heaven. This has never been taught.Roman Catholics cannot be guaranteed a fail-safe passage to heaven
This is partly true, however I have a suspicion you don’t entirely understand what is meant by mortal sin and you also fail to take into account the Church’s teaching on perfect contrition/true repentance (regardless of having received the Sacrament of Confession), and you seem to be forgetting about what the Church teaches about God’s love and mercy.According to the Catechism, (CCC 1035), Catholics are just inches from the sum of all fears, because if it should happen that they leave this life with just one(1) un-absolved mortal sin, they go directly to Hell and eternal suffering; no stop-over in a purgatory. No, their trip is a direct flight. Even if they've been a faithful Catholic for 49 years, they will miss the boat just as if they had been a Hindu, or a Muslim, or an atheist. All their years as a faithful Catholic will be stricken from the record and count for naught.
Yes, but not for the reasons you believe . . .Roman Catholicism is a difficult religion.
“The Christian ideal has not been tried and found wanting. It has been found difficult; and left untried.� ― G.K. Chesterton
In order for its followers to obtain a passing grade they have to consistently comply with everything in the Catechism . . .
A bit oversimplified. The beauty of the Catholic Church is the prodigal son is always welcome to come home.
*************
This whole thing about what we “ought� to do and whether it’s worth doing comes down to two things: the true and the good. If Catholicism—or any religion for that matter—is true and if it is good for us then we ought to want it; and we ought to do it. After all, we want everything else that is true and good. Nobody likes to be lied to, and nobody wants to be unhappy. We want to live in the real world; and we want to be happy while we’re at it.
This is precisely what the Catholic Church teaches. It promises to be the indestructible “pillar and bulwark of truth� as the one institution established and empowered by God himself. It also promises hope in this life, and everlasting joy in the next to those who persevere in love. Sounds like a good deal; if it’s true.
Why be Catholic? Because to be Catholic is to be in full union with the one thing that can make you most sane and most happy. A tall claim, to be sure; but it’s not an arrogant claim. It’s a truth claim. I am Catholic because I am convinced the Church is the only place I will find the fullness of truth and joy. That’s why I’m Catholic: because I believe Catholicism is true.
G.K. Chesterton believed that often the first step for a convert is the decision to be fair to the Catholic Church. That’s right—fair. All too often those who are skeptical towards Catholicism are quick to give their objections and are, perhaps, too caught up in admiration of their own objection to hear the Catholic response. In effect, the skeptic becomes like the golfer who is too busy admiring his long drive to realize it’s headed straight for the water trap—the golfer who looks away in self-contentment before he sees where his ball is about to land. The water trap gets the best of the long drive; but the golfer isn’t paying attention.
Catholicism is both logical and evidence-based; but most skeptics just haven’t been listening. Shortly after his full entrance into the Catholic Church, Chesterton wrote in his book The Catholic Church and Conversion:
“It is impossible to be just to the Catholic Church. The moment a man ceases to pull against it he feels a tug towards it. The moment he ceases to shout it down he begins to listen to it with pleasure. The moment he tries to be fair to it he begins to be fond of it.�
https://www.wordonfire.org/resources/bl ... olic/5262/
-
RightReason
- Under Probation
- Posts: 1569
- Joined: Sat May 20, 2017 6:26 pm
- Been thanked: 16 times
Re: Are there only Catholics in heaven? Popes say yes!
Post #8[Replying to post 1 by polonius.advice]
This is true, but probably not in the way you think. The Church is very clear that non Catholics can be saved. However, that salvation will come by way of the Church. Hope that helps."There is but one universal Church of the faithful, outside of which no one at all can be saved."
-
WebersHome
- Guru
- Posts: 1789
- Joined: Sun Jan 10, 2016 9:10 am
- Location: Oregon
- Been thanked: 24 times
Re: Are there any Catholics is heaven?
Post #9[font=Verdana]-
In the passages below, note the grammatical tense of the "have" verbs. They're in the present tense; not future, indicating that believers have eternal life right now-- no delay, and no waiting period.
â—� John 3:36 . . He who believes in the Son has eternal life
â—� John 6:47 . .Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes has eternal life.
â—� John 5:24 . . I assure you, those who heed my message, and trust in God who sent me, have eternal life. They will never be condemned for their sins, but they have already passed from Death into Life.
â—� 1John 5:13 . . I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.
According to those passages, people lacking eternal life, are lacking it because 1) they are unbelievers, 2) they are not paying attention to Christ's message, and 3) they don't trust God.
The possession of eternal life is very crucial because according to God's testimony, as an expert witness in all matters pertaining to Christianity; people lacking eternal life do not have God's son. In other words: they are currently quite christless.
â—� 1John 5:11-12 . . This is what God has testified: He has given us eternal life, and this life is in His son. So whoever has God's son has this life; and whosoever does not have this life, does not have His son.
People that argue with God's testimony, are insinuating that He not only doesn't know what He's talking about, but also that God is a dishonest person of marginal integrity who can't be trusted to tell the truth.
â—� 1John 5:10 . .Whoever does not believe God has made him a liar by not believing the testimony God has given about His son.
When people do that-- when they insinuate that God is dishonest --they imply that He belongs in hell because according to Rev 21:8, hell is where all liars are destined.
Anyway; I should think that it goes without saying that christless people are in grave danger of the sum of all fears.
â—� Rom 8:9 . . If anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ.
We can be sure that there are millions of christless people throughout the world; but are there any christless Christians? Well; for starters: Roman Catholicism-- known everywhere as the largest single denomination in the world --currently consists of approximately 1.2 billion followers who all, to a man, including the Pope, insist that nobody obtains eternal life till sometime after they die and cross over to the other side.
Well; that can mean but one thing, and one thing only: seeing as how those 1.2 billion souls are currently lacking eternal life, then according to God's expert testimony they are currently Christians without Christ, and they will pass on without Christ; you can safely apply that rule to any, and all, denominations, religions, and/or spiritual ideologies insisting that eternal life cannot be obtained prior to one's demise.
/[/font]
In the passages below, note the grammatical tense of the "have" verbs. They're in the present tense; not future, indicating that believers have eternal life right now-- no delay, and no waiting period.
â—� John 3:36 . . He who believes in the Son has eternal life
â—� John 6:47 . .Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes has eternal life.
â—� John 5:24 . . I assure you, those who heed my message, and trust in God who sent me, have eternal life. They will never be condemned for their sins, but they have already passed from Death into Life.
â—� 1John 5:13 . . I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life.
According to those passages, people lacking eternal life, are lacking it because 1) they are unbelievers, 2) they are not paying attention to Christ's message, and 3) they don't trust God.
The possession of eternal life is very crucial because according to God's testimony, as an expert witness in all matters pertaining to Christianity; people lacking eternal life do not have God's son. In other words: they are currently quite christless.
â—� 1John 5:11-12 . . This is what God has testified: He has given us eternal life, and this life is in His son. So whoever has God's son has this life; and whosoever does not have this life, does not have His son.
People that argue with God's testimony, are insinuating that He not only doesn't know what He's talking about, but also that God is a dishonest person of marginal integrity who can't be trusted to tell the truth.
â—� 1John 5:10 . .Whoever does not believe God has made him a liar by not believing the testimony God has given about His son.
When people do that-- when they insinuate that God is dishonest --they imply that He belongs in hell because according to Rev 21:8, hell is where all liars are destined.
Anyway; I should think that it goes without saying that christless people are in grave danger of the sum of all fears.
â—� Rom 8:9 . . If anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he does not belong to Christ.
We can be sure that there are millions of christless people throughout the world; but are there any christless Christians? Well; for starters: Roman Catholicism-- known everywhere as the largest single denomination in the world --currently consists of approximately 1.2 billion followers who all, to a man, including the Pope, insist that nobody obtains eternal life till sometime after they die and cross over to the other side.
Well; that can mean but one thing, and one thing only: seeing as how those 1.2 billion souls are currently lacking eternal life, then according to God's expert testimony they are currently Christians without Christ, and they will pass on without Christ; you can safely apply that rule to any, and all, denominations, religions, and/or spiritual ideologies insisting that eternal life cannot be obtained prior to one's demise.
/[/font]
-
RightReason
- Under Probation
- Posts: 1569
- Joined: Sat May 20, 2017 6:26 pm
- Been thanked: 16 times
Re: Are there any Catholics is heaven?
Post #10[Replying to post 9 by WebersHome]
https://chnetwork.org/2017/07/05/saved- ... -question/
https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print ... ed-if-only
Jesus Christ came to give us much more than a kind of eternal fire insurance policy. Salvation in the fullest sense is an ongoing process that won’t be complete until after we die. And in the meantime, it’s still possible to turn away again from God.
When someone asks us, then, whether we’re “saved,� perhaps the best short answer is this: “Well, I’m doing what the Apostle Paul tells us to do in the Bible: I’m ‘working out’ my salvation day by day� (see Phil 2:12).
If we want to follow up on that statement, we can assure the inquirer that we do in fact have faith in Jesus Christ, that we recognize Him as our Savior and Lord, and that our goal is to be counted one day among the saints in heaven.
Why did God create us in the first place? He made us in certain ways like Himself, able to think and choose, so we could be sons and daughters who live in friendship with Him. God created us for Himself, for nothing less than to know, love, serve and enjoy Him — now and forever.
Through sin, however, we’ve rebelled against God and rejected His friendship. As a result, His likeness in us has been marred, and we’ve separated ourselves from Him. Since He’s the Source of all that’s good, such separation can lead only to misery in both this life and the next.
Because God loved us so much, He sent His Son, Jesus Christ, to save us from such a terrible fate. The life, death and resurrection of Jesus offer us, through the forgiveness of our sins, escape from eternal punishment.
But that’s not all. He also reconciles us to God, opening the door to a full restoration of our friendship with Him.
In this way, Jesus begins the process of a complete renewal of God’s likeness in us, a healing of the brokenness that comes from sin. So salvation isn’t just a way to avoid hell, nor is it just a past event.
On the contrary: Salvation in its fullness is God’s new creation. To save us, He remakes us in His likeness — a lifelong process requiring our cooperation — so that we can once again think and love as He thinks and loves. This process finds its completion only in heaven, where eternal life is enjoyed in perfect harmony with Him.
https://chnetwork.org/2017/07/05/saved- ... -question/
The Greek word for knowledge (Gk. eideitei) in 1 John 5:13 does not necessarily equate to absolute certainty. We use the verb know the same way in English. For example, I may say I know I am going to get an A on my Greek exam tomorrow. Does that mean I have metaphysical certainty of this? Not at all. What I mean and what the verb know can be used to indicate is that I have confidence that I will get an A on my test tomorrow because I have studied the material thoroughly and I know it well.
Our salvation is contingent upon many things according to the Bible. This indicates the certainty of our salvation is not absolute. Just a few examples include 1 John 1:8-9: "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness." The text says we will be forgiven if. Thus, the sobering truth is: Unconfessed sin will not be forgiven. And the Bible is very clear that no sin can enter into heaven (see Hb 1:13; Rv 21:8-9, 27).
•1 Corinthians 15:1-2: Now I would remind you, brethren, in what terms I preached to you the gospel, which you received, in which you stand, by which you are saved, if you hold it fast—unless you believed in vain. (See also Matthew 24:44-51; Luke 12:41-46; Romans 11:22; Hebrews 3:6;14; Revelation 2:10; 25-26; 3:1-5; 22:18-19, for many more "ifs" and contingency clauses.)
•Colossians 1:21-23: And you, who once were estranged and hostile in mind, doing evil deeds, he has now reconciled in his body of flesh by his death, in order to present you holy and blameless and irreproachable before him, provided that you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel which you heard . . .
•2 Peter 2:20-22: For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overpowered, the last state has become worse for them than the first . . . It has happened to them according to the true proverb, the dog turns back to his own vomit, and the sow is washed only to wallow in the mire.
Once saved does not mean always saved. In Matthew 6:15, Jesus tells us that "if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses." It does not matter how "born again" one may be or how many experiences one has had, if he does not forgive others, he will not be forgiven, according to the text. And remember—as we have seen—no sin can enter into heaven (cf. Hb 1:13, Rv 21:27). Further, the Bible says we can "fall from grace" (Gal 5:1-5, Heb 12:14-16), be "cut off" from the vine from which we receive divine life (Jn 15:1-6, Rom 11:18-22), have our names removed from the Lamb’s book of life (Rv 22:19), and it assures us over and over again that if we commit certain sins and we do not repent of them, we will not go to heaven (cf. 1 Cor 6:9-11, Gal 5:19, Eph 5:3-5, Rv 21:6-8).
The Bible uses the same Greek word for confess, homologeitai, in multiple places and emphasizes we must continue to confess Christ if we are going to be finally saved. For example, in Matthew 10:22, 32 Jesus says, "You will be hated by all because of my name, but it is the one who has endured to the end who will be saved.. . . Therefore everyone who confesses me before men, I will also confess him before my father who is in heaven. . . ." (NAB). The context here is one of holding fast to our confession until death (see also 2 Tm 2:12 and Heb 4:14; 10:23-26).
Finally, confessing Christ is done not only in word, but also in deed: "If any one does not provide for his relatives, and especially for his own family, he has disowned the faith and is worse than an unbeliever" (1 Tm 5:8).
Notice, the man who neglects his family for selfish pursuits denies Christ in his actions. And as we have seen, the Bible records in many places extensive lists of sins whereby we can deny Christ, such as 1 Corinthians 6:9-10: "Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor sexual perverts, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God." Scripture never says the saved can do these things and still go to heaven.
https://chnetwork.org/2017/07/05/saved- ... -question/
As is evident the Catholic understanding of salvation is the more all encompassing of all we can know from Scripture.
With good reason. It is all Scriptural. A reading of Scripture as a whole is essential in understanding Christianity. Here’s a little you left out. See link for full articles.We can be sure that there are millions of christless people throughout the world; but are there any christless Christians? Well; for starters: Roman Catholicism-- known everywhere as the largest single denomination in the world --currently consists of approximately 1.2 billion followers who all, to a man, including the Pope, insist that nobody obtains eternal life till sometime after they die and cross over to the other side.
https://chnetwork.org/2017/07/05/saved- ... -question/
https://www.catholic.com/magazine/print ... ed-if-only
Jesus Christ came to give us much more than a kind of eternal fire insurance policy. Salvation in the fullest sense is an ongoing process that won’t be complete until after we die. And in the meantime, it’s still possible to turn away again from God.
When someone asks us, then, whether we’re “saved,� perhaps the best short answer is this: “Well, I’m doing what the Apostle Paul tells us to do in the Bible: I’m ‘working out’ my salvation day by day� (see Phil 2:12).
If we want to follow up on that statement, we can assure the inquirer that we do in fact have faith in Jesus Christ, that we recognize Him as our Savior and Lord, and that our goal is to be counted one day among the saints in heaven.
Why did God create us in the first place? He made us in certain ways like Himself, able to think and choose, so we could be sons and daughters who live in friendship with Him. God created us for Himself, for nothing less than to know, love, serve and enjoy Him — now and forever.
Through sin, however, we’ve rebelled against God and rejected His friendship. As a result, His likeness in us has been marred, and we’ve separated ourselves from Him. Since He’s the Source of all that’s good, such separation can lead only to misery in both this life and the next.
Because God loved us so much, He sent His Son, Jesus Christ, to save us from such a terrible fate. The life, death and resurrection of Jesus offer us, through the forgiveness of our sins, escape from eternal punishment.
But that’s not all. He also reconciles us to God, opening the door to a full restoration of our friendship with Him.
In this way, Jesus begins the process of a complete renewal of God’s likeness in us, a healing of the brokenness that comes from sin. So salvation isn’t just a way to avoid hell, nor is it just a past event.
On the contrary: Salvation in its fullness is God’s new creation. To save us, He remakes us in His likeness — a lifelong process requiring our cooperation — so that we can once again think and love as He thinks and loves. This process finds its completion only in heaven, where eternal life is enjoyed in perfect harmony with Him.
https://chnetwork.org/2017/07/05/saved- ... -question/
The Greek word for knowledge (Gk. eideitei) in 1 John 5:13 does not necessarily equate to absolute certainty. We use the verb know the same way in English. For example, I may say I know I am going to get an A on my Greek exam tomorrow. Does that mean I have metaphysical certainty of this? Not at all. What I mean and what the verb know can be used to indicate is that I have confidence that I will get an A on my test tomorrow because I have studied the material thoroughly and I know it well.
Our salvation is contingent upon many things according to the Bible. This indicates the certainty of our salvation is not absolute. Just a few examples include 1 John 1:8-9: "If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just, and will forgive our sins and cleanse us from all unrighteousness." The text says we will be forgiven if. Thus, the sobering truth is: Unconfessed sin will not be forgiven. And the Bible is very clear that no sin can enter into heaven (see Hb 1:13; Rv 21:8-9, 27).
•1 Corinthians 15:1-2: Now I would remind you, brethren, in what terms I preached to you the gospel, which you received, in which you stand, by which you are saved, if you hold it fast—unless you believed in vain. (See also Matthew 24:44-51; Luke 12:41-46; Romans 11:22; Hebrews 3:6;14; Revelation 2:10; 25-26; 3:1-5; 22:18-19, for many more "ifs" and contingency clauses.)
•Colossians 1:21-23: And you, who once were estranged and hostile in mind, doing evil deeds, he has now reconciled in his body of flesh by his death, in order to present you holy and blameless and irreproachable before him, provided that you continue in the faith, stable and steadfast, not shifting from the hope of the gospel which you heard . . .
•2 Peter 2:20-22: For if, after they have escaped the defilements of the world through the knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ, they are again entangled in them and overpowered, the last state has become worse for them than the first . . . It has happened to them according to the true proverb, the dog turns back to his own vomit, and the sow is washed only to wallow in the mire.
Once saved does not mean always saved. In Matthew 6:15, Jesus tells us that "if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses." It does not matter how "born again" one may be or how many experiences one has had, if he does not forgive others, he will not be forgiven, according to the text. And remember—as we have seen—no sin can enter into heaven (cf. Hb 1:13, Rv 21:27). Further, the Bible says we can "fall from grace" (Gal 5:1-5, Heb 12:14-16), be "cut off" from the vine from which we receive divine life (Jn 15:1-6, Rom 11:18-22), have our names removed from the Lamb’s book of life (Rv 22:19), and it assures us over and over again that if we commit certain sins and we do not repent of them, we will not go to heaven (cf. 1 Cor 6:9-11, Gal 5:19, Eph 5:3-5, Rv 21:6-8).
The Bible uses the same Greek word for confess, homologeitai, in multiple places and emphasizes we must continue to confess Christ if we are going to be finally saved. For example, in Matthew 10:22, 32 Jesus says, "You will be hated by all because of my name, but it is the one who has endured to the end who will be saved.. . . Therefore everyone who confesses me before men, I will also confess him before my father who is in heaven. . . ." (NAB). The context here is one of holding fast to our confession until death (see also 2 Tm 2:12 and Heb 4:14; 10:23-26).
Finally, confessing Christ is done not only in word, but also in deed: "If any one does not provide for his relatives, and especially for his own family, he has disowned the faith and is worse than an unbeliever" (1 Tm 5:8).
Notice, the man who neglects his family for selfish pursuits denies Christ in his actions. And as we have seen, the Bible records in many places extensive lists of sins whereby we can deny Christ, such as 1 Corinthians 6:9-10: "Do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor sexual perverts, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor robbers will inherit the kingdom of God." Scripture never says the saved can do these things and still go to heaven.
https://chnetwork.org/2017/07/05/saved- ... -question/
As is evident the Catholic understanding of salvation is the more all encompassing of all we can know from Scripture.
