Republican VS Kingdom

Two hot topics for the price of one

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Yusef
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Republican VS Kingdom

Post #1

Post by Yusef »

Hi,
Now in each one of the countries we see a method of government,
We want to know which one is truer!
And Why/How!?

Well,
according to those studies i've gotten/read/researched, at all Kingdom is truer, because:
Shia/Islam:
Means Doctrine of Shia/Islam that claims is the Real Islam but is miscarried versus false islam means Sunni/islam, by/through REPUBLICATION!
Well, take a wall:

1- Qur'an says: ".Al-Nasso Aktharihum La Ya'qilun.."
[..the people, most of them don't know/think/realize..]
Well, these those fools determine Fate of a nation!
in the REPUBLICATION

2- God SelectED Ali[pbuh] to kingdom of Muslims, but people selected abubakr through republication!
and you see advantage of that today: ISIS, Syria, Genocide of Ottoman, Terrorism, etc.

Well,
We are plenty sure that we need to a King from God that govern like a man of God, but we do know that there isn't one but coming the Saviour and or those a few mans whom have introduced to us through Ahadith...

Well, When even those elected aren't existed now, what will be our task!!?
Real Shia Scholars say: we should select a king and help him to kingdom until the Saviour come..

Well, this was an opinion from our religion,
Tell us your own opinion and tell if our opinion is wrong that we agree and accept that
I assume your beliefs are the better! Well, be soldier of God and convert me. By your own reasonings also tell me my wrong beliefs and why..>> :study:

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Re: Kingdom vs Republican

Post #11

Post by 2ndRateMind »

[Replying to post 10 by 2ndRateMind]

I think, so far as the West is concerned, we tend to think that, just as how to vote should be an individual choice, so we now think that which religion to follow, if any at all, should also be an individual choice. They are matters of conscience, to be decided by an individual's conscience, not inflicted upon them, wholly or partly, by any state or religious powers that be, that they may fundamentally disagree with.

We have discovered, over the course of history, that any other system leads to vexatious conflict and destructive war, national and civil, and we think such outcomes best avoided.

So we tend to opt for a secular democratic republic, when we have the power to make that choice.

Best wishes, 2RM.
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Post #12

Post by Bust Nak »

I'd rather be governed by a wise and beneviolent dictator than the typical democratic government. But I don't fancy the odds of finding such a wise and beneviolent dictator, and being a theocrat is a deal breaking for "wise and beneviolent."

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Post #13

Post by 2ndRateMind »

[Replying to post 12 by Bust Nak]

And I'd rather anarchy, but only if everyone loved God, and everyone else, as Jesus recommended. Meanwhile we just have to stagger on towards universal enlightenment, as best we can.

Best wishes, 2RM.
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Post #14

Post by Bust Nak »

[Replying to post 13 by 2ndRateMind]

So rather than one beneviolent and wise person that's hard enough to find already, you need billions of beneviolent and wise people. That's gonna be a tall order.

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Post #15

Post by 2ndRateMind »

Bust Nak wrote: [Replying to post 13 by 2ndRateMind]

So rather than one beneviolent and wise person that's hard enough to find already, you need billions of beneviolent and wise people. That's gonna be a tall order.
I agree! Seems to me that whenever someone wants power over others, that should be an automatic disqualification criterion. Getting the world to the state where nobody wants power over others is going to be a long, slow process...

Best wishes, 2RM.
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Re: Kingdom vs Republican

Post #16

Post by Yusef »

2ndRateMind wrote:
Yusef wrote: [Replying to 2ndRateMind]
You thought i meant a leader/king/president should look at the poors specially!!
Well,
i didn't mean leaders must look at poors!!
...
i meant those leaders WHOM have/carry The Religion in their own government, those HAVE TO/MUST be such as poorest people of those nations! even if 99% of that nation be richest people of the world!
Interesting. Why do you think a political and/or religious leader should be poor, if it is not to understand the poor, s...
�👻 I don't know what secular democratic or etc is..
don't know anything about politic..
I don't know and don't want to know/study/learn..
because any time i wanna give to study that, instead of that i go to read/study Religious[Whole Science] more and more... to get my this world and next world.

2) You say it's not necessary that a leader/president be poor to realize what life poor have..
take a wall i means it's not important that a leader/president realizes poors truly or not,
but when he governs within coverage of The Religion, he HAVE TO/MUST be poorest person of that country! According to doctrines of the religion!
it's not clear!?
I assume your beliefs are the better! Well, be soldier of God and convert me. By your own reasonings also tell me my wrong beliefs and why..>> :study:

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Re: Kingdom vs Republican

Post #17

Post by 2ndRateMind »

Yusef wrote:
...
2) You say it's not necessary that a leader/president be poor to realize what life poor have..
take a wall i means it's not important that a leader/president realizes poors truly or not,
but when he governs within coverage of The Religion, he HAVE TO/MUST be poorest person of that country! According to doctrines of the religion!
it's not clear!?
Hmmm. Yusef, I would say that it is absolutely necessary that a leader should be in the same state as his/her people, so that he/she can relate to the people, and understand them, and the urgency to do what he/she can to improve their state. If that means being as poor as the poorest he/she governs, then he/she should be that poor.

What worries me about many religions, though, is that they lay down doctrine but never actually bother to explain why that doctrine is right and good. I'm the contrary sort of person that wants to know that, or else I will rebel against those doctrines and that religion.

Best wishes, 2RM.
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Re: Kingdom vs Republican

Post #18

Post by 2ndRateMind »

Yusef wrote:
2ndRateMind wrote:
Yusef wrote: [Replying to 2ndRateMind]
You thought i meant a leader/king/president should look at the poors specially!!
Well,
i didn't mean leaders must look at poors!!
...
i meant those leaders WHOM have/carry The Religion in their own government, those HAVE TO/MUST be such as poorest people of those nations! even if 99% of that nation be richest people of the world!
Interesting. Why do you think a political and/or religious leader should be poor, if it is not to understand the poor, s...
�👻 I don't know what secular democratic or etc is..
don't know anything about politic..
I don't know and don't want to know/study/learn..
because any time i wanna give to study that, instead of that i go to read/study Religious[Whole Science] more and more... to get my this world and next world.
...
OK. Let me run this by you, Yusef, and see what you make of it. The world was made by God, to realise His purposes. Therefore, it stands to reason that if we learn about the world, we learn a little about God. And the more we learn about God, from whatever source, the more we increase our chances of gaining Paradise.

Best wishes, 2RM.
Non omnes qui errant pereunt
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Re: Kingdom vs Republican

Post #19

Post by Yusef »

[Replying to 2ndRateMind]First of all,
What your Religion is!?

2) i guess you are a Christian;
Well, we Shia have in our own Hadiths that Imam Redha[pbuh] said: "Prophet Jesus[pbuh] condemns Pharisees for their spiritual men are Riches take a while I live among you and my food is Leaves of Trees and Grasses of animals[may God forgive me for quote the same] and my lamp is the moon and my pillow is stones and my padding is clay/earth...
but I feel I'm the most needless people of the world..


Well,
This Hadith and those previous hadiths shows Islam[Shia] and Christianity both doctrines say our leaders/presidents should/must be poorest person of their own countries!
themselves and their teamworks! AT ALL!
even if their people be richest people of the world!
even if they in riching be able to realize the poors!
Because a real Spiritual/Priest king, claims thinks just for the next world! and has been king, just for help the people and Command of God!
Otherwise he is nothing but a Liar and Dajjal[Anti-Christ]
Unless he govern BEYOND coverage the Religion! Exact such as the last king of Iran or the better..

Am I wrong take a while i wrote these absolutely quoting! from the Religion!?
I assume your beliefs are the better! Well, be soldier of God and convert me. By your own reasonings also tell me my wrong beliefs and why..>> :study:

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Post #20

Post by bluethread »

2ndRateMind wrote: [Replying to post 12 by Bust Nak]

And I'd rather anarchy, but only if everyone loved God, and everyone else, as Jesus recommended. Meanwhile we just have to stagger on towards universal enlightenment, as best we can.

Best wishes, 2RM.
It appears that you are talking about localism, not anarchy. There is a difference. I understand your concern for one man having power over another. However, without structure there can be no love of either a deity or a human. When people think of theocracy, they picture it as oligorchy or monarchy, because they equate theocracy with centralized power. Though Adonai permits these, HaTorah does not prescribe them, but clearly warns of their dangers. There are many forms that theocracy can take. There is tribal theocracy, were there is no overarching authority, which appears to be what you are supporting. This I believe is quite dangerous, as can it compel one tribe to commit violence on another in the name of loving their particular deity.

I prefer constitutional theocracy. We see this played out under various governmental forms in the Tanakh. In all for those forms, from monarchy and oligarchy through tribalism, the emphasis was on local governance to as great an extent as possible.

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