Civil Debates on Christianity and Religions

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William
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 28, 2017 10:51 pm  Is the Biblical GOD really as some atheists argue? Reply with quote

This is a question going out to any people who - in their own ways follow after the biblical idea of GOD.

Recently I made a protest about an atheists attitude in relation to their interpretation of the biblical GOD.

The atheist claimed Christians were mindless slaves to a jealous God who lusts to rule over humans and demand that they worship and obey him

[Link To That Post]

My protest basically went along the lines that this was too sweeping a statement in which to base any honest argument on based upon the actual evidence both in the bible and from the behavior of people who call themselves Christians and have individual understandings as to what 'a jealous god' means, or what 'worship' means or whether the GOD actually 'lusts' for what the atheist accuses him of.

As can be read, my argument - as far as I am concern - is pretty solid on this, so I am putting it out there to those who specifically call themselves 'Christians' as to how you each see the GOD of the bible, why you see him that way and whether you believe there is any truth in the atheists claim, as sweeping as it is.

Q: Do you think you are a mindless slave to the biblical GOD?
(If not, then why not?)

Q: Do you think the bible GOD is a jealous GOD in the sense of the negative (being possessive for example) and if not (or if so) please say why you think this, as in, what do you understand it to mean.

Q: Do you think the biblical god 'lusts to rule over humans'?

Q: Do you think the biblical god demands that you worship and obey him?

Q: What do you personally see as 'worshiping GOD' and in what way do you feel that you have to obey him and why do you think that form of obedience is important?


Basically I would like as many answers as possible that a good indication of the overall Christian point of view might be better understood in relation to the biblical idea of GOD and how that might differ from the atheists claims regarding the nature of that god in relation to individual Christians as they interact with him in their own way.

I do not self identify as being a Christian myself, but as can be seen in my post [linked] , I personally do not and cannot see how the God of the Bible can be so grossly misrepresented (as I feel the atheist has done, and as I often see atheists doing) based on either the overall evidence in the bible itself as well as based on the overall evidence of Christian behavior in the world generally speaking.
Not to say that I am suggesting that people calling themselves 'Christians' cannot behave badly, but that behaving badly does not necessarily mean that they are being good Christians or reflecting a good witness to the biblical GOD.


Thank you.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 21: Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:07 am
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Re: Is the Biblical GOD really as some atheists argue?

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[Replying to post 20 by ttruscott]

If not accepting Jesus is a sin and most are hardened against it, how isn't God then responsible for that sin?

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 22: Mon Feb 11, 2019 8:09 am
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Re: Is the Biblical GOD really as some atheists argue?

Like this post (1): Sojournerofthearth
[[url=http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=953173#953173&sid=b43f
3cfc0ba43d62762de4b18d458562]Replying to post 19 by Sojournerofthearth[/url]]

When did Adam make an agreement with God?

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 23: Fri Feb 15, 2019 5:23 pm
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[Replying to post 22 by postroad]

Quote:
I'm not quite certain what that means either, however, the whole bible is about a covenant God made with Adam, who chose to make his own way... after making an agreement that he would go God's way.


Quote:
[[url=http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=953173#953173&sid=b43f
3cfc0ba43d62762de4b18d458562]Replying to post 19 by Sojournerofthearth[/url]]

When did Adam make an agreement with God?


mmmm.... that probably wasn't worded exactly right. Here's the thing, Christ came as what? The 2nd Adam. Why was he called that?

The Earth wasn't originally created for man. In fact there was an indeterminate amount of time between Genesis 1:1 and 1:2

In Job it says the Angels shouted for Joy when it was created,

"Where were you when I laid the foundations of the earth? Tell Me, if you have understanding. Who determined its measurements? Surely you know! Or who stretched the line upon it? To what were its foundations fastened? Or who laid its cornerstone, When the morning stars sang together, And all the sons of God (angels) shouted for joy? (Job 38:4-7 NKJV) Gen 1:1 says in the beginning, God Created the heavens and the Earth, but Genesis 1:2 said it was (interpretaion actually should read became) void and empty. Because in Psa 104:30 it says Thou sendest forth thy spirit, they are created: and thou renewest the face of the earth. And in Isaiah 45:18 KJV, it says For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the LORD; and there is none else.

So the angels shouted for joy because they were to inhabit the Earth. But it says in Jude 1:5-6 I will therefore put you in remembrance, though ye once knew this, how that the Lord, having saved the people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed them that believed not. And the angels which kept not their first estate, but left their own habitation, he hath reserved in everlasting chains under darkness unto the judgment of the great day.

And Eze 28 and Isa 14 tell you that Satan and the Angels were here on the Earth but turned on God. But God have given him a position of the ruler of the Earth. 2 Cor 4.4 calls him the god of this world and Eph 6:12 tells us we wrestle against spiritual wickedness in high places... in Mat 4:9 Satan tells Christ He will give him the whole world IF Christ will worship him... how could he say that unless it was his own to give?

So why was Christ the 2nd Adam? Because he did what Adam did not do... He overcame Satan to take rulership away from Lucifer. Adam was created to rule, to have dominion over the Earth in the place of Lucifer. The first Adam was supposed to take of the tree of life and rule the Earth.

God offered it also to the Children of Israel;

Behold, I have taught you statutes and judgments, even as the LORD my God commanded me, that ye should do so in the land whither ye go to possess it. Keep therefore and do them; for this is your wisdom and your understanding in the sight of the nations, which shall hear all these statutes, and say, Surely this great nation is a wise and understanding people. For what nation is there so great, who hath God so nigh unto them, as the LORD our God is in all things that we call upon him for? And what nation is there so great, that hath statutes and judgments so righteous as all this law, which I set before you this day? (Deuteronomy 4:5-8 KJV)

God would have told Adam at least part of that when He explained why they should not take of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil in the Garden. But just like Lucifer, Adam wanted to make his own way and decide for himself what is good and what is evil...

So Adam was also cast out from God's presence.

As I told you before, God has a plan that includes all of mankind... the living and the dead. Its the same plan from the day the Angels shouted for Joy at the creation of the Universe.

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 24: Fri Feb 15, 2019 9:40 pm
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Re: Is the Biblical GOD really as some atheists argue?

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[Replying to post 23 by Sojournerofthearth]

The Angels first estate wasn't the earth. Their punishment was for leaving heaven having children with human women.

Genesis 6
[ Wickedness in the World ] When human beings began to increase in number on the earth and daughters were born to them, the sons of God saw that the daughters of humans were beautiful, and they married any of them they chose. Then the Lord said, “My Spirit will not contend with humans forever, for they are mortal; their days will be a hundred and twenty years.” ...

Paul includes theis weakness of angels as part of the reason women should cover their head.

Angels neither die or reproduce. The earth is not their natural state.

You take a lot of liberties with the texts. Are you claiming divine revelation?

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 25: Fri Feb 15, 2019 9:44 pm
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[Replying to post 23 by Sojournerofthearth]

Jesus must have given both the authority of heaven and earth to
Satan after receiving it.

Revelation 13:6-8 New International Version (NIV)

6 It opened its mouth to blaspheme God, and to slander his name and his dwelling place and those who live in heaven. 7 It was given power to wage war against God’s holy people and to conquer them. And it was given authority over every tribe, people, language and nation. 8 All inhabitants of the earth will worship the beast—all whose names have not been written in the Lamb’s book of life, the Lamb who was slain from the creation of the world.[a]

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 26: Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:36 pm
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Re: Is the Biblical GOD really as some atheists argue?

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[Replying to post 24 by postroad]

having children with women?

Shocked

Anyway, much as i would love to get into this, something has come up and I'll have to get back with you on this...

Smile right Devine Revelation? Smile left
Tongue

Do You think I'm the only one who believes that?

Soj[/img]

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Post BBCode URL - Right click and save to clipboard to use later in post Post 27: Sat Feb 16, 2019 7:29 pm
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[Replying to post 26 by Sojournerofthearth]

That's what the texts indicate.

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