Paradise on Earth

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onewithhim
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Paradise on Earth

Post #1

Post by onewithhim »

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

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Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #1021

Post by onewithhim »

TSGracchus wrote: [Replying to onewithhim]
Read it again!
"And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever: Therefore the Lord God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken." -- Genesis 3:22-23 KJV

"And the Lord God said, “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever. So the Lord God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken." -- Genesis 3:22-23 NIV

The Lord God said that they had become "like one of us", just as the serpent said, and the reason he sent them from the garden is so that they would not eat of the tree of life and become eternal. It wasn't to punish them, it was to keep them from becoming like the Elohim, just as the serpent said.


It is right in front of you on the screen, or on the page. You can deny what the Bible says what God said, but you cannot be honest if you do.


:eyebrow:
I read it many times. Why are you objecting to what I said?

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Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #1022

Post by TSGracchus »

[Replying to onewithhim]Because there, in black and white, it says exactly why Adam and Eve were driven from the garden. It was to keep them from living forever,knowing good and evil, just like the Elohim.
Punishment serves to inhibit re-offense. In this case, there was no point. This is the first time the omniscient, omnipotent deity seems to make a mistake in his plan. But it isn't the last.



#-o

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Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #1023

Post by onewithhim »

TSGracchus wrote: [Replying to elijahpne]
The previous verse gives context: Humans were now like the Elohim in that they knew good and evil, so if they lived forever they would be even more like the Elohim.

"And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever: Therefore the Lord God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken." -- Genesis 3:22-23 KJV

"And the Lord God said, “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever. So the Lord God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken." -- Genesis 3:22-23 NIV

So the Elohim did not drive them out to punish them, per se, he drove them out to keep them from living forever, like the the Elohim. Don't need more Elohim, that's for sure.

:study:
I replied to this in post #1015, yet you responded afterward as if you hadn't read this reply. Can you please read this post and make a sensible response? I'll repost that in case you missed it.

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Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #1024

Post by onewithhim »

onewithhim wrote:
TSGracchus wrote: [Replying to elijahpne]
The previous verse gives context: Humans were now like the Elohim in that they knew good and evil, so if they lived forever they would be even more like the Elohim.

"And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever: Therefore the Lord God sent him forth from the garden of Eden, to till the ground from whence he was taken." -- Genesis 3:22-23 KJV

"And the Lord God said, “The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever. So the Lord God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken." -- Genesis 3:22-23 NIV

So the Elohim did not drive them out to punish them, per se, he drove them out to keep them from living forever, like the the Elohim. Don't need more Elohim, that's for sure.

:study:
Satan fooled Eve into thinking that God was holding something back from her and Adam and that they could become like God. So she wanted to be like God. She wanted to make her own decisions about what is good and what is bad, and she and Adam effectively accomplished that, to their own detriment. Eve thought she could last forever being like God, but she was rudely awakened. Satan knew she WOULD die, but convinced her otherwise. God said, afterward, that the two humans DID become like God in that they asked for independence and would now make their own rules.

"Elohim" (Jehovah God) did punish them by driving them out of Eden, because they willfully rebelled against Him, disobeying His simple request that they not touch one tree. They also lost their right to eternal life, and Adam knew that it would be the case if they disobeyed. They were instructed and warned. They'd still be here if they had obeyed Jehovah.

(Most folks don't understand that "elohim" does not refer to any particular person or god. It simply means a plurality of MAGNIFICENCE. Even false pagan gods were given the title of "elohim," such as Dagon of the Canaanites who wasn't worshipped as a trinity but as a single god.)
This is what I said about why God banished Adam and Eve from Eden, and what "elohim" really means. I'd appreciate a comment about this point of view, instead of just repeating what you originally wrote, before any responses from me.

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Post #1025

Post by onewithhim »

I would really appreciate more comments about this subject.

Does anyone realize that the entire Bible is structured around the return to the paradise of Eden? Do you know that Jesus died so that we could live forever here on Earth?

"For evildoers shall be cut off: but those that wait upon the LORD, they shall inherit the earth....The meek shall inherit the earth, and shall delight themselves in the abundance of peace....The righteous shall inherit the land, and dwell therein forever." (Psalm 37:9,11,29, KJV)


:study:

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Post #1026

Post by postroad »

[Replying to post 1023 by onewithhim]

Why then did Jesus say this?

Matthew 7:21
[ True and False Disciples ] “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

Matthew 26:29
I tell you, I will not drink from this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father’s kingdom.�

John 18:36
Jesus said, “My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jewish leaders. But now my kingdom is from another place.�

[/code]

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Post #1027

Post by onewithhim »

postroad wrote: [Replying to post 1023 by onewithhim]

Why then did Jesus say this?

Matthew 7:21
[ True and False Disciples ] “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only the one who does the will of my Father who is in heaven.

Matthew 26:29
I tell you, I will not drink from this fruit of the vine from now on until that day when I drink it new with you in my Father’s kingdom.�

John 18:36
Jesus said, “My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jewish leaders. But now my kingdom is from another place.�

[/code]
How does this contradict what I am saying? Jesus will rule from heaven over the earth, and there will be a relatively small group of people that will go to heaven and rule with him. The "Kingdom" is a real government that is in the hands of Jesus Christ. He said that his Kingdom is "from another place" because it is based in heaven. That government will rule the earth for a thousand years. (Revelation 5:10; Rev.20:4b-6)

"For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given, and the government shall be upon his shoulder....Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end..." (Isaiah 9:6,7, KJV)

"And in the days of these kings shall the God of heaven set up a kingdom which shall never be destroyed...and it shall break in pieces and consume all these kingdoms, and it shall stand forever." (Daniel 2:44, KJV)

"The wolf also shall dwell with the lamb, and the leopard shall lie down with the kid...and a little child shall lead them....They shall not hurt nor destroy in all my holy mountain: for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the LORD, as the waters cover the sea." (Isaiah 11:6-9, KJV)

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Post #1028

Post by postroad »

[Replying to post 1025 by onewithhim]

Interesting how everlasting can become a millennia? Your recycled new covenant has already failed on several occasions anyway.


Ezekiel 37:20-28 New International Version (NIV)

20 Hold before their eyes the sticks you have written on 21 and say to them, ‘This is what the Sovereign Lord says: I will take the Israelites out of the nations where they have gone. I will gather them from all around and bring them back into their own land. 22 I will make them one nation in the land, on the mountains of Israel. There will be one king over all of them and they will never again be two nations or be divided into two kingdoms. 23 They will no longer defile themselves with their idols and vile images or with any of their offenses, for I will save them from all their sinful backsliding,[a] and I will cleanse them. They will be my people, and I will be their God.

24 “‘My servant David will be king over them, and they will all have one shepherd. They will follow my laws and be careful to keep my decrees. 25 They will live in the land I gave to my servant Jacob, the land where your ancestors lived. They and their children and their children’s children will live there forever, and David my servant will be their prince forever. 26 I will make a covenant of peace with them; it will be an everlasting covenant. I will establish them and increase their numbers, and I will put my sanctuary among them forever. 27 My dwelling place will be with them; I will be their God, and they will be my people. 28 Then the nations will know that I the Lord make Israel holy, when my sanctuary is among them forever.

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Post #1029

Post by onewithhim »

[Replying to post 1026 by postroad]

God's Kingdom will be everlasting. Jesus will rule for a thousand years, bringing the planet back to the fine condition it was in before Adam rebelled against God, so that God's purpose for the earth will finally be realized.

Then: "The end, when he [Christ] hands over the Kingdom to his God and Father, when he has brought to nothing all governments and all authority and power. For he must rule as king until God has put all enemies under his feet.

"And the last enemy, death, is to be brought to nothing. For God 'subjected all things under his feet.' But when he says that 'all things have been subjected,' it is evident that this does not include the One who subjected all things to him.

"But when all things will have been subjected to him, then the Son himself will also subject himself to the One who subjected all things to him, that God may be all things to everyone."

(I Corinthians 15:24-28)


So when the Millennial Reign is over, Jesus hands back the Kingdom [government] to his God and Father, and it will last forever.

(Daniel 2:44)

I never said that the Millennial Reign constitutes "everlasting." God's own government obviously will go on forever.


:study:

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Re: Paradise on Earth

Post #1030

Post by JehovahsWitness »

elijahpne wrote: [Replying to post 3 by catnip]

Honestly, mate, I don't really know what Scriptures you are reading. Paradise (Eden) was indeed on earth when Adam and Eve were created but they were driven out of it. Gen. 3:23 says: "Therefore the Lord God sent him forth from the garden of Eden".

Well put!

Yes the original paradise was inded on this planet earth; indeed the plain meaning of the word refers to a garden. The Hebrews did not originally link the idea of the original paradise with heaven but rather with an idyllc location on earth. Thus while religions currently use the word paradise and heaven interchangeable, and the idea of an EARTHLY paradise has been lost to the followers and former memers of world's religions, the teaching that the whole earth will be restored to a paradise like (garden like idyllic condition) is a basic bible based teaching of Jehovah's Witnesses





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Would the Garden of Eden not have eventually become too smal to accommodante all Adam and Eve's descendants?
viewtopic.php?p=1029299#p1029299

PARADISE ON EARTH!

Image



WHAT

PARADISE [Index]

What is PARADISE in Jehovah's Witness terminology?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 32#p855832

What is being refered to when the bible speaks about a PARADISE?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 32#p855832

Is there scriptural support for the idea that the Messianic promises of a paradise will be fullfilled, on this our planet EARTH?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 68#p855568

For what purpose will people continue life in their physical bodies?
viewtopic.php?p=1054976#p1054976

Will people eat food in paradise ? [This post]
viewtopic.php?p=1063840#p1063840

Can the bibles promised be described as "heaven on earth"?
viewtopic.php?p=1044147#p1044147

Erets: Do the meek inherit the earth or "the land"?
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Won't the earth eventually become over populated if nobody dies?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 37#p832237

Was Jesus mistaken when he spoke of the meek inheriting THE EARTH?
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When would the theif be with Jesus in paradise (Luke 23:43)? [Onewithim]
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What if individuals do not WANT to live on a paradise EARTH?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 00#p860000

Will anyone be allowed to ruin paradise?
viewtopic.php?p=1061370#p1061370


CONDITIONS


PARADISE [Index]

What can we expect to see in paradise?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 07#p855407

Will people work in paradise?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 34#p796534

Will people build and live in houses in paradise?
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http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 55#p878655

Will paradise be boring?
viewtopic.php?p=1015435#p1015435


FURTHER READING Paradise on earth: Fantacy or Reality?
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2017130


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What is God's Kingdom?
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THE KINGDOM, THE MILLENIUM and ...THE EARTHLY PARADISE
Last edited by JehovahsWitness on Thu Jan 20, 2022 12:30 pm, edited 14 times in total.
INDEX: More bible based ANSWERS
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 81#p826681


"For if we live, we live to Jehovah, and if we die, we die to Jehovah. So both if we live and if we die, we belong to Jehovah" -
Romans 14:8

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