What was Onan's sin?

[AgnosticBoy]

The Catholic Church uses the story of Onan to justify their position that contraception is a sin. Because of this, I want to examine the story.

Genesis 38:8-10

8 Then Judah said to Onan, “Sleep with your brother’s wife and fulfill your duty to her as a brother-in-law to raise up offspring for your brother.� 9 But Onan knew that the child would not be his; so whenever he slept with his brother’s wife, he spilled his semen on the ground to keep from providing offspring for his brother. 10 What he did was wicked in the Lord’s sight; so the Lord put him to death also

One site I checked mentions that the sin that Onan committed was violating the Levirate law. This is from GotQuestions.org:

Is onanism a sin? The true crime of Onan was refusing to sire a son on his brother’s behalf, which doesn’t really apply to modern culture, anyway.

A Catholic website mentions that violating the Levirate Law was not the problem since such violation was not punishable by death. Instead the sin was not fulfilling the function of sexual intercourse - which is to procreate.

I believe Onan violated the Levirate Law. He also engaged in deception by leading his wife and father to believe that he would impregnate his wife while he had no intentions to do so. Did God step in for one or both reasons or some other reason?

What do you guys think? What was Onan's sin?

[shnarkle]

[Replying to post 3 by RightReason]

Indeed but was God subject to the Mosaic law?

JW

I say yes in regards to Israel(maybe mankind). It was a marriage contract. Israel agreed to observe God's rules and God agreed to prosper and bless Israel. God plays by His rules. If He didn't what kind of god would He be? Short answer is a pagan one. If God agrees and promises, it will be done. Unless, of course if the partner in the contract doesn't act as they should.(over and over as He is patient as shown in the Tanakh.) But, even when Israel failed, He still called for repentance and He would accept them back. For evidence, I submit that God is never recorded with breaking any contract unless the other party did , numerous times.

For God to keep his end of the contract doesn't make him subject to it. God ensures that the contract is kept, but this doesn't subject him to the contract. The Old Testament added laws to deal with transgressions. God can't be subjected to those laws as he can't sin. Likewise, this is the exact same case in the new testament with regards to those who no longer sin. They can't be "under the law" if they have a heart implanted that can no longer sin.

God is the lawgiver, therefore he can't be subject to it. For example, the law prohibits stealing. This is impossible for God to do as he owns everything. He can't steal what is already his. The law prohibits coveting, but likewise God can't covet what is already his. The law prohibits yoking an ox with a jackass, but God doesn't need to use a plow to feed himself.

[PinSeeker]

[Replying to post 3 by RightReason]

Indeed but was God subject to the Mosaic law?

JW

I say yes in regards to Israel(maybe mankind). It was a marriage contract. Israel agreed to observe God's rules and God agreed to prosper and bless Israel. God plays by His rules. If He didn't what kind of god would He be? Short answer is a pagan one. If God agrees and promises, it will be done. Unless, of course if the partner in the contract doesn't act as they should.(over and over as He is patient as shown in the Tanakh.) But, even when Israel failed, He still called for repentance and He would accept them back. For evidence, I submit that God is never recorded with breaking any contract unless the other party did , numerous times.

For God to keep his end of the contract doesn't make him subject to it. God ensures that the contract is kept, but this doesn't subject him to the contract. The Old Testament added laws to deal with transgressions. God can't be subjected to those laws as he can't sin. Likewise, this is the exact same case in the new testament with regards to those who no longer sin. They can't be "under the law" if they have a heart implanted that can no longer sin.

God is the lawgiver, therefore he can't be subject to it. For example, the law prohibits stealing. This is impossible for God to do as he owns everything. He can't steal what is already his. The law prohibits coveting, but likewise God can't covet what is already his. The law prohibits yoking an ox with a jackass, but God doesn't need to use a plow to feed himself.

Right. God is a king (THE KING), not a president.

[brianbbs67]

[Replying to post 11 by shnarkle]

Its a contract. Both parties are held to it. God agrees to abide by the terms He gives because He knows He will never break His word. This is what I love about God. He makes promises in our terms that we can understand and He keeps them even when we don't. He even let Israel violate it egregiously before He voids the contract. He gave them ample time to repent and they did not.

[brianbbs67]

[Replying to post 3 by RightReason]

Indeed but was God subject to the Mosaic law?

JW

I say yes in regards to Israel(maybe mankind). It was a marriage contract. Israel agreed to observe God's rules and God agreed to prosper and bless Israel. God plays by His rules. If He didn't what kind of god would He be? Short answer is a pagan one. If God agrees and promises, it will be done. Unless, of course if the partner in the contract doesn't act as they should.(over and over as He is patient as shown in the Tanakh.) But, even when Israel failed, He still called for repentance and He would accept them back. For evidence, I submit that God is never recorded with breaking any contract unless the other party did , numerous times.

For God to keep his end of the contract doesn't make him subject to it. God ensures that the contract is kept, but this doesn't subject him to the contract. The Old Testament added laws to deal with transgressions. God can't be subjected to those laws as he can't sin. Likewise, this is the exact same case in the new testament with regards to those who no longer sin. They can't be "under the law" if they have a heart implanted that can no longer sin.

God is the lawgiver, therefore he can't be subject to it. For example, the law prohibits stealing. This is impossible for God to do as he owns everything. He can't steal what is already his. The law prohibits coveting, but likewise God can't covet what is already his. The law prohibits yoking an ox with a jackass, but God doesn't need to use a plow to feed himself.

Right. God is a king (THE KING), not a president.

So your God can violate His word? And you are fine with that because He is king? I hope for a better God than yours. Even a king is subject to the law he passes.

[PinSeeker]

So your God can violate His word?

Nope. It's impossible for Him to do so. As Jesus said, the two greatest commandments, love the Lord your God and love your neighbor as yourself, sum up the entire Law of God. And we know that God IS love (1 John).

And you are fine with that because He is king?

This is therefore a non sequitur.

I hope for a better God than yours.

Are you sure about that? You seem to be setting God (the Creator) equal to man (the creature). That can't be done.

Even a king is subject to the law he passes.

No, and yes.

NO
God the Father never was and is not under the Law, as He is not man. As such, He is outside of His Law and not subject to it. But again, He's incapable of violating it, because He's incapable of sin of any kind. In like manner (just to help make the point), God the Father is outside of linear time. He is the great I AM; every one of our moments is now to Him.

YES
God the Son, however -- Jesus; He is the King of kings and Lord of lords, right? -- was/is man (but also God), and therefore was under the Law... became subject to it. And He fulfilled the entire Law to the smallest letter/stroke. This is what qualifies Him as Mediator between God the Father and man.

[brianbbs67]

[Replying to post 15 by PinSeeker]

I am not saying God is under law of Israel except to His end of the marriage contract. IE, Irael did as agreed to and God did as He agreed too.

As the Jesus' reframing of the Shema, Deut. 6:4, It was common Hebrew thought through the ages to reduce the law to a few statements. This DID not mean the other 611 were deleted by Jesus. Just that as he said(jesus), they encompass the whole law. EG, if you love God with all your heart, mind and soul, you are automatically do the rest of the law out of love and respect. This statement by Christ Jesus was held in his time by Bet Hillel. Hillel was the head of the Pharisee's in that period was considered very good. Most Pharisee's weren't as Christ pointed out. Many of Yeshua's statements come right out of Bet Hillel's teachings. So the audience was familiar.