Why Did God Create Atheists?

Argue for and against Christianity

Moderator: Moderators

Post Reply
Zzyzx
Site Supporter
Posts: 25089
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:38 pm
Location: Bible Belt USA
Has thanked: 40 times
Been thanked: 73 times

Why Did God Create Atheists?

Post #1

Post by Zzyzx »

.
Why Did God Create Atheists?
There is a famous story told in Chassidic literature that addresses this very question. The Master teaches the student that God created everything in the world to be appreciated, since everything is here to teach us a lesson.

One clever student asks “What lesson can we learn from atheists? Why did God create them?�

The Master responds “God created atheists to teach us the most important lesson of them all — the lesson of true compassion. You see, when an atheist performs an act of charity, visits someone who is sick, helps someone in need, and cares for the world, he is not doing so because of some religious teaching. He does not believe that God commanded him to perform this act. In fact, he does not believe in God at all, so his acts are based on an inner sense of morality. And look at the kindness he can bestow upon others simply because he feels it to be right.�

“This means,� the Master continued “that when someone reaches out to you for help, you should never say ‘I pray that God will help you.’ Instead for the moment, you should become an atheist, imagine that there is no God who can help, and say ‘I will help you.’�
—Martin Buber, Tales of Hasidim Vol. 2 (1991)
Sure beats ‘sending thoughts and prayers’ doesn’t it?
.
Non-Theist

ANY of the thousands of "gods" proposed, imagined, worshiped, loved, feared, and/or fought over by humans MAY exist -- awaiting verifiable evidence
Top
User avatar
ttruscott
Site Supporter
Posts: 11064
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:09 pm
Location: West Coast of Canada
Been thanked: 3 times

Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

Post #41

Post by ttruscott »

Zzyzx wrote: .
Why Did God Create Atheists?
GOD didn't create atheists. When HE proclaimed HIS divinity without showing proof, many decided HE was a liar and therefore a false god, ie, not a god...self creating themselves as atheists.
PCE Theology as I see it...

We had an existence with a free will in Sheol before the creation of the physical universe. Here we chose to be able to become holy or to be eternally evil in YHWH's sight. Then the physical universe was created and all sinners were sent to earth.

This theology debunks the need to base Christianity upon the blasphemy of creating us in Adam's sin.
Top
User avatar
Tcg
Savant
Posts: 8494
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:01 am
Location: Third Stone
Has thanked: 2147 times
Been thanked: 2295 times

Post #42

Post by Tcg »

Avoice wrote:
But they are here. Because they arent that sure.
Psychoanalyzing the motives of other posters is not a convincing argument in reasoned debate.
There are no atheists
There are many of us.


Tcg
To be clear: Atheism is not a disbelief in gods or a denial of gods; it is a lack of belief in gods.

- American Atheists

Not believing isn't the same as believing not.

- wiploc

I must assume that knowing is better than not knowing, venturing than not venturing; and that magic and illusion, however rich, however alluring, ultimately weaken the human spirit.

- Irvin D. Yalom
Top
User avatar
Tcg
Savant
Posts: 8494
Joined: Tue Nov 21, 2017 5:01 am
Location: Third Stone
Has thanked: 2147 times
Been thanked: 2295 times

Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

Post #43

Post by Tcg »

ttruscott wrote:
Zzyzx wrote: .
Why Did God Create Atheists?
GOD didn't create atheists. When HE proclaimed HIS divinity without showing proof, many decided HE was a liar and therefore a false god, ie, not a god...self creating themselves as atheists.
This doesn't make any sense. If someone felt god was a liar, they'd believe he existed. Only a theist could believe god was a liar.

Additionally, atheists don't believe god is a false god, they lack belief that god/gods exist.


Tcg
To be clear: Atheism is not a disbelief in gods or a denial of gods; it is a lack of belief in gods.

- American Atheists

Not believing isn't the same as believing not.

- wiploc

I must assume that knowing is better than not knowing, venturing than not venturing; and that magic and illusion, however rich, however alluring, ultimately weaken the human spirit.

- Irvin D. Yalom
Top
Zzyzx
Site Supporter
Posts: 25089
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:38 pm
Location: Bible Belt USA
Has thanked: 40 times
Been thanked: 73 times

Post #44

Post by Zzyzx »

.
Avoice wrote: No such thing as a real atheist. Many here claim there is no God. Then why are they here. Why? Because they arent as sure as they proclaim to be. They want people to prove them wrong or prove them right. Unfortunately that wont happen. Either way.

But they are here. Because they arent that sure.

There are no atheists
A 'real atheist' does not believe in gods -- the meaning of Atheism.

The 'existence' of 'gods' is a matter of conjecture / opinion / imagination. Which, if any, of the thousands of proposed 'gods' are anything more? Verifiable evidence?
.
Non-Theist

ANY of the thousands of "gods" proposed, imagined, worshiped, loved, feared, and/or fought over by humans MAY exist -- awaiting verifiable evidence
Top
Zzyzx
Site Supporter
Posts: 25089
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:38 pm
Location: Bible Belt USA
Has thanked: 40 times
Been thanked: 73 times

Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

Post #45

Post by Zzyzx »

.
ttruscott wrote:
Zzyzx wrote: Why Did God Create Atheists?
GOD didn't create atheists. When HE proclaimed HIS divinity without showing proof, many decided HE was a liar and therefore a false god, ie, not a god...self creating themselves as atheists.
WHERE, exactly, did any 'god' proclaim 'his' divinity?

Humans often proclaim 'divinity' for their favorite invisible, undetectable, proposed supernatural entities (thousands available for worship -- or invent your own).

Some other humans believe the claims of 'divinity' and contribute to the clergy welfare fund and to building of palaces of worship.
.
Non-Theist

ANY of the thousands of "gods" proposed, imagined, worshiped, loved, feared, and/or fought over by humans MAY exist -- awaiting verifiable evidence
Top
Zzyzx
Site Supporter
Posts: 25089
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:38 pm
Location: Bible Belt USA
Has thanked: 40 times
Been thanked: 73 times

Post #46

Post by Zzyzx »

.
Avoice wrote: But they are here. Because they arent that sure.
This Non-Theist is here doing my part to expose fallacies presented by god worshipers -- and to contradict religious propaganda and advertising which permeate society.
.
Non-Theist

ANY of the thousands of "gods" proposed, imagined, worshiped, loved, feared, and/or fought over by humans MAY exist -- awaiting verifiable evidence
Top
User avatar
ttruscott
Site Supporter
Posts: 11064
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:09 pm
Location: West Coast of Canada
Been thanked: 3 times

Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

Post #47

Post by ttruscott »

Tcg wrote: This doesn't make any sense. If someone felt god was a liar, they'd believe he existed. Only a theist could believe god was a liar.
In my reality we all were created as spirits before the creation of the physical world and we all knew the Trinity as people before they made their claims of divinity.
Additionally, atheists don't believe god is a false god, they lack belief that god/gods exist.
Since a false god is not a god, to disbelieve the claims of the divinity of GOD is to declare yourself an atheist, a person who doesn't believe in (any) god. You see? False god and no god are the same...
PCE Theology as I see it...

We had an existence with a free will in Sheol before the creation of the physical universe. Here we chose to be able to become holy or to be eternally evil in YHWH's sight. Then the physical universe was created and all sinners were sent to earth.

This theology debunks the need to base Christianity upon the blasphemy of creating us in Adam's sin.
Top
Zzyzx
Site Supporter
Posts: 25089
Joined: Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:38 pm
Location: Bible Belt USA
Has thanked: 40 times
Been thanked: 73 times

Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

Post #48

Post by Zzyzx »

.
ttruscott wrote: Since a false god is not a god, to disbelieve the claims of the divinity of GOD is to declare yourself an atheist, a person who doesn't believe in (any) god. You see? False god and no god are the same...
Which, if any, of the thousands of proposed 'gods' are 'false gods' and which are 'real gods' -- AND how can that be determined?

There is a great deal of disagreement worldwide regarding 'gods'. Which, if any, have been shown to exist outside imagination (using verifiable information)?
.
Non-Theist

ANY of the thousands of "gods" proposed, imagined, worshiped, loved, feared, and/or fought over by humans MAY exist -- awaiting verifiable evidence
Top
Bust Nak
Savant
Posts: 9856
Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2012 6:03 am
Location: Planet Earth
Has thanked: 189 times
Been thanked: 266 times

Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

Post #49

Post by Bust Nak »

ttruscott wrote: GOD didn't create atheists. When HE proclaimed HIS divinity without showing proof, many decided HE was a liar and therefore a false god, ie, not a god...self creating themselves as atheists.
That distinction doesn't mean much when God created many who decided God was a liar and therefore a false god.

Why Did God Create those who decided God as a liar?
Top
User avatar
marco
Savant
Posts: 12314
Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2015 3:15 pm
Location: Scotland
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: Why Did God Create Atheists?

Post #50

Post by marco »

ttruscott wrote:
In my reality we all were created as spirits before the creation of the physical world and we all knew the Trinity as people before they made their claims of divinity.
It cannot possibly be in your "reality". You express a theory. Reality is the amount you pay for bread and the cost of a train journey.
ttruscott wrote: Since a false god is not a god, to disbelieve the claims of the divinity of GOD is to declare yourself an atheist, a person who doesn't believe in (any) god. You see? False god and no god are the same...
Reasoning is what has brought man from caves to castles then to the comforts of modern life. It is proper for man to question and by doing so man deserted Zeus and Thor. In the same way some employ reason to desert Yahweh. It can never be wrong to use reason, even if occasionally reason lets us down. The behaviour of Yahweh in the Bible makes him such an unlikely god that one can be forgiven for not taking him seriously. If he wanted admirers, he should have done things worthy of admiration. He didn't. That supplies a good reason for not believing - I wonder what your good reason is for believing.
Top
Post Reply

Return to “Christianity and Apologetics”