Why did God create the tree of knowledge in the first place?

[skeleton tree]

If God did not want Adam and Eve to have that certain knowledge, then why did He create the tree in the first place? Why did He make it available to them? Why did He give them that option?

[Confused]

re:McCulloch

Seriously? You're saying that God predestined A&E's disobedience and as a result the whole of sinful humanity's history. It almost sounds like he planned it. How can you foresee a choice and have no affect on its outcome? God created A&E, gave them instructions, but somehow knew they would end up disobeying it? So he wanted them to fall into sin and, in turn, wreck humanity for thousands of years, just so he could show off how much love he has by jumping in and saving the day with Jesus? Seriously?

Ok, would you care to hazard a guess as to why He created it?

[eymik]

Let's break it down.

GOD told the one thing. "Don't eat"
SNAKE told them one thing. "Eat"

If they had no concept of right/wrong, God would have taken all responsibility from them. It wasn't their fault. If so, where the heck did SIN come from? Why are we all sinful.

[inchrist]

If God did not want Adam and Eve to have that certain knowledge, then why did He create the tree in the first place? Why did He make it available to them? Why did He give them that option?

The reason God created the tree of knowledge of good and evil was for one reason, mans freedom to choose. God did not create robots meant to do what he says, why not? He doesnt need us, God doesnt need a bunch of humans to worship him, God doesnt need a bunch of humans to love him. God created man for the purpose of sharing his love which is literally infinite. For example if you are a very loving person its IN you to love others. Ofcourse God is love, so he created us to give us his love, that we may like him, love one another.

BUT, in creating us, he gave us the choice to agree with his plan, which was for us to live in paradise sharing in Gods love, or to choose our OWN path. He did not force anyone into accepting his love. So by this, God created the tree of knowledge of good and evil. However, God did NOT say to Adam and EVe, you can choose to live with me, or you can choose to eat of this tree. He said DO NOT eat from this tree, the day you eat of it, surely you will die. So EVEN THOUGH God gave us the free will, his love was looking out for our best interest which was "trust me you dont want to eat from the tree".

When Adam and Eve disobeyed the Lord, they did now have the ability to commit sin, which in truth would cause "death" just as the Lord told them. But the Lord said i will not leave you EVEN THOUGH i gave you the choice to choose to follow me or not, i will STILL send you my son Jesus Christ who will bring you BACK to me. (once again the lord chasing us, but not forcing us, to come back to him... Once again looking out for our best interest) Still, even after Jesus has saved us from our sins, we still have the choice up until this day to say.. No im going my own way, or to say, our father and mother Adam and Eve made the mistake once to follow the serpent, and look where it had lead us, I will choose to stay with my Lord, who looks out for my best interest and who created me for the purpose of loving me.


As for did adam and eve know what they were doing was bad?

Adam and even knew that they were disobeying what God's commandment, but did not understand exactly what it was that would happen to them after eating from the tree. And when being told by the serpent to disobey their master because if they did they could be like him all powerfull. They chose to eat from the tree despite what their God commanded them.

[Beto]

If God did not want Adam and Eve to have that certain knowledge, then why did He create the tree in the first place? Why did He make it available to them? Why did He give them that option?

The reason God created the tree of knowledge of good and evil was for one reason, mans freedom to choose. God did not create robots meant to do what he says, why not? He doesnt need us, God doesnt need a bunch of humans to worship him, God doesnt need a bunch of humans to love him. God created man for the purpose of sharing his love which is literally infinite. For example if you are a very loving person its IN you to love others. Ofcourse God is love, so he created us to give us his love, that we may like him, love one another.

BUT, in creating us, he gave us the choice to agree with his plan, which was for us to live in paradise sharing in Gods love, or to choose our OWN path. He did not force anyone into accepting his love. So by this, God created the tree of knowledge of good and evil. However, God did NOT say to Adam and EVe, you can choose to live with me, or you can choose to eat of this tree. He said DO NOT eat from this tree, the day you eat of it, surely you will die. So EVEN THOUGH God gave us the free will, his love was looking out for our best interest which was "trust me you dont want to eat from the tree".

When Adam and Eve disobeyed the Lord, they did now have the ability to commit sin, which in truth would cause "death" just as the Lord told them. But the Lord said i will not leave you EVEN THOUGH i gave you the choice to choose to follow me or not, i will STILL send you my son Jesus Christ who will bring you BACK to me. (once again the lord chasing us, but not forcing us, to come back to him... Once again looking out for our best interest) Still, even after Jesus has saved us from our sins, we still have the choice up until this day to say.. No im going my own way, or to say, our father and mother Adam and Eve made the mistake once to follow the serpent, and look where it had lead us, I will choose to stay with my Lord, who looks out for my best interest and who created me for the purpose of loving me.


As for did adam and eve know what they were doing was bad?

Adam and even knew that they were disobeying what God's commandment, but did not understand exactly what it was that would happen to them after eating from the tree. And when being told by the serpent to disobey their master because if they did they could be like him all powerfull. They chose to eat from the tree despite what their God commanded them.

Without knowledge between "right" and "wrong", "disobedience" means nothing. They didn't choose anything because they didn't understand there were "right" and "wrong" options. When one disobeys a rule one realizes that at the very least there is a "right" and "wrong" to the intelligence that set the rule, concepts beyond their understanding before eating the fruit.

[Muz]

If God did not want Adam and Eve to have that certain knowledge, then why did He create the tree in the first place? Why did He make it available to them? Why did He give them that option?

One necessity of any loving relationship is the ability to choose to reject the other person. If God created a world where we had no choice to reject Him, then we could not engage in a loving relationship with Him.

The tree made it possible for Adam and Eve to make an active choice to believe and love God through obeying His command, or rejecting Him and rebelling against Him.

Obviously God's desire was for them to refrain from eating, but they did not.

Muz

[Beto]

One necessity of any loving relationship is the ability to choose to reject the other person.

I agree. But not knowing their "choice" was "wrong" (because they lacked the knowledge), they had no perception that they were "rejecting" "God". Not knowing "right" from "wrong" they can't associate "consequence" with either.

Before eating the fruit, they didn't know doing the opposite of what was commanded was "wrong". If they didn't know it was "wrong", how can they be blamed for their "choice"?

If you didn't read my previous post I'll reiterate. "Disobedience" can only be used to describe an action when the active party realizes the rule was set because it was "right" to the one who set it. We know that disobeying the rule is "wrong" because someone thought it was "right". This isn't that complicated.

If God created a world where we had no choice to reject Him, then we could not engage in a loving relationship with Him.

The choice was understood AFTER they ate the fruit. Fair?

The tree made it possible for Adam and Eve to make an active choice to believe and love God through obeying His command, or rejecting Him and rebelling against Him.

Really, think about it.

Obviously God's desire was for them to refrain from eating, but they did not.

My dog doesn't refrain from doing lots of stuff I tell him not to do (funny how I hold myself accountable... go figure). Maybe I should just throw him out.

[Muz]

One necessity of any loving relationship is the ability to choose to reject the other person.

I agree. But not knowing their "choice" was "wrong" (because they lacked the knowledge), they had no perception that they were "rejecting" "God". Not knowing "right" from "wrong" they can't associate "consequence" with either.

Before eating the fruit, they didn't know doing the opposite of what was commanded was "wrong". If they didn't know it was "wrong", how can they be blamed for their "choice"?

Umm... God told them not to eat from the tree, and Eve even repeated the command before eating. So, how can you say that they didn't know it was wrong?

If you didn't read my previous post I'll reiterate. "Disobedience" can only be used to describe an action when the active party realizes the rule was set because it was "right" to the one who set it. We know that disobeying the rule is "wrong" because someone thought it was "right". This isn't that complicated.

Well, seeing as they knew that God created them, and they knew that God said not to eat.. what's the problem?

If God created a world where we had no choice to reject Him, then we could not engage in a loving relationship with Him.

The choice was understood AFTER they ate the fruit. Fair?

Not at all. They came to understand that the consequence was bad, in spite of what the serpent told them, but they knew beforehand what they'd been commanded to do and not to do.

The tree made it possible for Adam and Eve to make an active choice to believe and love God through obeying His command, or rejecting Him and rebelling against Him.

Really, think about it.

Obviously God's desire was for them to refrain from eating, but they did not.

My dog doesn't refrain from doing lots of stuff I tell him not to do (funny how I hold myself accountable... go figure). Maybe I should just throw him out.

So, human have the intellectual capacity of dogs?

Muz

[Beto]

Umm... God told them not to eat from the tree, and Eve even repeated the command before eating. So, how can you say that they didn't know it was wrong?

Something to do with the name of the tree...

Well, seeing as they knew that God created them, and they knew that God said not to eat.. what's the problem?

If you still don't see one, I can't help you further.

So, human have the intellectual capacity of dogs?

Is that what you honestly thought I implied with the analogy, or are you purposely attempting to misrepresent my position?

[bernee51]

One necessity of any loving relationship is the ability to choose to reject the other person.

I agree. But not knowing their "choice" was "wrong" (because they lacked the knowledge), they had no perception that they were "rejecting" "God". Not knowing "right" from "wrong" they can't associate "consequence" with either.

Before eating the fruit, they didn't know doing the opposite of what was commanded was "wrong". If they didn't know it was "wrong", how can they be blamed for their "choice"?

Umm... God told them not to eat from the tree, and Eve even repeated the command before eating. So, how can you say that they didn't know it was wrong?

Until the 'apple' was eaten they did not know right from wrong! From their viewpoint what god told them to do was neutral as far as right and wrong goes.

{{{Why am I arguing this stuff - there is a perfectly understandable reason for this particular analogy.}}}

If you didn't read my previous post I'll reiterate. "Disobedience" can only be used to describe an action when the active party realizes the rule was set because it was "right" to the one who set it. We know that disobeying the rule is "wrong" because someone thought it was "right". This isn't that complicated.

Well, seeing as they knew that God created them, and they knew that God said not to eat.. what's the problem?

At what stage did they learn wrong from right?

Not at all. They came to understand that the consequence was bad, in spite of what the serpent told them, but they knew beforehand what they'd been commanded to do and not to do.

But did they know it was wrong? If so how? They had not yet eaten the 'apple'.

So, human have the intellectual capacity of dogs?

{{{{{groan}}}}}

[Muz]

One necessity of any loving relationship is the ability to choose to reject the other person.

I agree. But not knowing their "choice" was "wrong" (because they lacked the knowledge), they had no perception that they were "rejecting" "God". Not knowing "right" from "wrong" they can't associate "consequence" with either.

Before eating the fruit, they didn't know doing the opposite of what was commanded was "wrong". If they didn't know it was "wrong", how can they be blamed for their "choice"?

Umm... God told them not to eat from the tree, and Eve even repeated the command before eating. So, how can you say that they didn't know it was wrong?

Until the 'apple' was eaten they did not know right from wrong! From their viewpoint what god told them to do was neutral as far as right and wrong goes.

{{{Why am I arguing this stuff - there is a perfectly understandable reason for this particular analogy.}}}

I think you're confusing "right" and "wrong" with "good" and "evil". They may not have had an inherent knowledge of good and evil, such as intinctively knowing that being naked was bad, but they did grasp the concept that eating of the tree was "wrong".in that it was something God told them not to do.

Just because they didn't have an instinctive grasp of all good and evil doesn't mean that they didn't know not to eat from the tree.

If you didn't read my previous post I'll reiterate. "Disobedience" can only be used to describe an action when the active party realizes the rule was set because it was "right" to the one who set it. We know that disobeying the rule is "wrong" because someone thought it was "right". This isn't that complicated.

Well, seeing as they knew that God created them, and they knew that God said not to eat.. what's the problem?

At what stage did they learn wrong from right?

For this particular action, that would have been when God said "From the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, you shall not eat, or you will surely die."

For "good" and "evil" in general, not until after.

Not at all. They came to understand that the consequence was bad, in spite of what the serpent told them, but they knew beforehand what they'd been commanded to do and not to do.

But did they know it was wrong? If so how? They had not yet eaten the 'apple'.

They knew it was wrong because God told them not to. They didn't instinctively know it was evil, but that's not relevant in the presence of a direct command.
Unless you're going to claim that they had to experience evil before being able to know that not obeying a command of God was bad (which seems a little silly), I don't think your logic works, here.

So, human have the intellectual capacity of dogs?

{{{{{groan}}}}}

Well? Adam and Eve were compared to a dog's capacity to understand "don't do X."

Muz