Is There Really a Hell?

[Richard Aberdeen]

According to astrophysicist Neil DeGrasse Tyson, there is a certain type of black hole located within dark voids in the universe, where there is no light for many light years in every direction. This type of black hole, according to Tyson, contains an inner "sea of fire", left over from the stars it long ago consumed. According to NASA, the Encyclopedia Britannica and the late Stephen Hawking, among many other scientists, a black hole is a "bottomless pit" that theoretically digs forever.

The Bible says that hell is located in "outer darkness" Matthew 8:12 and is a "bottomless pit" Revelation 9:11, containing a "lake of fire" Revelation 20:14. Many people long questioned how something containing a lake of fire could be located in outer darkness and even more difficult to believe, be a bottomless pit, from which no one can escape. Now we know. Jesus says in Luke 16:26, that no human can pass from heaven to hades or from hades to heaven. Those who mock the Bible invariably, eventually end up eating crow. . .or worse.

Many question whether a loving God would cast someone forever into hell. Such folks rarely pause to consider what our sins cost God, in the sacrifice of his only begotten son. We hear reports of parents weeping at the bedside of their child who has cancer or has been in a horrific accident, crying "if only I could take my child's place!" We have no idea how God must have felt when his only son was nailed to a Roman cross and, we likely never will even begin to grasp what our sins cost God Almighty.

There is great reward for accepting forgiveness for our sins from Jesus. And there is a great penalty for refusing to do so.

[JehovahsWitness]

So love me or else is benevolence in your mind? Submit and want to or suffer is "freewill"?

Jehovah/Yahweh the God of the bible is a God of love and justice, he does not punish people with eternal never ending inescapable torture (since this would be considered sadistic). "Hell" in the bible is just another word for the eternal "nothingness" of non-existence (the punishment for the incorrigibly wicked).


JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

To learn more please go to other posts related to...

BIBLE "HELL", THE CONDITION OF THE DEAD and ...HELLFIRE TORTURE DEBUNKED

[Carnivalfaces]

So love me or else is benevolence in your mind? Submit and want to or suffer is "freewill"?

Jehovah/Yahweh the God of the bible is a God of love and justice, he does not punish people with eternal never ending inescapable torture (since this would be considered sadistic). "Hell" in the bible is just another word for the eternal "nothingness" of non-existence (the punishment for the incorrigibly wicked).


JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

To learn more please go to other posts related to...

BIBLE "HELL", THE CONDITION OF THE DEAD and ...HELLFIRE TORTURE DEBUNKED

You're wasting your time on me. Jehovah is no more established than hell.

[JehovahsWitness]

So love me or else is benevolence in your mind? Submit and want to or suffer is "freewill"?

Jehovah/Yahweh the God of the bible is a God of love and justice, he does not punish people with eternal never ending inescapable torture (since this would be considered sadistic). "Hell" in the bible is just another word for the eternal "nothingness" of non-existence (the punishment for the incorrigibly wicked).


JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

To learn more please go to other posts related to...

BIBLE "HELL", THE CONDITION OF THE DEAD and ...HELLFIRE TORTURE DEBUNKED

You're wasting your time on me. Jehovah is no more established than hell.

I don't know you and was not using my time for anything but to respond in a debate forum to the point you made. As for what is "established" I think its a reasonable guess that you believe in the Jehovah's Witness definition of "hell" which is just death . Unless you claim not to believe that people die, you agree it is "established" that death is the end of a person's existence (which is what I explained bible "hell" is) all atheists I know believe in the bible/Jehovah's Witness explanation of the condition of the dead, namely that death is the end of a person's existence and that there is nothing therefore that can cause that person pain or suffering when they are dead.

Anyway, I think my time is well spent finding common ground with you, as I think we have done, so have an excellent and most wonderful day,

JW

[placebofactor]

So love me or else is benevolence in your mind? Submit and want to or suffer is "freewill"?

Jehovah/Yahweh the God of the bible is a God of love and justice, he does not punish people with eternal never ending inescapable torture (since this would be considered sadistic). "Hell" in the bible is just another word for the eternal "nothingness" of non-existence (the punishment for the incorrigibly wicked).


JEHOVAH'S WITNESS

To learn more please go to other posts related to...

BIBLE "HELL", THE CONDITION OF THE DEAD and ...HELLFIRE TORTURE DEBUNKED

You're wasting your time on me. Jehovah is no more established than hell.

I don't know you and was not using my time for anything but to respond in a debate forum to the point you made. As for what is "established" I think its a reasonable guess that you believe in the Jehovah's Witness definition of "hell" which is just death . Unless you claim not to believe that people die, you agree it is "established" that death is the end of a person's existence (which is what I explained bible "hell" is) all atheists I know believe in the bible/Jehovah's Witness explanation of the condition of the dead, namely that death is the end of a person's existence and that there is nothing therefore that can cause that person pain or suffering when they are dead.

Anyway, I think my time is well spent finding common ground with you, as I think we have done, so have an excellent and most wonderful day,

JW

Mr. J.W. the Watchtower falsely teaches there is no hell, and your N.W.T. teaches the same thing. Why? Because like so many other verses in the Bible, the N.W.T. has corrupted the verses that teach the truth. Let me give you one example.

2 Peter 2:9, "The Lord (Jesus) knoweth how to deliver the godly out of temptations, and to reserve the UNJUST UNTO THE DAY OF JUDGMENT TO BE PUNISHED."
Hell is the place of punishment, not a hole in the ground.

N.I.V. 2 Peter, 2:9, " --- to hold the unrighteous for the day of judgment, while continuing their punishment."

N.W.T. The Watchtower's first corruption was to change "Lord," speaking of Jesus, who will be the Judge of the living and the dead, to Jehovah, changing it to mean the Father. The only Bible in the history of ancient manuscripts to do that.

N.W.T. "---- but to reserve unrighteous people for the day of the judgment to be cut off." First of all, there is no Greek word for "cut off," another Jehovah's Witness corruption of God's word.

[tam]

Peace to you,

There is great reward for accepting forgiveness for our sins from Jesus.

Yes, that reward is everlasting life.

And there is a great penalty for refusing to do so.

Yes, that penalty is the everlasting second death -- they will never live again.

And they will know and experience absolutely nothing for all eternity - as the dead know not any thing.

All, believers and nonbelievers, "should be content."

Praise the Lord.

There is no punishment if you are dead, makes no sense. Being dead, having no feelings, emotions, or memory, is not a penalty; it's nothing, and if I were a bad guy and did bad things and did not believe in God, death without life would be a great reward. Why? Because I have gotten away with my crimes while I was alive.

Isn't the death penalty a punishment?

[OneJack]

Peace to you,

There is great reward for accepting forgiveness for our sins from Jesus.

Yes, that reward is everlasting life.

And there is a great penalty for refusing to do so.

Yes, that penalty is the everlasting second death -- they will never live again.

And they will know and experience absolutely nothing for all eternity - as the dead know not any thing.

All, believers and nonbelievers, "should be content."

Praise the Lord.

There is no punishment if you are dead, makes no sense. Being dead, having no feelings, emotions, or memory, is not a penalty; it's nothing, and if I were a bad guy and did bad things and did not believe in God, death without life would be a great reward. Why? Because I have gotten away with my crimes while I was alive.

Isn't the death penalty a punishment?

Punishment for what, the death penalty for the flesh, or for the spirit?

[tam]

Peace to you,

There is great reward for accepting forgiveness for our sins from Jesus.

Yes, that reward is everlasting life.

And there is a great penalty for refusing to do so.

Yes, that penalty is the everlasting second death -- they will never live again.

And they will know and experience absolutely nothing for all eternity - as the dead know not any thing.

All, believers and nonbelievers, "should be content."

Praise the Lord.

There is no punishment if you are dead, makes no sense. Being dead, having no feelings, emotions, or memory, is not a penalty; it's nothing, and if I were a bad guy and did bad things and did not believe in God, death without life would be a great reward. Why? Because I have gotten away with my crimes while I was alive.

Isn't the death penalty a punishment?

Punishment for what, the death penalty for the flesh, or for the spirit?

Since we're talking about the second death, then both (flesh and spirit).

[OneJack]

Peace to you,

Yes, that reward is everlasting life.



Yes, that penalty is the everlasting second death -- they will never live again.

And they will know and experience absolutely nothing for all eternity - as the dead know not any thing.

All, believers and nonbelievers, "should be content."

Praise the Lord.

There is no punishment if you are dead, makes no sense. Being dead, having no feelings, emotions, or memory, is not a penalty; it's nothing, and if I were a bad guy and did bad things and did not believe in God, death without life would be a great reward. Why? Because I have gotten away with my crimes while I was alive.

Isn't the death penalty a punishment?

Punishment for what, the death penalty for the flesh, or for the spirit?

Since we're talking about the second death, then both (flesh and spirit).

The second death is not for the flesh but for the spirit; hence, the death penalty for the spirit, which will be the eternal punishment and gnashing of the teeth.

[Capbook]

As to the question of the thread, your answer is yes, and you mean earth (the physical realm) as hell, just correct me if I'm wrong.

Yes, hear me out. Let's walk through the idea conceptually- because I think that "hell" in it's various formats as you present it, is best understood as a concept, rather than merely "a place."

To make this as plain and as black and white as possible, I'll introduce the concept in those stark terms-- as opposites, or opposite ends of a spectrum, each in evidence of the duality offered throughout scripture:

Heaven and hell
Heaven and earth
Life and death
Good and evil
Spirit vs flesh
Spritual vs physical
Eternal Life vs eternal punishment
Paradise vs the grave

...and so on.[/quote

Let me simplify, eternal life vs eternal death, as second death is eternal.

The angels who sinned were banished from heaven and 'cast down' to the earth-- and it's depicted as a prison for them, inescapable and permanent-- forever condemned and separated from God. Embrace the concept, even if you don't embrace the premise yet. Hell is a condition of incarceration and separation from God as a form of punishment and as an act of justice. Think of it what you will and what you think as "fair" in terms of simple separation or eternal anguish and torment, and please don't put your views on me-- I'm speaking conceptually, not definitively.

Yes, earth is depicted as prison to those angels who sinned and banished from heaven. Prison in the sense that there will no living souls to tempt with within the 1,000 years. The resurrected righteous and alive when Christ comes will be with Him for a 1,000 years (Rev 20:6), but the rest of the wicked dead will be resurrected after the 1,000 years (Rev 20:5), means nothing alive on earth within the 1,000 years, fallen angel had nothing to tempt, the situation would serve as imprisonment.

Without wanting to take the conversation astray, a discussion could be had about those divine (spiritual) beings getting banished to a physical realm and the nature of spirits in a captive environment, but for now let's just say they were condemned and confined to the earthly realm. Heaven is the spiritual, eternal place of the living. Earth is the physical, temporal place of the dying. If there is an abode of the dead and dying-- this is it. This earth is the place of the dead, and we bury one another under six feet of soil as if to put an exclamation point on the fact of the matter.

Yes, earth is a temporal place, to the faithful believers heaven is the citizenship, and earth is the battleground between God and evil, our eternal destiny will be decided here by us whom we chose to be enslave to, to Satan or to God.
Being in earth is not God's final judgement, hell fire is.

Php 3:20  For our citizenship is in heaven, from which also we eagerly wait for a Savior, the Lord Jesus Christ; 

Or maybe you think physical and spiritual separation from God is not punishment enough. You'd rather imagine a place of eternal torment and the flaming hell fires of Gehenna. In reality Gehenna was such a place of waste and ruin- it's easy and fair enough to permit this association. A place of destruction where everything amounts to nothing in the end and the waste is cast aside to be consumed by flames. Well, in a sense earth is just such a place when contrast with the heavenly concept of paradise and eternal life. We even call ourselves "consumers" and in the end you take nothing with you-- all is refuse and wasted anything you were clinging to in life amounts to the treasures of a hoarder once they've gone to the grave.

Yes, there are consequences of sin, flesh always fall short to the glory of God, but God will forgive those who confess their sins and repent. But to those who live wickedly, as you state "will be consumed by flames," which means eternal death.

So you can see the picture that was painted for me in dream, but that is only a small part of what I was shown and told. We live and then die here, and only in death do we have any hope for new life-- indeed we are the ones who are trapped here, we are the captives who need to be set free, we are the prisoners who need a savior, redeemer and rescuer, willing to pay a ransom to set us free. We stand here in the hell of our own making, condemned to death, serving life sentences, but praise God-- with the chance of parole.

Yes, when the first parent sinned, mankind were condemned to death, but death is not the hell yet, Jesus died for us giving us hope of reconciliation to God by faith. But to those ungodly whom lived the life of wickedness, they will suffer the second death, the lake of fire. (hell fire, Gehenna)

[Capbook]

Peace to you,

There is no punishment if you are dead, makes no sense. Being dead, having no feelings, emotions, or memory, is not a penalty; it's nothing, and if I were a bad guy and did bad things and did not believe in God, death without life would be a great reward. Why? Because I have gotten away with my crimes while I was alive.

Isn't the death penalty a punishment?

Punishment for what, the death penalty for the flesh, or for the spirit?

Since we're talking about the second death, then both (flesh and spirit).

The second death is not for the flesh but for the spirit; hence, the death penalty for the spirit, which will be the eternal punishment and gnashing of the teeth.

May we know who do you believe who these verses referred to OneJack?
The one who was in Eden, called the anointed cherub, who were blameless until unrighteousness was found in him.
I believe verses below speaks of Satan, a spirit being, whom God will destroy, consumed and will turned to ashes.
As to become "ashes," yes, it means eternal punishment and not eternal punishing, to understand more fully "eternal death" the second death. (Rev 20:10,14)

Eze 28:13  "You were in Eden, the garden of God; Every precious stone was your covering: The ruby, the topaz and the diamond; The beryl, the onyx and the jasper; The lapis lazuli, the turquoise and the emerald; And the gold, the workmanship of your settings and sockets, Was in you. On the day that you were created They were prepared. 
Eze 28:14  "You were the anointed cherub who covers, And I placed you there. You were on the holy mountain of God; You walked in the midst of the stones of fire. 
Eze 28:15  "You were blameless in your ways From the day you were created Until unrighteousness was found in you. 
Eze 28:16  "By the abundance of your trade You were internally filled with violence, And you sinned; Therefore I have cast you as profane From the mountain of God. And I have destroyed you, O covering cherub, From the midst of the stones of fire. 
Eze 28:17  "Your heart was lifted up because of your beauty; You corrupted your wisdom by reason of your splendor. I cast you to the ground; I put you before kings, That they may see you. 
Eze 28:18  "By the multitude of your iniquities, In the unrighteousness of your trade You profaned your sanctuaries. Therefore I have brought fire from the midst of you; It has consumed you, And I have turned you to ashes on the earth In the eyes of all who see you.