witchcraft

[Telora]

Is there any middle ground between the actions that can be considered supernatural witchcraft and the faiths that directly forbid it, what exactly is forbidden and why?

[JohnPaul]

Burninglight wrote:

...Moreover, you are being disrespectful that is against forum rules. I havent called you a bird that scuttles. You must be civil; if you cannot be, I will flag you

What, a Christian who spews threats of hell and eternal damnation at anyone who disagrees with him is now appealing to forum rules?

Surely you must understand that the language required for me to cast demonic spells often does not conform to that of polite debate. I apologize for calling you a scuttling parrot. That was metaphorical. I should have been more literal and called you a Bible-believing Christian, which means pretty much the same thing. You scuttle around in the Bible, pecking up verses that attract you and then spit them out at anyone who comes near.

You can call me a Bible believing Christian as much as you like. I would never call you on it, and you could believe that means anything you like. Now, would you be offended if I called you a witch?

What threats have I spewed out because of you're not agreeing? If you cannot prove that, that means you are now adding insult to injury.

Oh, please!!! If I wanted to insult you, you would know it. I am only gently making fun of you, as I would with any child.

Would I be offended if you called me a witch? No. If I thought you were using it metaphorically, I would probably be flattered. If I thought you really believed it (which I do), then I would be concerned for your mental condition and would prefer not to live in the same neighborhood with you.

A Christian neighbor once told me that demons sometimes gathered in his backyard at night and conducted strange rites there. I offered to come over with my shotgun and exorcise the demons for him. He became indignant and called me a nonbeliever. It almost seemed as if he would rather have the demons terrorizing him than to have someone prove they were not real. Hmmm.

In that case, I would have to say: Well, you have a very strange sense of humor. If someone asked you to be serious, would you be and say what it is that you really believe in?

Very well. I am an agnostic with some slight leanings toward the Eastern religious ideas and even the early Christian Gnostics. I do not deny the possibility of something beyond what we can see, but I am very sure it is not the primitive tribal wargod nonsense of the OT or the very artificial Jesus-God of the NT. I will not go into my reasons for those opinions here. I think Jesus probably existed and was a good and sincere teacher, but nothing more. Very little of him is left today. Most of the NT is advertising garbage.

I certainly do not believe there is any scriptural supernatural "God" looking over my shoulder and demanding that I obey his every irrational whim at the threat of terrible punishment. That is not morality to me. I believe that morality comes from our own "inner light," similar to the Gnostic belief that the human soul is a tiny spark of God within us. The God of the Gnostics is NOT the tribal God of the OT or the Father-God of the NT. The Gnostics rejected the OT god as a defective and evil impostor-god who had trapped human souls in his defective physical creation. The Gnostic God is remote and pure, not the "personal" and often irrational God of the Bible meddling in human affairs.

I do not "believe" all this, but it is certainly more believable than the Christian mess of inconsistent and contradictory doctrines, usually cherry-picked and used only to condemn others. I became a confirmed agnostic in high school when I began to realize how irrational it all was. My mother was a devout non-denominational Christian, but certainly did not believe in anything like your horrible threatening and demanding concept of Jesus. I resent the superstitious Fundamentalist Christian image of Jesus which degrades and corrupts all his teachings.

I know this is all heresy at best to you. Sorry about that.

[Divine Insight]

WADR, you should change you user name. There is nothing divine about your insight!

I beg your pardon sir, but who are you to judge what is divine and what isn't?

You continually act like as if you "Speak for Jesus" and that you are the official self-appointed Pope of Christianity. And then you have the audacity to tell other people that there is nothing divine about their insight.

Apparently your religious arrogance (meaning self-importance) has gone to your head.

With all due respect sir, I do not recognize your authority to speak for Christianity, and I most certainly don't respect your authority to speak for Jesus as "The Christ". And I'm quite sure that no one else here recognizes your authority on those issues either.

As far as I can see all you're doing is "preaching" in a thread where the topic is supposed to be on Witchcraft, and not on Christianity.

You have clearly rebuked the words of Jesus and aren't even in agreement with anything that he taught or held to be of value.

All you seem to want to do is condemn people in Jesus' name.

People who degrade Jesus like you do are a dime a dozen.

Jesus taught love and forgiveness, he did not teach condemnation for not believing in him. In fact, according to the Gospels he even taught that if any man did not believe in him or believe in his words he would not judge them. And he was speaking to those people directly face-to-face.

If he didn't expect people he was speaking to directly to believe in him, then he most certainly wouldn't expect anyone 2000 years later to believe in him based on highly controversial ancient hearsay rumors.

Your spreading of hatred (i.e. condemnation) in Jesus' name is truly disgusting.

You're not about to win any converts using such a demonic approach anyway.

I personally feel that people who use Jesus as an excuse to go around condemning people in Jesus' name have some serious problems. I personally feel that they just love to use the religion to generate hatred and animosity because they know that it upsets and disgusts people to be constantly beat over the head with a rubber Jesus doll.

You're not scaring anyone. Everyone here is far above that. Like I say, no one is even remotely convinced that you have anything at all to do with Jesus. All you're doing is making people sick at the stomach and giving Christianity and Jesus both a bad rap.

IMHO, if you truly believed in Jesus you'd be spreading joy and love throughout the word. The mere fact that you're totally obsessed with using Jesus as a weapon of condemnation on Internet forums speaks volumes.

Didn't Jesus himself teach that we can tell false prophets and preaches by the fruit of their messages?

You're never going to convince anyone that you have accepted Jesus into your heart as long as you are constantly preaching condemnation.

You're going to have to do better than that.

[Serpent Oracle]

Now all these Christians do is scream "JESUS HATES YOU!"

What's up with that?

Some do...they are just rather noisy and vocal.

There are however (as you probably know) some genuine Christians who truly do attempt to concentrate on the core of authentic Christian belief, love.
The same unconditional love the messiah professed.

These people I have no problem with & would happily call them brother or sister and furthermore I would defend them until the bitter end.

[Serpent Oracle]

There are rumours that my mother's side has some measure of gypsy blood... my youngest daughter looks almost Greek or Mediterranean of some kind and I do tan very easily...so maybe.
My wife is so pale and redheaded she gets sunburn from a full Moon or a 100W lightbulb...

You kinda look like a Gypsy in that picture. But actually he's a Kentuckian like me.

(Don't look for a point. There isn't one.)

OK..

Actually, as it goes, I have to dress up like Cpt Sparrow in September...for a festival a lifelong friend is organising, he is opening a (Tea and Cakes) refreshment stall/tent in which all the staff members are characters from cult films and TV, I was going to go as a Clockwork Orange character, until it was discovered I can impersonate Jack rather well.
My wife was overtly keen on the idea I have to add, the old tart.


I hope the friggin rain doesn't wash out my eye make up...

[Burninglight]

WADR, you should change you user name. There is nothing divine about your insight!

I beg your pardon sir, but who are you to judge what is divine and what isn't?

You continually act like as if you "Speak for Jesus" and that you are the official self-appointed Pope of Christianity. And then you have the audacity to tell other people that there is nothing divine about their insight.

Apparently your religious arrogance (meaning self-importance) has gone to your head.

With all due respect sir, I do not recognize your authority to speak for Christianity, and I most certainly don't respect your authority to speak for Jesus as "The Christ". And I'm quite sure that no one else here recognizes your authority on those issues either.

As far as I can see all you're doing is "preaching" in a thread where the topic is supposed to be on Witchcraft, and not on Christianity.

You have clearly rebuked the words of Jesus and aren't even in agreement with anything that he taught or held to be of value.

All you seem to want to do is condemn people in Jesus' name.

People who degrade Jesus like you do are a dime a dozen.

Jesus taught love and forgiveness, he did not teach condemnation for not believing in him. In fact, according to the Gospels he even taught that if any man did not believe in him or believe in his words he would not judge them. And he was speaking to those people directly face-to-face.

If he didn't expect people he was speaking to directly to believe in him, then he most certainly wouldn't expect anyone 2000 years later to believe in him based on highly controversial ancient hearsay rumors.

Your spreading of hatred (i.e. condemnation) in Jesus' name is truly disgusting.

You're not about to win any converts using such a demonic approach anyway.

I personally feel that people who use Jesus as an excuse to go around condemning people in Jesus' name have some serious problems. I personally feel that they just love to use the religion to generate hatred and animosity because they know that it upsets and disgusts people to be constantly beat over the head with a rubber Jesus doll.

You're not scaring anyone. Everyone here is far above that. Like I say, no one is even remotely convinced that you have anything at all to do with Jesus. All you're doing is making people sick at the stomach and giving Christianity and Jesus both a bad rap.

IMHO, if you truly believed in Jesus you'd be spreading joy and love throughout the word. The mere fact that you're totally obsessed with using Jesus as a weapon of condemnation on Internet forums speaks volumes.

Didn't Jesus himself teach that we can tell false prophets and preaches by the fruit of their messages?

You're never going to convince anyone that you have accepted Jesus into your heart as long as you are constantly preaching condemnation.

You're going to h ave to do better than that.

Jesus said by their fruits you shall know them. Not by the fruit of their message.
Besides, what is the fruit of my message? No purposes are established without time and judgment. IOW, it is too soon to tell. Jesus is about love and forgiveness. You accuse me of spreading hate and condemnation. What have I said that make you go to that extreme? I pray father forgive her for that comment against me and hold it not to her charge in Jesus name.
If you want the joy of the Lord, come out of witchcraft. It will take you where you don't want to go, keep you there longer than you want to stay and cost you more than you want to pay.
Love from the Lord doesn't always come in a warm fuzzy feeling and joy and happiness. Sometimes it comes in the form of rebuke. Don't confuse correction with condemnation or hate. The Lord chastens those He loves

[Burninglight]

Burninglight wrote:

...Moreover, you are being disrespectful that is against forum rules. I havent called you a bird that scuttles. You must be civil; if you cannot be, I will flag you

What, a Christian who spews threats of hell and eternal damnation at anyone who disagrees with him is now appealing to forum rules?

Surely you must understand that the language required for me to cast demonic spells often does not conform to that of polite debate. I apologize for calling you a scuttling parrot. That was metaphorical. I should have been more literal and called you a Bible-believing Christian, which means pretty much the same thing. You scuttle around in the Bible, pecking up verses that attract you and then spit them out at anyone who comes near.

You can call me a Bible believing Christian as much as you like. I would never call you on it, and you could believe that means anything you like. Now, would you be offended if I called you a witch?

What threats have I spewed out because of you're not agreeing? If you cannot prove that, that means you are now adding insult to injury.

Oh, please!!! If I wanted to insult you, you would know it. I am only gently making fun of you, as I would with any child.

Would I be offended if you called me a witch? No. If I thought you were using it metaphorically, I would probably be flattered. If I thought you really believed it (which I do), then I would be concerned for your mental condition and would prefer not to live in the same neighborhood with you.

A Christian neighbor once told me that demons sometimes gathered in his backyard at night and conducted strange rites there. I offered to come over with my shotgun and exorcise the demons for him. He became indignant and called me a nonbeliever. It almost seemed as if he would rather have the demons terrorizing him than to have someone prove they were not real. Hmmm.

In that case, I would have to say: Well, you have a very strange sense of humor. If someone asked you to be serious, would you be and say what it is that you really believe in?

Very well. I am an agnostic with some slight leanings toward the Eastern religious ideas and even the early Christian Gnostics. I do not deny the possibility of something beyond what we can see, but I am very sure it is not the primitive tribal wargod nonsense of the OT or the very artificial Jesus-God of the NT. I will not go into my reasons for those opinions here. I think Jesus probably existed and was a good and sincere teacher, but nothing more. Very little of him is left today. Most of the NT is advertising garbage.

I certainly do not believe there is any scriptural supernatural "God" looking over my shoulder and demanding that I obey his every irrational whim at the threat of terrible punishment. That is not morality to me. I believe that morality comes from our own "inner light," similar to the Gnostic belief that the human soul is a tiny spark of God within us. The God of the Gnostics is NOT the tribal God of the OT or the Father-God of the NT. The Gnostics rejected the OT god as a defective and evil impostor-god who had trapped human souls in his defective physical creation. The Gnostic God is remote and pure, not the "personal" and often irrational God of the Bible meddling in human affairs.

I do not "believe" all this, but it is certainly more believable than the Christian mess of inconsistent and contradictory doctrines, usually cherry-picked and used only to condemn others. I became a confirmed agnostic in high school when I began to realize how irrational it all was. My mother was a devout non-denominational Christian, but certainly did not believe in anything like your horrible threatening and demanding concept of Jesus. I resent the superstitious Fundamentalist Christian image of Jesus which degrades and corrupts all his teachings.

I know this is all heresy at best to you. Sorry about that.

thanks for sharing that. You mother seemed like a godly woman from your description. I don't condemn you nor do I agree. I pray you come to the knowledge of truth. Thanks for sharing. I believe that Jesus is the way the life and the truth. It is written he that has the son has life; he that doesn't have the son has not life, but the wrath of God abides on him. These are not my words or my judgments. Don't shoot the messenger if you don't like the message. I believe your mother believed these Scriptures as well.

[Serpent Oracle]

I pray father forgive her for that comment against me and hold it not to her charge in Jesus name.

You are trolling now, that was a particlularly ignorant and inflammatory comment, calculated to offend no doubt.
You are the one who should be begging for forgiveness.

If you want the joy of the Lord, come out of witchcraft. It will take you where you don't want to go, keep you there longer than you want to stay and cost you more than you want to pay.

Where did you read that?
In a fortune cookie?

Love from the Lord doesn't always come in a warm fuzzy feeling and joy and happiness. Sometimes it comes in the form of rebuke. Don't confuse correction with condemnation or hate. The Lord chastens those He loves

You are not the vassal or medium for the rebuke of the Lord...although you egotistically think you are.
You are just another tiresome hypocrite, looking for the speck of sawdust in your sister's eye whilst ignoring the huge plank in your own.

You might think the gravest sin is laughing at the offensive and idiotic garbage you spout...I have some good news for you...it isnt.

Your delusions of grandeur are clear to see for all.

[Serpent Oracle]

These are not my words or my judgments. Don't shoot the messenger if you don't like the message.

Keep your filthy fear mongering message to yourself please, it disgusts us.

Or perhaps post it upon a relevant forum, instead of polluting this thread.

Many thanks.

[ThatGirlAgain]

I pray father forgive her for that comment against me and hold it not to her charge in Jesus name. If you want the joy of the Lord, come out of witchcraft.

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[otseng]

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Moderator comments do not count as a strike against any posters. They only serve as an acknowledgment that a post report has been received, but has not been judged to warrant a moderator warning against a particular poster.