Quran Burining and Associated Killings

[fredonly]

Afghan President asks US Congress to condemn Quran burning

Afghan protests continue against Qur'an burning

I have absolutely no problem with Muslims peacefully protesting the rude act of Quran burning. But what I cannot understand is why Muslims are not protesting the deaths of innocent people that were the result of these protests. Do Muslims consider a copy of their "sacred" book to be more important than a human life? I certainly hope not, but I'd like to hear that from the Muslims who participate on this site.


Are there stories about the protests my Muslim leaders over these deaths? I haven't seen any, so please post the links if you see one.

[happy forever]

May I know how did you turn to your nature and break the burdens of your parents' religion and your community's culture?

I had always questioned, to myself, different things, that seemed far fetched to me, but never opened my mouth, because it felt disrespectful to. After I got old enough, and wise enough, I started questioning. After I questioned, I wanted to find answers. That started my internet search for answers. I have studied all the major religions, along with every other religion I could find information about, plus holy books, new age books, and online articles, forums, and websites. With all of the information I have studied, researched, and picked apart, I have to believe in Deism, because in it's simplest form, it just says, I believe in God, not myths, legend, or hearsay. I believe in God because I can see it in nature, and I feel it in my heart. This my friend, does not come from any one book.

But you didn't read Quran. Belief is in heart and Allah is The God of hearts, who can know what are in them except He? Did you see the video?

"Allah! There is no God save Him, the Alive, the Eternal. Neither slumber nor sleep overtaketh Him. Unto Him belongeth whatsoever is in the heavens and whatsoever is in the earth. Who is he that intercedeth with Him save by His leave? He knoweth that which is in front of them and that which is behind them, while they encompass nothing of His knowledge save what He will. His throne includeth the heavens and the earth, and He is never weary of preserving them. He is the Sublime, the Tremendous. (255) There is no compulsion in religion. The right direction is henceforth distinct from error. And he who rejecteth false deities and believeth in Allah hath grasped a firm handhold which will never break. Allah is Hearer, Knower. (256)" [2:255/256]

I don't force you to read Quan, I show you the mercy of Allah.

I consider this post is part of the answer of my question.

[JayDeist]

I appreciate your answer, and yes, I have read the Quran. And I believe that religions were not sent by God. God doesn't need to send religion. God made the universe, the laws of nature, and set it in motion. There is no need to tweak his creation anymore. Religions are man's best attempts at explaining the unexplainable, and comforting the fears of death. This is where all religion came from. And ALL religions have errors in them, ALL of them. Here is my one point I have to make in bold letters...

You can NOT quote GOD

Any man who attempts to quote God, I disbelieve right off the bat. No one has a direct link to the mind of God. And no one should ever try to quote God. This is the highest disrespect to God that I know of. Putting words in God's mouth, to defend a certain stance or belief.

Allah, Christ, Buddha, are words in books. They are names for God (except for Buddha), but I don't believe any of them are actually God. I read parts from all religions, and philosophies. That don't mean I believe every one. I don't wholly believe in any religion, especially revealed religions. My search is to broaden my own knowledge and perspective. So I have to disagree with you there. You know your God from your book, and take certain rules, commands, laws, and such and say they're from God and they're not, they are all from the minds of men. Basically what Allah, Muhammad, Jesus Christ, Yahweh, or whoever said, are quotes from man, and I take them as nothing more than that.

I'll watch your youtube video, if you read Thomas Paine's The Age of Reason.

[happy forever]

I appreciate your answer, and yes, I have read the Quran. And I believe that religions were not sent by God. God doesn't need to send religion. God made the universe, the laws of nature, and set it in motion. There is no need to tweak his creation anymore. Religions are man's best attempts at explaining the unexplainable, and comforting the fears of death. This is where all religion came from. And ALL religions have errors in them, ALL of them. Here is my one point I have to make in bold letters...

You can NOT quote GOD

Any man who attempts to quote God, I disbelieve right off the bat. No one has a direct link to the mind of God. And no one should ever try to quote God. This is the highest disrespect to God that I know of. Putting words in God's mouth, to defend a certain stance or belief.

Allah, Christ, Buddha, are words in books. They are names for God (except for Buddha), but I don't believe any of them are actually God. I read parts from all religions, and philosophies. That don't mean I believe every one. I don't wholly believe in any religion, especially revealed religions. My search is to broaden my own knowledge and perspective. So I have to disagree with you there. You know your God from your book, and take certain rules, commands, laws, and such and say they're from God and they're not, they are all from the minds of men. Basically what Allah, Muhammad, Jesus Christ, Yahweh, or whoever said, are quotes from man, and I take them as nothing more than that.

I'll watch your youtube video, if you read Thomas Paine's The Age of Reason.

I studied the age of reason in civilization and will not read that book. I think you already believe in what is in that video because it is talking about nature. You are free.

Yes, life animals, plants, all creatures don't need religion, do you know why?
Simply because they don't have mind, they know their Creator by nature and worship him.

"All that is in the heavens and all that is in the earth glorifieth Allah; unto Him belongeth Sovereignty and unto Him belongeth praise, and He is Able to do all things. (1)"

But man......Can you tell me why are we created with mind? Why are we on earth? Why do we live? Why death? Why birth? Why good? Why evil?

The answer of these questions must be answered by The God because He is our Creator and as He gave us mind and this mind is unable to answer these very important questions, so He gave us the answers logical answer from trusted sources very trusted sources with no slight mare as it comes from The God.

If you find any religion is with slight mistake, then this relligion is for sure is false but be sure that there must be one true religion for us humans the only creatures with mind.

[Jacob Simonsky]

Afghan President asks US Congress to condemn Quran burning

Afghan protests continue against Qur'an burning

I have absolutely no problem with Muslims peacefully protesting the rude act of Quran burning. But what I cannot understand is why Muslims are not protesting the deaths of innocent people that were the result of these protests. Do Muslims consider a copy of their "sacred" book to be more important than a human life? I certainly hope not, but I'd like to hear that from the Muslims who participate on this site.


Are there stories about the protests my Muslim leaders over these deaths? I haven't seen any, so please post the links if you see one.

In ancient times "death" was the most common penalty for most infractions of the law of the land. There are isolated parts of the earth which have not changed much over the centuries and it is these who do not seem to value human life. The laws which give us in the west so much freedom to act and proclaim are light years ahead of some other countries. Understanding this is vital to deciding how we will react to it. Shall we have a war over some difference? Some others think that war in the Name of God can be man's highest calling because they are demonstrating to God how firm their beliefs are. God is then very pleased with them.

"Understand your enemy" said a famous general and our enemy is the gap of thousands of years, not any religion or people.

[PeterTyel]

Afghan President asks US Congress to condemn Quran burning

Afghan protests continue against Qur'an burning

I have absolutely no problem with Muslims peacefully protesting the rude act of Quran burning. But what I cannot understand is why Muslims are not protesting the deaths of innocent people that were the result of these protests. Do Muslims consider a copy of their "sacred" book to be more important than a human life? I certainly hope not, but I'd like to hear that from the Muslims who participate on this site.


Are there stories about the protests my Muslim leaders over these deaths? I haven't seen any, so please post the links if you see one.

My friend Islam does not allow to fight Evil with Evil. To kill innocent people in Islam it is consider the second major sin that you can ever make as a muslim. the first is to make kufr, which means to worship other than Allah. If you on purpose kill an innocent man, muslim or non-muslim you will propably end up in Hell fire.

What these muslims should have done was, to make a peaceful protest that means don't burn other countries flag or ambasades or kill innocent people. And pray to Allah that Allah should punish them who burn the Quran.

The Quran, chapt 5,v32 says: "anyone who saves one life, it is as if he has saved the whole of mankind and anyone who has killed another person (except in lieu of murder or mischief on earth) it is as if he has killed the whole of mankind"

So killing and innocent person does not make it right because you want to justifed an another persons crime.

The same goes for Osama bin ladens 9/11 attack and all the other terrorist attacks against innocent civilized people, it is wrong according to Allah, Islam, The Quran and the Prophet Muhammed.

[Burninglight]

Afghan President asks US Congress to condemn Quran burning

Afghan protests continue against Qur'an burning

I have absolutely no problem with Muslims peacefully protesting the rude act of Quran burning. But what I cannot understand is why Muslims are not protesting the deaths of innocent people that were the result of these protests. Do Muslims consider a copy of their "sacred" book to be more important than a human life? I certainly hope not, but I'd like to hear that from the Muslims who participate on this site.


Are there stories about the protests my Muslim leaders over these deaths? I haven't seen any, so please post the links if you see one.

No one should have a problem with Muslims peacefully protesting Quran burning, but why would many of them have such a violent reaction to it when Uthman burned the original Qurans shortly after the death of Muhammad beats me.
Moreover, they say the Bible is corrupted and Christians don't have the originals. Be that as it may, at least Christians know what was abrogated or added and even the translational errors in the Bible, bc they burned nothing. Muslims don't know what changes have been made by the non-prophet Uthman. After he recompiled the Quran he covered all his tracks by destroying all older versions. One can make a good argument as the why the Quran is the corrupted scripture. There was no divine mandate given that it should've been written. Quran means recite not write!

[Burninglight]

Afghan President asks US Congress to condemn Quran burning

Afghan protests continue against Qur'an burning

I have absolutely no problem with Muslims peacefully protesting the rude act of Quran burning. But what I cannot understand is why Muslims are not protesting the deaths of innocent people that were the result of these protests. Do Muslims consider a copy of their "sacred" book to be more important than a human life? I certainly hope not, but I'd like to hear that from the Muslims who participate on this site.


Are there stories about the protests my Muslim leaders over these deaths? I haven't seen any, so please post the links if you see one.

My friend Islam does not allow to fight Evil with Evil. To kill innocent people in Islam it is consider the second major sin that you can ever make as a muslim. the first is to make kafir, which means to worship other than Allah. If you on purpose kill an innocent man, muslim or non-muslim you will propably end up in Hell fire.

What these muslims should have done was, to make a peaceful protest that means don't burn other countries flag or ambasades or kill innocent people. And pray to Allah that Allah should punish them who burn the Quran.

The Quran, chapt 5,v32 says: "anyone who saves one life, it is as if he has saved the whole of mankind and anyone who has killed another person (except in lieu of murder or mischief on earth) it is as if he has killed the whole of mankind"

So killing and innocent person does not make it right because you want to justifed an another persons crime.

The same goes for Osama bin ladens 9/11 attack and all the other terrorist attacks against innocent civilized people, it is wrong according to Allah, Islam, The Quran and the Prophet Muhammed.

It is wrong in Islam to kill innocent people, but who are innocent people? Isn't only other Muslim? Anyone who doesn't believe in the god of Islam is an unbeliever. No unbeliever is innocent to a true Muslim. They are Kafirs. But atheists are more innocent than those who associate partners unto God. They claim Christians do that. They don't believe Christians when they say they are truly monothiestic.

[Asher]

Peace be upon you,

No one should have a problem with Muslims peacefully protesting Quran burning, but why would many of them have such a violent reaction to it when Uthman burned the original Qurans shortly after the death of Muhammad beats me.

Brother every time and every post where you are you always put forth this argument, find the answer there:
http://www.harvardhouse.com/quran_purity.htm

Moreover, they say the Bible is corrupted and Christians don't have the originals.

Not only muslims tell that, many Christians and Jews too agree;

Be that as it may, at least Christians know what was abrogated or added and even the translational errors in the Bible, bc they burned nothing.

If you know what was "abrogated or added and even the translational errors in the Bible" why is it still there?
You have said in some other post that you have I think 10000 copies of the Bible; Maybe you forgot to mention that there were no two Identical;

Muslims don't know what changes have been made by the non-prophet Uthman. After he recompiled the Quran he covered all his tracks by destroying all older versions.

Muslim surely don't know what was changed as no change was done;
He ordered the burning of the variants (vowels), so as to prevent the problem which arise with the Bible;

http://www.bibleufo.com/anomlostbooks.htm
Constantine began what was to become a centuries long effort to eliminate any book in the original Bible that was considered unacceptable to the new doctrine of the church.

Jesus warned you about what you are doing:

Matthew 7:1-5
1 Judge not, that ye be not judged.
2 For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
3 And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
4 Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?
5 Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.

One can make a good argument as the why the Quran is the corrupted scripture. There was no divine mandate given that it should've been written.

Prove me that the Qur'an is corrupted then;
Prove that all the books found in the bible has "divine mandate"; On the Contrary the bible was Authorize by KING JAMES, not God Almighty, but King James;

Quran means recite not write!

I consider this to be an argument; Bible means Book not Divine Book; But it is just a name;

It is wrong in Islam to kill innocent people, but who are innocent people? Isn't only other Muslim?

Before moving to the Qur'an try to find the answer in the "holy bible";
I would like to know who is the innocent in the following verses?

Numbers 31:17-18
17 Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him.
18 But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves.

Anyone who doesn't believe in the god of Islam is an unbeliever. No unbeliever is innocent to a true Muslim. They are Kafirs.

In every religion on earth those who does not believe in the god of that religion is an unbeliever;
Kafirs and innocent are not opposite terms;
Kafirs means unbelievers there is no relation with innocence;

But atheists are more innocent than those who associate partners unto God. They claim Christians do that. They don't believe Christians when they say they are truly monothiestic.

The Christian doctrine(trinitarian) says:
There is one God;
But you also say the opposite with that;
That the Father is God, The Son is God and the Holy Ghost is God but not 3 Gods but 1 God;
That the Father is a person, The Son is a person and the Holy Ghost is a person but not 3 persons but 1 person;
That the Father is almighty, The Son is almighty and the Holy Ghost is almighty but not 3 almighties but 1 almighty;

God is not like a 3 in 1 photocopier, scanner, printer;
God is one, that has son(in the begotten term) nor any parent;
He does not need to "visit" anyone nor to "do unto" anyone to create anything;
God is sufficient to himself; He does not need me neither needs you;

Genesis 21:1-2
1 And the Lord visited Sarah as he had said, and the Lord did unto Sarah as he had spoken.
2 For Sarah conceived, and bare Abraham a son in his old age, at the set time of which God had spoken to him.

Peace be upon you all;

[Burninglight]

Peace be upon you,

No one should have a problem with Muslims peacefully protesting Quran burning, but why would many of them have such a violent reaction to it when Uthman burned the original Qurans shortly after the death of Muhammad beats me.

Brother every time and every post where you are you always put forth this argument, find the answer there:
http://www.harvardhouse.com/quran_purity.htm

Moreover, they say the Bible is corrupted and Christians don't have the originals.

Not only muslims tell that, many Christians and Jews too agree;

Be that as it may, at least Christians know what was abrogated or added and even the translational errors in the Bible, bc they burned nothing.

If you know what was "abrogated or added and even the translational errors in the Bible" why is it still there?
You have said in some other post that you have I think 10000 copies of the Bible; Maybe you forgot to mention that there were no two Identical;

The translational errors are still there because unlike Uthman we don't burn our different versions of the Bible to cover up mistakes. Scholars know the abrogations and interpolations; I know of them too. But Uthman burned the Qurans to cover his tracks and his abrogations such as Allah's three daughters. Quran was compiled not by recitation, but with the help of text (Hasfah's copy). Oddly, hers was destroyed too. The spirit of the Bible about Jesus being Lord; His death and resurrection are consistent with all versions of the Bible. So what are you talking about?

PBUY too

[Asher]

Peace be upon you,

The translational errors are still there because unlike Uthman we don't burn our different versions of the Bible to cover up mistakes.

This is an illogical statement, what does the burning of the bible has to do with error which it contains; Remember from among your 10000copies of the bible, no 2 of them are Identical

Scholars know the abrogations and interpolations; I know of them too.

Do not just say that they and you know about the "abrogations and interpolations" prove that you know;

But Uthman burned the Qurans to cover his tracks and his abrogations such as Allah's three daughters.

It seems that you have no argument anymore that's why you keep on repeating yourself:
The suppose abrogations were only differences in the vowels, which non-arabic people did not know how to pronounce the words and the pronounced it wrongly;
The suppose "Allah's three daughters" was cancelled in the time of the prophet itself:
Muhammad(pbuh) said to every one that this verse was not the words of God;
Muhammad(pbuh) was still alive at that time, and the Qur'an was compiled after his death, you should review your timeline of events;

Quran was compiled not by recitation, but with the help of text (Hasfah's copy). Oddly, hers was destroyed too.

According to you how was the "Hasfah's copy" compiled?
Uthman was not a complete ignorant about the Qur'an (constatine who destroy part of the bible was ignorant about christianity) when he ordered the compilation;
"Hasfah's copy" also had variations(vowels) that's why he destroyed it too;

The spirit of the Bible about Jesus being Lord; His death and resurrection are consistent with all versions of the Bible. So what are you talking about?

The argument I bring forth was the fact that though you may see in the "Gospels" that Jesus died and was resurrected: These "Gospels" were chosen not by God, by man, and they were neither inspired by God but was what they have heard;
John who wrote the book of revelation was so jealous about Paul having "had visions" about Jesus wanted to become an apostle so badly that he had nightmares;
The only place where Jesus says that he is the Beginning and the end is in this nightmare;

Matthew 7:22-23
22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.

IN ANY COURT OF LAW OF ANY COUNTRY IF YOU BRING WITNESSES WHO HAVE HEARD FROM HEARSAY OR EVEN HAVE HAD NIGHTMARES TO COME FORTH TO TESTIFY, NONE OF THERE TESTIMONIES WILL BE TAKEN INTO CONSIDERATION;
This is the reason why the common of Christiandom says that the Bible is inspired where indeed it is just vain desires;

Peace be upon you all;