For any theist

[Ragna]

It is some personal experiences in the forum and a topic I saw about a theist member leaving that prompted my curiosity.

Though not always, I understand that if one is a convinced theist, specially a Christian, and holds something as holy, some conversations might feel a little aggressive or disrespectful, though after all you know the thoughts of people who are here. In fact, it's not uncommon to have a tense atmosphere, a situation I don't like at all and would like to avoid as much as possible in the future, because actually there are a good number of theists I feel sympathy for. So these are my questions, and I will sincerely appreciate thoughtful answers. And remember, this is totally impersonal. I'm looking for general answers.

Firstly, do you ever find debating disrespectful to your faith, in any sense, in any context? If so, what is your reason for debating then?

When do you think a non-theist is being disrespectful?

Do you any time try to empathize with non-theists and their thoughts on the matter? When you do, do you still receive the original impression?

As a side comment for this last one, I must say that I sometimes try to empathize with Christians and understand them, and it's not impossible - but of course, not always feasible. In my own opinion, it highly depends on the atmosphere and the sympathy towards the opponent.

[Kuan]

It is some personal experiences in the forum and a topic I saw about a theist member leaving that prompted my curiosity.

Though not always, I understand that if one is a convinced theist, specially a Christian, and holds something as holy, some conversations might feel a little aggressive or disrespectful, though after all you know the thoughts of people who are here. In fact, it's not uncommon to have a tense atmosphere, a situation I don't like at all and would like to avoid as much as possible in the future, because actually there are a good number of theists I feel sympathy for. So these are my questions, and I will sincerely appreciate thoughtful answers. And remember, this is totally impersonal. I'm looking for general answers.

I hope I can help. For the most part, I dont get offended by any question or criticism of my faith.

Firstly, do you ever find debating disrespectful to your faith, in any sense, in any context? If so, what is your reason for debating then?

Not really, but it can be. I have run into problems of misrepresentations or misunderstandings of my faith but thats the most. Overall, its not unless the other is trying to be rude.

When do you think a non-theist is being disrespectful?

Personally, sometimes the statement that believing in god is foolish or something along those lines. That bugs me sometimes. I understand your reasoning and thought, but maybe be a little more....soft?

Do you any time try to empathize with non-theists and their thoughts on the matter? When you do, do you still receive the original impression?

All the time.

Was i helpful?

[Ragna]

Personally, sometimes the statement that believing in god is foolish or something along those lines. That bugs me sometimes. I understand your reasoning and thought, but maybe be a little more....soft?

Yes, I can understand that. I would never normally call it stupid or foolish (that's loaded) unless I'm really angry, and that's not something I will do here. The most "harsh" I think I can get is calling it "irrational", but in the sense of "not following reason", not in a pejorative way. Is that offensive?

Was i helpful?

Sure, I welcome any thoughts and will take any opinion into account as much as I can. Thank you for your contribution.

[Kuan]

Yes, I can understand that. I would never normally call it stupid or foolish (that's loaded) unless I'm really angry, and that's not something I will do here. The most "harsh" I think I can get is calling it "irrational", but in the sense of "not following reason", not in a pejorative way. Is that offensive?

I dont have a problem with it, just dont keep aying it and ill be cool, lol.

[JehovahsWitness]

It is some personal experiences in the forum and a topic I saw about a theist member leaving that prompted my curiosity.

Though not always, I understand that if one is a convinced theist, specially a Christian, and holds something as holy, some conversations might feel a little aggressive or disrespectful, though after all you know the thoughts of people who are here. In fact, it's not uncommon to have a tense atmosphere, a situation I don't like at all and would like to avoid as much as possible in the future, because actually there are a good number of theists I feel sympathy for. So these are my questions, and I will sincerely appreciate thoughtful answers. And remember, this is totally impersonal. I'm looking for general answers.

Firstly, do you ever find debating disrespectful to your faith, in any sense, in any context? If so, what is your reason for debating then?

When do you think a non-theist is being disrespectful?

Do you any time try to empathize with non-theists and their thoughts on the matter? When you do, do you still receive the original impression?

As a side comment for this last one, I must say that I sometimes try to empathize with Christians and understand them, and it's not impossible - but of course, not always feasible. In my own opinion, it highly depends on the atmosphere and the sympathy towards the opponent.

I personally have not come across ANY disrespect and the disrespectful posts I have seen have mostly been moderated.

A lot are EXTREMELY disrespectful to God, and while I don't find that pleasant to see, He can defend himself.

[Adstar]

It is some personal experiences in the forum and a topic I saw about a theist member leaving that prompted my curiosity.

Though not always, I understand that if one is a convinced theist, specially a Christian, and holds something as holy, some conversations might feel a little aggressive or disrespectful, though after all you know the thoughts of people who are here. In fact, it's not uncommon to have a tense atmosphere, a situation I don't like at all and would like to avoid as much as possible in the future, because actually there are a good number of theists I feel sympathy for. So these are my questions, and I will sincerely appreciate thoughtful answers. And remember, this is totally impersonal. I'm looking for general answers.

Firstly, do you ever find debating disrespectful to your faith, in any sense, in any context? If so, what is your reason for debating then?

We believe Jesus and wish to do our best in following His will. Replying to denigrating insulting people is loving people who are enemies to you.

Matthew 5
43 “You have heard that it was said, ‘You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy.’ 44 But I say to you, love your enemies, bless those who curse you, do good to those who hate you, and pray for those who spitefully use you and persecute you, 45 that you may be sons of your Father in heaven; for He makes His sun rise on the evil and on the good, and sends rain on the just and on the unjust. 46 For if you love those who love you, what reward have you? Do not even the tax collectors do the same? 47 And if you greet your brethren only, what do you do more than others? Do not even the tax collectors do so? 48 Therefore you shall be perfect, just as your Father in heaven is perfect.

So going the extra mile with an obnoxious person is doing what Jesus wants us to do. We love Jesus and want to do our best to follow His will. We often fall down in our attempts, but the desire persists.

Do you any time try to empathize with non-theists and their thoughts on the matter? When you do, do you still receive the original impression?

I don't "Try"... True Empathy just comes to one. If someone is trying to empathise then it is forced and fake empathy.

I have experienced great empathy leading to mournful tears at some of the stories of negative experiences in early life of those who have been burnt by religion and false Christianity.

But it soon becomes clear wether the person is a wounded soul or just a arrogant hate monger.

As a side comment for this last one, I must say that I sometimes try to empathize with Christians and understand them, and it's not impossible - but of course, not always feasible. In my own opinion, it highly depends on the atmosphere and the sympathy towards the opponent.

Well since we are using a type of communication that only allows words, I find that if people are looking for offence they can pretty well interpret most neutral statements in a negative light. Many seem to take a perverse delight in projecting evil internet upon the other if they do not agree with the others POV. he have perfected it as a kind of Art.

Pasting negative stereotypical images upon others is seen as a legitimate debating tactic by some.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Ragna]

Thank you for your replies. Some observations:

Do you any time try to empathize with non-theists and their thoughts on the matter? When you do, do you still receive the original impression?

I don't "Try"... True Empathy just comes to one. If someone is trying to empathise then it is forced and fake empathy.

It's a special kind of language. The empathic feeling may be passive, but that's not what I'm referring to. It's a more active action, the action of actually sitting down, reading carefully and delving into the other's PoV. That doesn't just "come".

But it soon becomes clear wether the person is a wounded soul or just a arrogant hate monger.

No middle ground?

[Adstar]

Thank you for your replies. Some observations:

Do you any time try to empathize with non-theists and their thoughts on the matter? When you do, do you still receive the original impression?

I don't "Try"... True Empathy just comes to one. If someone is trying to empathise then it is forced and fake empathy.

It's a special kind of language. The empathic feeling may be passive, but that's not what I'm referring to. It's a more active action, the action of actually sitting down, reading carefully and delving into the other's PoV. That doesn't just "come".

But it soon becomes clear wether the person is a wounded soul or just a arrogant hate monger.

No middle ground?

When people are reacting to you in a aggressive, denigrating, hating way, then there is no middle ground.

That person is either a person wounded by what they believe is christianity and is in fact not Christianity. Or they are Rejectors of true Christianity. in such cases it is the Christians calling to take the hate and venting and to persist with love to that one to show them the true Love of the truth that Jesus revealed. This is to establish what type they are.

Now once that truth is revealed to them and they persist in mockery, hate and denigration then they have revealed to you that they are truly wilful rejectors of the love of the truth. What ever there past experiences with false christianity it NEVER justifies their rejection of the true Message of the Messiah Jesus when it is presented to them. Never ever.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days

[Ragna]

When people are reacting to you in a aggressive, denigrating, hating way, then there is no middle ground.

That person is either a person wounded by what they believe is christianity and is in fact not Christianity. Or they are Rejectors of true Christianity. in such cases it is the Christians calling to take the hate and venting and to persist with love to that one to show them the true Love of the truth that Jesus revealed. This is to establish what type they are.

Now once that truth is revealed to them and they persist in mockery, hate and denigration then they have revealed to you that they are truly wilful rejectors of the love of the truth. What ever there past experiences with false christianity it NEVER justifies their rejection of the true Message of the Messiah Jesus when it is presented to them. Never ever.

But that's not what I was referring to. Maybe an example will do better. I'm not a Christian now, I have not had tragic religious experiences, so I don't fit as a "wounded soul" (unless you argue I do). Does that make me instantly an arrogant hate monger?

I was referring to this:

But it soon becomes clear wether the person is a wounded soul or just a arrogant hate monger.

Note I said "me" but it's just irrelevant whoever it's applied to. I was just curious about the dichotomy.

Or you were just speaking about specific people which have converted from other kinds of Christianity to the one you consider veracious?

[Adstar]

When people are reacting to you in a aggressive, denigrating, hating way, then there is no middle ground.

That person is either a person wounded by what they believe is christianity and is in fact not Christianity. Or they are Rejectors of true Christianity. in such cases it is the Christians calling to take the hate and venting and to persist with love to that one to show them the true Love of the truth that Jesus revealed. This is to establish what type they are.

Now once that truth is revealed to them and they persist in mockery, hate and denigration then they have revealed to you that they are truly wilful rejectors of the love of the truth. What ever there past experiences with false christianity it NEVER justifies their rejection of the true Message of the Messiah Jesus when it is presented to them. Never ever.

But that's not what I was referring to. Maybe an example will do better. I'm not a Christian now, I have not had tragic religious experiences, so I don't fit as a "wounded soul" (unless you argue I do). Does that make me instantly an arrogant hate monger?

Where did i state that you where a hate monger? please Quote where i said you where a hate monger.

Take a look at the topic of the post. Look at the Opening post (Hey you wrote it) Here i will Quote you. Not try and paste an attitude on you like you are trying to do to me in the above parragraph.

Firstly, do you ever find debating disrespectful to your faith, in any sense, in any context? If so, what is your reason for debating then?

Is this an accurate quote? Yes it is. What is the subject about? What should my post be interpreted as a response to? YOUR QUESTION.

1) We are talking about How i interact with people who are "disrespectful" to my faith. That was the established criteria You set at the start. Now your trying to move the goal posts to say that my reply was a personal reply talking about you. When any reasonable person interpreting my reply would see it as a reply talking about people who are Disrespectful of my faith.

I was referring to this:

But it soon becomes clear wether the person is a wounded soul or just a arrogant hate monger.

Note I said "me" but it's just irrelevant whoever it's applied to. I was just curious about the dichotomy.

This topic was not about you. This topic was about people who are disrespectful to Christians and thats how i answered it.

Or you were just speaking about specific people which have converted from other kinds of Christianity to the one you consider veracious?

I am speaking from my personal experiance from people who have been abusive towards me because of my faith.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days