Christians: Question on Homosexualality

[Fides et Veritas]

First let me note that this is not a debate forum. I do not want arguments against other posts. If someone says something that you disagree with then feel free to post it one of the many debate threads for this subject. Feel free to ask for clarification. But do not attack or start arguments. This is precisely why I posted here and not in the Debate section. Refer to the numbered list below and please endeavor to stick with it.

Thank You.


1.)What denomination are you?
2.)How old are you?
3.)Are you an active member of your denomination?(I know people who are 4.)5.)4.)Catholic who never attend mass)?
5.)Are you close to anyone who is Homosexual(family, coworkers, friends, etc)?
6.)Do you think Homosexuality is a choice or is it genetic? Both?
7.)Does your denomination feel the same toward Homosexuality as you do?
8.)How do you treat Homosexuals that wait on you at restaurants, or fix your car?
9.)Do you support Civil Unions? Marriage?
10.)Do you also support them for people who are Homosexual?
11.)What verses do you feel stand against Homosexuality?
12.)What verses do you feel support Homosexuality?


Thanks

[Fides et Veritas]

Thank you for your input and participation in my post.

[Fides et Veritas]

Thank you for your input and participation in my post.

[janavoss]

1.)What denomination are you?
2.)How old are you?
3.)Are you an active member of your denomination?(I know people who are 4.)5.)4.)Catholic who never attend mass)?
5.)Are you close to anyone who is Homosexual(family, coworkers, friends, etc)?
6.)Do you think Homosexuality is a choice or is it genetic? Both?
7.)Does your denomination feel the same toward Homosexuality as you do?
8.)How do you treat Homosexuals that wait on you at restaurants, or fix your car?
9.)Do you support Civil Unions? Marriage?
10.)Do you also support them for people who are Homosexual?
11.)What verses do you feel stand against Homosexuality?
12.)What verses do you feel support Homosexuality?

1.) Non-denominational Christian
2.) Mid-40's
3.) Yes
4.) N/A
5.) Yes - family members, co-workers, family members of friends
6.) I don't know enough about genetics to say. There are some people who have known they were gay since they were very young. That certainly does not seem like a choice. But others are bi-sexual, so for them it is a choice either way.
7.) Not sure. I can't recall any sermons specifically about homosexuality.
8.) The same as everyone else. How would I even know, unless they told me?
9.) Yes, either one.
10.) I neither support nor oppose either one.
11.) Acts 15:20 and 15:29, Acts 21:25, Romans 13:13, 1 Corinthians 5:11, 6:9, and 6:13, Galatians 5:19, Ephesians 5:3, Colossian 3:5
12.) I do not know of any.

[dianaiad]

(GREAT FORMAT....I'm taking it too )

[mrow][mcol]30 years ago (1)[mcol]Now [row]What denomination are you? [col]LDS (Mormon) [col]Yep, still LDS[row]How old are you? [col]32[col]62[row]Are you an active member of your denomination? [col]Yep [col]Yep, still here.[row]Are you close to anyone who is Homosexual(family, coworkers, friends, etc)? [col]No [col]Yep. My daughter's best friend, some co-workers, a few others [row]Do you think Homosexuality is a choice or is it genetic? Both? [col]Either, both, maybe Homosexuality is not itself a sin but homosexual actions are (yes, stole that answer, too![col]Still think so [row]Does your denomination feel the same toward Homosexuality as you do? [col]Pretty much, yes [col]Still the same [row]How do you treat Homosexuals that wait on you at restaurants, or fix your car? [col]As long as they don't make passes, who could tell? [col] Same thing; what's your sexual orientation got to do with serving me a hamburger or pounding that supermarket cart dent out of my bumper? [row]Do you support Civil Unions or Marriage for people who are Homosexual?[col]No [col]Yes to both...as long as the law doesn't make me recognize the MARRIAGE (over and above civil rights) within my own faith

I figure that homosexual acts are no different than any other sexual act outside marriage in terms of 'sin.' My own religious beliefs apply only to those who share them, though...so those who don't should certainly not be held to them...and should be allowed the same civil rights married people get. They should also be allowed to marry WITHIN THEIR OWN FAITH exactly the same way I should be allowed to marry within mine. Precisely the same way. However, because Mormons believe in a 'two tiered' marriage...that is, 'until death do you part' and 'for eternity," (and they are different) we have a problem with homosexual partners becoming married in that sense. It's not that they are any more sinful than anybody else; it's simply that it's not possible for homosexuals to be married in our belief system. Not 'sinful' to be married, IMPOSSIBLE....as in 'not in the definition.' as in...you may as well point to a tree and an eagle and say the words...but no matter how many words you say, they ain't married in OUR definition of that term.

But then nobody but Mormons consider that our 'marriage for time and eternity' is any different than their own 'until death part you,' either. That's fine. We aren't asking the government to recognize that, because THAT isn't up to the government. That's what we want here; I...and as far as I am aware, most Mormons...don't have a problem with gays getting all the rights the government wants to hand them. Just don't make us have to change our religious definition of 'marriage' to accommodate government regulations.

[Moses Yoder]

Thanks to McCulloch for the table

[mrow][mcol]thirty years ago[mcol]now [row]What denomination are you? [col] Mennonite [col]Non-Denominational [row]How old are you? [col]14[col]44[row]Are you an active member of your denomination? [col]Yes [col]Yes [row]Are you close to anyone who is Homosexual(family, coworkers, friends, etc)? [col]No [col]Yes, nephew, coworker [row]Do you think Homosexuality is a choice or is it genetic? Both? [col]Choice. [col]Genetic or choice. [row])Does your denomination feel the same toward Homosexuality as you do? [col]Yes [col]Yes [row]How do you treat Homosexuals that wait on you at restaurants, or fix your car? [col]I never met a homosexual until I was about 30 I think [col]How would I know? This is a terrible question. Do they smell like onions or something? [row]Do you support Civil Unions or Marriage for people who are Homosexual?[col]No, for no real reason [col]No, for very specific reasons

[gnik]

1.)What denomination are you?
2.)How old are you?
3.)Are you an active member of your denomination?(I know people who are 4.)5.)4.)Catholic who never attend mass)?
5.)Are you close to anyone who is Homosexual(family, coworkers, friends, etc)?
6.)Do you think Homosexuality is a choice or is it genetic? Both?
7.)Does your denomination feel the same toward Homosexuality as you do?
8.)How do you treat Homosexuals that wait on you at restaurants, or fix your car?
9.)Do you support Civil Unions? Marriage?
10.)Do you also support them for people who are Homosexual?
11.)What verses do you feel stand against Homosexuality?
12.)What verses do you feel support Homosexuality?

1. I am not of a denomination. I am Christian. That is all that matters to me.
2. 21 although I don't believe age matters as much as maturity does.
3. n/a
4. Umm... not really a question...
5. Yes, Me and my boyfriend are both homosexual. there would be problems if one of us wasn't. XP
6. I think it is neither. I know that it sure wasn't a choice for me. And there is no way that homosexual genes would survive. It also isn't environmental factors for me, so I don't know what it is.
7. n/a
8. Like humans. unless they tell you, how would you ever know they were homosexual?
9. Civil Unions, as an alternative to marriage, no. Civil Unions as marriage in everyone's eyes other then the government, yes. Marriage, yes.
10. Same as 9
11. None. The bible addressed homosexual acts, homosexuality didn't exist as a consent within Christianity when the Bible was written. They only saw it as the acts.
12. Same as 11.

[help3434]

1.)What denomination are you?
LDS
2.)How old are you?
26
3.)Are you an active member of your denomination?(I know people who are 4.)5.)4.)Catholic who never attend mass)?
No
5.)Are you close to anyone who is Homosexual(family, coworkers, friends, etc)?
I have known people are but not really been close
6.)Do you think Homosexuality is a choice or is it genetic? Both?
For most it is not a choice. Not entirely genetic, but must be influenced by genes.
7.)Does your denomination feel the same toward Homosexuality as you do?
No, but they are getting better
8.)How do you treat Homosexuals that wait on you at restaurants, or fix your car?
Like everyone else.
9.)Do you support Civil Unions? Marriage?
Yes
10.)Do you also support them for people who are Homosexual?
Yes
11.)What verses do you feel stand against Homosexuality?
Too many
12.)What verses do you feel support Homosexuality?
2 Samuel 1:26
JK, it probabley doesn't refer to physical attraction, but it is interesting.


Thanks

[help3434]

1.)What denomination are you?
LDS
2.)How old are you?
26
3.)Are you an active member of your denomination?(I know people who are 4.)5.)4.)Catholic who never attend mass)?
No
5.)Are you close to anyone who is Homosexual(family, coworkers, friends, etc)?
I have known people are but not really been close
6.)Do you think Homosexuality is a choice or is it genetic? Both?
For most it is not a choice. Not entirely genetic, but must be influenced by genes.
7.)Does your denomination feel the same toward Homosexuality as you do?
No, but they are getting better
8.)How do you treat Homosexuals that wait on you at restaurants, or fix your car?
Like everyone else.
9.)Do you support Civil Unions? Marriage?
Yes
10.)Do you also support them for people who are Homosexual?
Yes
11.)What verses do you feel stand against Homosexuality?
Too many
12.)What verses do you feel support Homosexuality?
2 Samuel 1:26
JK, it probabley doesn't refer to physical attraction, but it is interesting.


Thanks

[Truely Free]

[Replying to post 1 by Fides et Veritas]

Great question. This is a hot-button topic, much more then it should be, but I'm really interested to answer

1. Denomination; Christian. I mean, there are a lot of labels, and I fall under a lot of them, but denominations are even starting to dissolve. I grew up in a old fashioned dutch Baptist church and under my parents own teaching. I attended a AOG for some time, a Sovereign Grace where I met my hubby, and now we are attending a interdenominational church. Lets just stick with Bible Believing Calvinist Protestant. And I could go on forever.

2. 23.

3. Between churches, but active in many different churches and ministries as much as I can be.

4. Yes, in laws. Spend quite a bit of time with them. Close personally, I can't say I have the privilege, but like I said, I've spent some time with them. One of the girls is my husbands cousin and he is very close with her.

5. I think there is choice involved. I don't believe it is genetic but I do believe you are born with it. I would include it as a sin and we are born with the sin nature. I'd say outside of Christ there is no choice.

6 Yes and no. I can't speak for every person. Homosexual marriage is different than homosexual people. (Sad to generalize so many by that label, but for the sake of argument, I will use it) Most people I know have no problem with Homosexual people, just the marriage part.

7. I'm pretty thick, and can't even tell when someone is flirting with me much less if someone is homosexual or not. Most people don't walk up in a restaurant and say "Hi, I'm Annie, I'm a lesbian and I'll be your server today"
If I did know, I would try to follow my normal rule with all people (Phillipians 2:3, Matthew 7:12), as I believe the Bible teaches. I fail a lot, but I try

8. absolutely

9. That is a very hard one. I would say, I don't oppose them. There is a lot that does into this issue. Sexual sin is sexual sin, and if I were to take a strong stance against homosexual marriage outside the church, I'd have to push for legislation against cohabitation, hook-ups, adultery, viewing porn and multiple other things that I don't feel I have the right as a person to force on others. Inside the church it is different. A saved person should act as a saved person. If you aren't a Christian, why would I try to make you obey the Bible?
There are issues with raising kids: the healthiest way to raise a child is with a mother and a father. But once again, to inhibit that would mean a whole new range of laws that I don't feel are right. Like against Divorce, single parents exc. Not cool.
Just because something is damaging doesn't mean it is the realm of the government to address it.
My final fear is that some arguments used for homosexual marriage are also used for support to sexual perversion. After all, if you can be born with a unnatural (by this I mean boy part were meant for girl parts) desire for one of the same gender, what would stop someone from saying that they were genetically predisposed to be sexually attracted to children, animals or to mutilating women. If we are to say the predisposition doesn't make it right for those people, we must say the same for the gay and lesbian.
In fact this argument is already being used. H.H. Holmes in his diary (or self-biography as it was) explained that it wasn't his fault that he was born with a desire to kill. The show Dexter also pushes this. There are groups that are pushing for the age or statutory rape to be pushed down, who are arguing for polygamy, who use this argument for all sorts of sexual perversion. Once you erase the line, you must have a place to put it again. We cannot allow people to hurt other people because they were born that way: that is the reason for the law. Now, granted, religion has been used to support these as well.
Either way, if in a future I am considered a biased, bigot for not allowing a old man to marry my five year old, I will go to prison for that, gladly. No pervert is touching my daughter (or son), I don't care if I am supposed to consider him a "partner in raising the child" as one article argues.
That is a different matter though, and we are a long way away from that.
Basically, the jury is out. Marriage for homosexuals alone, I have no problems with, the repercussions on society; I don't think anyone can predict. So, while I won't by any means go out marching against gay marriage, I won't be voting for it any time soon. It's a very complicated debate, not as cut and dry as say, abortion.

11. Leviticus 18:22, but they is old covenant. (Before Christ) Romans 1:24-27. and finally 1 Corinthians 10:23.

12. None that I have seen.

In the end, homosexuality is a sin like any other, and I would argue, it's not even the most damaging sin. As such, a Christian shouldn't continue living in this life style, but there are lots of desires that we as Christians willingly give up because we consider God a greater treasure. In the Christian mind, marriage isn't a declaration of love alone, in fact it is hard (but very worth it.), it is a picture of Christ and His church, and a venue to grow into holiness. That is a Christian marriage though, and I don't think the same standards should be put on a secular marriage (a marriage in which both people aren't Christians) As a Christian, I actually am a lot more frustrated with America's Porn Problem, and how it feeds into the human trafficking epidemic. I'd rather get up in arms about that.
Some sins are up to the government to address: murder, rape, theft, exc. Some, such as homosexual marriage, aren't really important. We can only do the best with what we have though.
There is a lot more to say on the subject. Like I said, it's complicated. There is a lot that goes into this. Those are my current thoughts though. I expect to continue learning and growing for a long time.
Final words: Good people can be wrong. Just because a homosexual is doing something wrong, doesn't mean they are not good, just because someone is good, doesn't mean that they never do anything wrong. And that goes for almost everything.
We are, after all, only human.

[puddleglum]

1.)What denomination are you?

At the present time I am not a member of any church. Even if I were this question would be irrelevant because I base my beliefs on the Bible, not on the teachings of any church or denomination.

2.)How old are you?

72

5.)Are you close to anyone who is Homosexual(family, coworkers, friends, etc)?

I don't know because I don't ask other people what their sexual orientation is.

6.)Do you think Homosexuality is a choice or is it genetic? Both?

When you speak of homosexuality are you referring to homosexual orientation or homosexual practice? They are two entirely different things.

Being sexually attracted to members of the same sex isn't a choice and therefore isn't a sin. It is likely that it is genetic in most cases. Here is a more detailed explanation of what I believe on this subject.

http://clydeherrin.wordpress.com/2013/0 ... -that-way/

Homosexual action is a choice. A person can't help whether or not he feels sexual attraction but he can choose whether or not he acts on his feelings. A good way to learn more about this subject would be to read Washed and Waiting by Wesley Hill. Hill is a homosexual but he is also a Christian who believes what the Bible teaches about homosexual activity being a sin. He came to the conclusion that the only way he could be obedient to God is to abstain from sexual activity. You can read a description of his book here:

http://clydeherrin.wordpress.com/2011/1 ... d-waiting/

8.)How do you treat Homosexuals that wait on you at restaurants, or fix your car?

See my answer to question #5.

9.)Do you support Civil Unions? Marriage?
10.)Do you also support them for people who are Homosexual?

God established marriage as a permanent union between a man and a woman. Any kind of sexual activity outside of such a relationship is wrong.

On another forum I read a post by a woman who is gay but who is married to a man. She said that her marriage is successful in spite of her lack sexual attraction to her husband and that she and her husband have children. It is a mistake to refer to same sex marriage as gay marriage because technically this is a gay marriage even though the partners aren't of the same sex.

11.)What verses do you feel stand against Homosexuality?
12.)What verses do you feel support Homosexuality?

Rather than simply quote verses out of context I will provide this link to something I have written about this subject. In it I quote most of the verses I have found that are relevant to this subject.

http://clydeherrin.wordpress.com/2011/1 ... -of-light/

Here is a good source of information on this subject.

http://truefreedomtrust.co.uk/