Should people "shack-up" before marriage?

[Nickman]

I personally think that when two adults shack-up prior to marriage, they have a better chance of staying married and avoid divorce. This I have concluded from my own logic and experience. If we get to know a person prior to marriage on that level we are able to make a better decision about whether or not we can be married to that person. If we don't shack-up we won't be able to see how that person truly is in that setting. Christians tend to be against shacking-up which I feel has led to the statistics showing that they are more susceptible to divorce than atheists who do tend to shack-up.

What do you say? Should we shack up? Is it beneficial? If not why not?

P.S. Just because "god said so" is not a good answer. Please provide why it is harmful or wrong and the potential problem it could cause.

[Goat]

But then they often don't want gay folks a-doing it. This is, I contend, a bit hypocritical, to downright bigotted.

I'm guessing there's more to it also...

Teachings about homosexuality are a very small part of the Old and New Testament. You know, it's barely mentioned in comparison with the other subjects covered in those texts.

So we might ask, why is the gay marriage issue such a big focus for entities like the Catholic Church these days?

I think many clerics, particularly Catholics, (my heritage) have seized upon this hot button issue and fueled the controversy as a way to fire up and motivate their core supporters. This is a classic base building technique that's widely used by political pros as well.

You know, if we were to analyze the Bible objectively, and see how little attention is given to this subject, one would expect clerics to barely mention it if at all.

So one goes looking for an explanation of why for instance the Catholic Church spent a couple million dollars in Minnesota trying to put a ban on gay marriage in the state constitution.

Did they run out of hungry people to feed? Probably not...

Perhaps, to a large extent, it is a distraction from the problems of the priesthood. There are all those child abuse cases that had to be handled/

[OnceConvinced]

The idea that the penultimate expression of love should be withheld until after a meaningless ceremony has taken place is beyond absurd, it is in fact obscene. Especially when we consider where the prohibition came from, MEN who considered women as property.

Now what a great point and you are absolutely right. In biblical times, no man wanted a woman that had been with someone else. Clearly abstinance from sex was never God's rules, it was the rules of selfish men who wanted their women clean. It's why the bible illustrates its ok to rape a single woman, but woe betide anyone who would touch a woman who belongs to another man!

[OnceConvinced]

If you are a Christian, it would seem that god still sees you as married to your first husband and any future sexual act would be committing adultery.

Speaking of this, my father, a committed Christian believes that just the act of sex alone is actually marrying someone and uses the bible to back up this belief (Adam and Eve would have been an example of a couple who would never have had an actual marriage ceremony).

I found it quite believable as a Christian. So basically when you have sex for the first time, you're considered married in God's eyes. So if you then have sex with someone else you immediately make yourself guilty of adultry.

[Nickman]

[Replying to post 109 by Darias]

There are so many unfavorable laws for men when it comes to divorce. Some states have permenant alimony!!! It is wise to test the waters before jumping in. Especially from a mans POV. It is also beneficial for a woman to have the same mentality because some men are abusive. It would wise to know what youre getting into.

[dianaiad]

[Replying to post 109 by Darias]

There are so many unfavorable laws for men when it comes to divorce. Some states have permenant alimony!!! It is wise to test the waters before jumping in. Especially from a mans POV. It is also beneficial for a woman to have the same mentality because some men are abusive. It would wise to know what youre getting into.

There are...and I got an ear full of the sad story of the man's side of divorce when a man I know (and used to like and respect) told me about his own experience with it.

Seems that his ex wife's divorce lawyers really had a field day with him. He has to pay alimony AND child support, to the tune of six grand a month. His wife gets three thousand of that, and his three kids get a thousand each until the youngest is 18. Then both alimony and child support will cease. This man was very unhappy because along with the child support, his wife was fighting him for custody.

.............and winning.

Now this man is a doctor, but still, six grand a month plus legal fees was a real sacrifice for him. In fact, it was; very much so.

What he didn't know, though, was that I had finally met his ex-wife. She was taking a class with me at the time. She said the same things he did, as to fact; she was fighting for custody and winning, had been awarded $6,000 a month until her two year old was 18, and so forth.

What HE had failed to mention was that she hadn't started the custody battle; he did. He wanted full custody so that he could stick her with child support. The judge decided that living with her was better for the kids--and the judge changed the original divorce agreement, which provided for weekends, half the holidays and summers. (and half the child support) The wife was fine with that, actually. Like I said, she didn't file the custody suit, he did. The judge wasn't pleased, and so doubled the child support and took half the weekends, all the holidays and most of the summers away from him, because he was being a jerk.

Here's the thing: they had met in college. Both were pre-med, but he was a little further along than she. He had been accepted to a medical school, and she was a senior in college. So...they agreed that she would get a job and support him through med school, and then he would support HER through as soon as he was done so that they wouldn't have horrendous student loans to pay. Worked out fine....for him. He became a doctor and kept putting his wife off so that they could 'get a nice house,' and 'get better situated financially for the kids..."

Then he met a beautiful young doctor, divorced his wife and married his new love...who had NOT needed him to put her through medical school. Then he hired lots of good divorce lawyers to go after his ex.

Who, unfortunately for him, had better ones in her family. Even so, all SHE wanted out of the divorce was what was originally agreed to: he was to finish paying for her education.

He refused, fought, lost....fought again, lost again, and every time he went after HER, the judge slapped him around a bit more.

And all he could see was that the 'laws are unfairly biased against men."


(snort)

My own personal opinion? This happens WAY too often, and far more often than the beleaguered husbands want to admit to. Are there women who are predators? Absolutely. No question.

But from where I sit, whenever a guy comes crying about how his ex and the legal system has raked him over the coals, I always wonder about the other side of the story.....and it's USUALLY about the guy dumping the wife who lost HER youth supporting HIS career, making him attractive to the trophy wife up the road.

And I say.....go get 'em, sisters.

[Nickman]

[Replying to post 135 by dianaiad]

So are there no good men out there who get railroaded by their wife in a divorce? There are so many scenarios and until someone does the statistics we cannot say who gets railroaded more. Unfortunately the real issue is that it is possible for anyone to get railroaded in a divorce and people cannot be cordial.

I pay my ex-wife CS in the ballpark of $1497.63. She took full custody when I was stationed in Okinawa and could not afford a plane ticket to Vegas or a lawyer. She basically took the money I was paying her to help her with the kids and used it to take full custody with no rights to see my children. All because I couldn't get to the states. She also had it written in the decree that the children will be raised Mormon!

So there are variables

[dianaiad]

[Replying to post 135 by dianaiad]

So are there no good men out there who get railroaded by their wife in a divorce?

What part of "Are there women who are predators? Absolutely. No question." went WHOOSH, right over your head, or through your ears, or whatever it did that obviously escaped your notice?

[Nickman]

[Replying to post 135 by dianaiad]

So are there no good men out there who get railroaded by their wife in a divorce?

What part of "Are there women who are predators? Absolutely. No question." went WHOOSH, right over your head, or through your ears, or whatever it did that obviously escaped your notice?

There are bad apples on both sides. I think we agree.

[Davidjayjordan]

I personally think that when two adults shack-up prior to marriage, they have a better chance of staying married and avoid divorce. This I have concluded from my own logic and experience. If we get to know a person prior to marriage on that level we are able to make a better decision about whether or not we can be married to that person. If we don't shack-up we won't be able to see how that person truly is in that setting. Christians tend to be against shacking-up which I feel has led to the statistics showing that they are more susceptible to divorce than atheists who do tend to shack-up.

What do you say? Should we shack up? Is it beneficial? If not why not?

P.S. Just because "god said so" is not a good answer. Please provide why it is harmful or wrong and the potential problem it could cause.

Sure shack up, communicate, agree, be responsible, and above all take care of what you might produce in your shack. Thats surely what the Lord loves wants and expects. Long live love and responsibility and NEW~LIFE.

Isn;t the Lord good ?

[Clownboat]

I personally think that when two adults shack-up prior to marriage, they have a better chance of staying married and avoid divorce. This I have concluded from my own logic and experience. If we get to know a person prior to marriage on that level we are able to make a better decision about whether or not we can be married to that person. If we don't shack-up we won't be able to see how that person truly is in that setting. Christians tend to be against shacking-up which I feel has led to the statistics showing that they are more susceptible to divorce than atheists who do tend to shack-up.

What do you say? Should we shack up? Is it beneficial? If not why not?

P.S. Just because "god said so" is not a good answer. Please provide why it is harmful or wrong and the potential problem it could cause.

Sure shack up, communicate, agree, be responsible, and above all take care of what you might produce in your shack. Thats surely what the Lord loves wants and expects. Long live love and responsibility and NEW~LIFE.

Isn;t the Lord good ?

Your response is great IMO. However, I don't understand why you include all the 'Lord' stuff. Seems irrelevant, and comes across like having to say 'peace be upon him' after uttering the name Mohammed.

Sure shack up, communicate, agree, be responsible, and above all take care of what you might produce in your shack.

This is good IMO.

Thats surely what the Lord loves wants and expects. Long live love and responsibility and NEW~LIFE.

Isn;t the Lord good ?

This strikes me as a bit odd and makes me think you would make a great Muslim. I'm just not sure what it has to do with the point you made.