Forgive? No Way!

What would you do if?

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connermt
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Re: Forgive? No Way!

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Post by connermt »

unicorn wrote:God commands us to forgive. Who/what would you not forgive and why?
God can "command" me all he wants, I do what I want to do when I want to do it. This includes forgiveness. There are people I have no intention or desire of forgiving.
There are others I would forgive in a heartbeat.
Both actions are independent on any magical religious figurehead.

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unrestedfaith
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Post #32

Post by unrestedfaith »

Forgive. Hmm... I think I've understood what that means. After becoming a mother.. I understood a lot of what my mother had done (what I thought) was wrong. Maybe for me it's understanding. As a child.. I was beaten. By her boyfriend. While she was at work. I don't think I've forgiven him or understand his reasoning. But in a way, I am thankful of that experience. I have learned from it. It taught me a lot. It taught me how not to be afraid and stand up for myself. So I guess, in a way I have forgiven him.

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Choakem
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Post #33

Post by Choakem »

I don't take commands from an imaginary being....

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Mask of the Devil
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Post #34

Post by Mask of the Devil »

I don't forgive and I don't take revenge. Both idea are tied to concept of justice, wich I rejected as human-made and senseless.

I do what it takes to get what I need. Holding grudges makes people irrational.

Yahu
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Re: Forgive? No Way!

Post #35

Post by Yahu »

unicorn wrote: God commands us to forgive. Who/what would you not forgive and why?
This is a misconception. The parable given is to forgive when asked for forgiveness, not to just forgive any offense regardless of the actions of the guilty party.

I have to deal with this issue in rape counseling every time. I counseled a pastor's daughter who was date raped and lost her virginity that way. Her father of course just counseled her to forgive her rapist. She couldn't and felt guilty that she wanted vengeance against him. That impacted her relationship with Yah because she thought she could no longer be forgiven.

What I asked her was: "Does God forgive the unrepentant or do they get sent to hell?" Of course she answered they are sent to hell. I asked: "Are you Holier then God?" Of course the answer was NO. Then why do you think you have to do something that even God does not do? You forgive those who repent and ask for forgiveness, not the unrepentant!

Unforgiveness is when you are asked to forgive and you say NO. I tell the rape victims they have to be willing to forgive IF their rapist repents and seeks forgiveness. Now it is also evil to want personal vengeance. The rape victims have to repent of that but turn over the offense to God, ask Him to take His vengeance against their offender.

I have had every rape victim I counseled write their rapist and tell them that they turned over the offense to God to seek His vengeance. Nearly every rapist then sought forgiveness for their actions.

The first time I gave this counseling was to my fiance during our courtship. She had been gang raped 2 years before. The eight men involved were in prison. Two of them had begged her forgiveness at the trials but she refused. After the counseling, she wrote all 8, forgave the two that asked. She told the others she was praying God's wrath and vengeance fell on them to drive them to repentance so they could be forgiven. One was already saved. Five more of them got saved, repented, begged her forgiveness and got it. The two others mocked her and God's vengeance in the prison yard. They were beaten and raped to death by other inmates that claimed, 'Rapists don't mock God's vengeance'. The other six started a prison ministry convincing other inmates to seek forgiveness from their victims.

It turned an issued of bitterness and anger towards men into a very positive event with 6 men repenting and getting saved as a result of her. It turned her suffering into a thing of joy for her.

She never forgave the two unrepentant rapists but they paid for their offense against her with their lives and she was totally healed of the emotional problems that resulted from the gang rape.

Now when I gave that counseling to the pastor's daughter it also helped her greatly. Her father the pastor studied it out and came to agree with my teaching. As a result he split off his church from their parent denomination because that teaching was against the denominational position. He and his congregation left the 'Church of God' to become an independent church.

tugofwarstrum
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Re: Forgive? No Way!

Post #36

Post by tugofwarstrum »

[Replying to post 1 by unicorn]

The man I thought was my father who refused to control where his rocket went

Icey
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Re: Forgive? No Way!

Post #37

Post by Icey »

unicorn wrote:
Thu Oct 06, 2005 11:41 pm
God commands us to forgive. Who/what would you not forgive and why?
I always wondered why it takes someone to turn to something that may or may not exist to be able to change their ways and forgive, love, etc.
That's strange to me.
I can't think of anyone I wouldn't forgive (I have forgiven and forgotten) a lot in my days with and without God.

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