Islam and child brides

[Goat]

A large number of Islamic countries have the tradition of having child brides. The continued use of child brides is justified using the story in the Quran of Momahmmad marrying Aeyshea when she was 6.

In Yemen, an 8 year old child bride died of sexual trauma
http://www.albawaba.com/editorchoice/ye ... hts-519066

Every year, there are over 50 million girls under the age of 15 that are forced to marry.

In 2007, it was made illegal to marry under the age of 17 in Yemen, but the conservative lawmakers got that law overturned, because it was 'un-Islamic.'

THis child died as a result.

Why do so many (not all) of Islamic countries cling to the idea of marrying girls off much to young for their health. A girl under the age of 15 that gets pregnant and has a child has many health issues for herself, and the child quite often has health issues too.

Why do they think that is Mohammed did it, it's still justified in this age and time?

[Pazuzu bin Hanbi]

I suspect it has something to do with the claim that Muhammad stands as an eternal example for all mankind — so everything he did represents something all muslims should aspire to.

Sickening. I can’t stop thinking about how much agony the little girl must have been going through. Did her torment turn him on even more as he physically tore apart her insides? Sick…

[Pazuzu bin Hanbi]

I feel quite shocked that not a single muslim, or indeed anyone else, from this forum has chosen to speak about this matter…

[nayrbsnilloc]

[Replying to post 3 by Pazuzu bin Hanbi]

Unless a Muslim were to come forward to make his case for child brides, I would imagine nothing else really needs to be said. I would think it very hard to defend the rape (legal or not) of children.

[Pazuzu bin Hanbi]

Speaking (typing?) honestly, and that’s all I can do, I did expect people to come forward and condemn it at least. Some may even have said: “This is NOT true Islam!�

[nayrbsnilloc]

[Replying to post 5 by Pazuzu bin Hanbi]

Understandable. But also, this subforum or whatever of Non-Christian Religions and Philosophies seems to see a lot less traffic and activity, which likely contributes heavily to that.

[HaLi8993]

@ Goat

A large number of Islamic countries have the tradition of having child brides. The continued use of child brides is justified using the story in the Quran of Momahmmad marrying Aeyshea when she was 6.

In Yemen, an 8 year old child bride died of sexual trauma
http://www.albawaba.com/editorchoice/ye ... hts-519066

Every year, there are over 50 million girls under the age of 15 that are forced to marry.

In 2007, it was made illegal to marry under the age of 17 in Yemen, but the conservative lawmakers got that law overturned, because it was 'un-Islamic.'

THis child died as a result.

Why do so many (not all) of Islamic countries cling to the idea of marrying girls off much to young for their health. A girl under the age of 15 that gets pregnant and has a child has many health issues for herself, and the child quite often has health issues too.

Why do they think that is Mohammed did it, it's still justified in this age and time?

Firstly, can I just say that you are mistaken in saying that a large number of Islamic countries have child brides, this is incorrect. Secondly which country is Islamic?? meaning run under a totality Islamic Law?? Thirdly I do not know of any story in the Quran that talks about Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) marrying Aysha at the age of six, maybe you can give us the chapter or verse you are referring to Goat.

Furthermore in regards to forced marriage, Muslims follow the teachings of the Prophet (peace be upon him) in this regard. It is not permittrd for the guardian (wali) of the woman to force her to marry someone she does not want and does not like, because the Prophet (peace be upon him) said: 

“The virgin should not be given in marriage until her permission has been sought.� 

(Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 6968; Muslim, 1419.)

The fact that a girl is married does not imply that it is permissible to have intercourse with her, rather the husband should not have intercourse with her until she becomes able for that. Hence the reason why the Prophet (peace be upon him) delayed consummating the marriage to Aysha.

Furthermore I would really like to see these health issues your talking about Goat, in the contrary I can name many heath issues related to women that have children at such a later stage. A lower chance of fertility, miscarrige or a baby with down syndrome and other genetic abnormalities to name a few.

Therefore there are many reasons why Muhammad (peace be upon him) married Aysha, one being that she grew up to become one of the greatest female scholars of her time memorizong many Hadith due to her age. Hence we follow the best of examples provided it is done the right way according to Islamic law without causing any harm or  injury.

 

[Goat]

@ Goat

A large number of Islamic countries have the tradition of having child brides. The continued use of child brides is justified using the story in the Quran of Momahmmad marrying Aeyshea when she was 6.

In Yemen, an 8 year old child bride died of sexual trauma
http://www.albawaba.com/editorchoice/ye ... hts-519066

Every year, there are over 50 million girls under the age of 15 that are forced to marry.

In 2007, it was made illegal to marry under the age of 17 in Yemen, but the conservative lawmakers got that law overturned, because it was 'un-Islamic.'

THis child died as a result.

Why do so many (not all) of Islamic countries cling to the idea of marrying girls off much to young for their health. A girl under the age of 15 that gets pregnant and has a child has many health issues for herself, and the child quite often has health issues too.

Why do they think that is Mohammed did it, it's still justified in this age and time?

Firstly, can I just say that you are mistaken in saying that a large number of Islamic countries have child brides, this is incorrect. Secondly which country is Islamic?? meaning run under a totality Islamic Law?? Thirdly I do not know of any story in the Quran that talks about Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) marrying Aysha at the age of six, maybe you can give us the chapter or verse you are referring to Goat.

Furthermore in regards to forced marriage, Muslims follow the teachings of the Prophet (peace be upon him) in this regard. It is not permittrd for the guardian (wali) of the woman to force her to marry someone she does not want and does not like, because the Prophet (peace be upon him) said: 

“The virgin should not be given in marriage until her permission has been sought.� 

(Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 6968; Muslim, 1419.)

The fact that a girl is married does not imply that it is permissible to have intercourse with her, rather the husband should not have intercourse with her until she becomes able for that. Hence the reason why the Prophet (peace be upon him) delayed consummating the marriage to Aysha.

Furthermore I would really like to see these health issues your talking about Goat, in the contrary I can name many heath issues related to women that have children at such a later stage. A lower chance of fertility, miscarrige or a baby with down syndrome and other genetic abnormalities to name a few.

Therefore there are many reasons why Muhammad (peace be upon him) married Aysha, one being that she grew up to become one of the greatest female scholars of her time memorizong many Hadith due to her age. Hence we follow the best of examples provided it is done the right way according to Islamic law without causing any harm or  injury.

 

I have to say that I am strongly disappointed in your response. Do you not consider Yemen an Islamic country??? Did you not notice that every year, 50 million girls who were married off before they were 17, die before they are 15. Yemen declared the law where women can't be under 17 'un-Islamic', and had it reversed.

As for Mohammed, no, he didn't consummate the marriage to Aeysaha when she was 6, he waited till she was all of 9. Do you think a 6, or a 8, or a 9 year old girl has the ability to say consent??

You seem to be mixing up teenage pregnancies', and pregnancies of women over the age of 40. There is a big gap where there isn't an age related risk factor there.

Here is one link http://www.aafp.org/afp/2007/0501/p1310.html

Adolescent pregnancy also increases the chance of lifetime incontinence to the mother due to the pregnancy.

I was really hoping to get hope that this trend in the third world Islamic countries would be able to be fought. Instead, I get excuses, denials, deflections, and all in all a big disappointment for my viewpoint of how Islam is verses how it could be. I wanted to see some hope for the future of Islam, instead I get excuses and denial.

[keithprosser3]

I think you received an excellent response from Hali. There is surely more than one issue here. Firstly, Islamic teaching contains the tradition of Mohammed's marriage to Ayesha and it will contain it for ever. That cannot change. What can change is how that tradition is applied. People and societies are notoriously capable of being selective in how they interpret their religions. It is clear that the Hadith regarding the consent of the girl was not applied in this case. By picking and choosing what aspects of a religion to apply and which to ignore any religion can be used to serve any purpose.

What we are seeing in recent years is an upswing in a particular interpretation of Islam, one which has its own biases and selectivity. It is a parallel to the rise of fundamentalist Christianity in the West, but 'fundamentalist Islam' is far more powerful than fundamentalism - at least at the moment. It is not unreasonable to suppose that if the fundamentalists obtained comparable power in the west, things would not be much different in the US from how they are in Yemen.

But just as fundamentalism is not the only interpretation of Christianity, Islamism is not the only possible interpretation of Islam. That radical Islam is now well entrenched and seemingly gaining ground is worrying, but I think the reasons for the modern rise of Islamic fundamentalism have to be examined.

Islam cannot be eradicated. If there is a solution it lies in encouraging moderate interpretation of the its teachings. If that is not so, then there is no solution.

[keithprosser3]

I think you received an excellent response from Hali. There is surely more than one issue here. Firstly, Islamic teaching contains the tradition of Mohammed's marriage to Ayesha and it will contain it for ever. That cannot change. What can change is how that tradition is applied. People and societies are notoriously capable of being selective in how they interpret their religions. It is clear that the Hadith regarding the consent of the girl was not applied in this case. By picking and choosing what aspects of a religion to apply and which to ignore any religion can be used to serve any purpose.

What we are seeing in recent years is an upswing in a particular interpretation of Islam, one which has its own biases and selectivity. It is a parallel to the rise of fundamentalist Christianity in the West, but 'fundamentalist Islam' is far more powerful than fundamentalism - at least at the moment. It is not unreasonable to suppose that if the fundamentalists obtained comparable power in the west, things would not be much different in the US from how they are in Yemen.

But just as fundamentalism is not the only interpretation of Christianity, Islamism is not the only possible interpretation of Islam. That radical Islam is now well entrenched and seemingly gaining ground is worrying, but I think the reasons for the modern rise of Islamic fundamentalism have to be examined.

Islam cannot be eradicated. If there is a solution it lies in encouraging moderate interpretation of the its teachings. If that is not so, then there is no solution.