Gay Parenting, Family, and Christianity

[Haven]

Many conservative Christians on this forum (and elsewhere) have asserted that marriage for same-sex couples, and gay people in general, are somehow harmful to children and the institution of family, which they believe is based on the heterosexist Biblical model. This is despite the fact that at least nine million American kids have gay parents, and this causes them no problems. So, why do these individuals oppose gay parenting and nuclear families headed by couples who happen to be same-sex?

Debate questions: Is parenting by gay people bad? Is the traditional Christian model of the heterosexual family the only familial structure that is good for children? Is there any evidence that kids do better in families headed by heterosexual couples versus lesbian or gay ones? What evidence can you supply that the traditional Christian family structure is more beneficial? Should LGBT couples be allowed to adopt?

[ten10ths]

Many conservative Christians on this forum (and elsewhere) have asserted that marriage for same-sex couples, and gay people in general, are somehow harmful to children and the institution of family, which they believe is based on the heterosexist Biblical model. This is despite the fact that at least nine million American kids have gay parents, and this causes them no problems. So, why do these individuals oppose gay parenting and nuclear families headed by couples who happen to be same-sex?

Debate questions: Is parenting by gay people bad? Is the traditional Christian model of the heterosexual family the only familial structure that is good for children? Is there any evidence that kids do better in families headed by heterosexual couples versus lesbian or gay ones? What evidence can you supply that the traditional Christian family structure is more beneficial? Should LGBT couples be allowed to adopt?

Once you use the epithet and propaganda "heterosexist" there is no reason to continue a dialog.

Nature looks to be heterosexist. Evolution looks to be "heterosexist."

The fact of history is that there were and are large people groups that do not fit the Biblical model of man and woman/husband and wife raising their children. The pagan nations that the Israelites were to reject more tham likely had some decent examples of a good parented family. But the culture that they promoted was not acceptable overall.

"heterosexist? Only if life is important.

So even though there's good parenting going on, because it doesn't fit what an book says, it needs to be unacceptable?
That sounds like a cult. Or a dictatorship. Not something I would want in any god personally. There must be peope who like that kinda thing though. Silly to consider that really lol

How many serial killers were great parents?

How many embezzlers? Cheats, Liars, etc., etc..?? When I lived in Santa Cruz, CA, I personally knew of a Satanic couple (worshiped Satan) that had very well adjusted children in school.

Why don't you or Haven (the author of the OP) show us the compatibility between the gay agenda, gay culture and Christian life? I've never seen anyone be able to connect the two in all reality.

I've never said that homosexuals have to live like Christians, I have though taken the position that Christians should live like Christians. Now, if you can produce any scripture that details how Christians are to engage in homosexuality, or where there is a marriage detailed as being between same gender people, please, have at it. Otherwise, please at least note the "otherness" of gay culture in comparison to a life chosen when one becomes a Christian. The guidelines of which are detailed in the New Testament.

Slow your roll there cowboy - don't be jumpin down my throat in our first interaction. First impressions are important for you as an embassador of Christ, yeah?
Calm down.
To your points:
I don't know, how many serial killers are great parents? Can you tell us? It's your seemingly appropiate measure of a good parent so I would think you have the answer yeah?
Is that the only metric we are to use to see if people are great parents? What about people who tried to be a serial killer, but didn't manage it? Are the good or bad, or mediocre? That's a silly comparison really lol Why jump to an extreme - gay parenting being compared to serial killers! Now you're killing me lol!

I would suggest you do back and re-read what I wrote since you're accusing me of things I didn't say.
Only then will we be ready to communicate further. If you want to, that is, which I doubt but hey, if you believe in a Christian God then anything's possible, yeah? lol

[Haven]

Why don't you or Haven (the author of the OP) show us the compatibility between the gay agenda, gay culture and Christian life? I've never seen anyone be able to connect the two in all reality.

There is no "gay agenda." There is no "gay culture." You may as well ask me to show the compatibility between n9qnr82-n3peFUO and Christian life.

[99percentatheism]

Why don't you or Haven (the author of the OP) show us the compatibility between the gay agenda, gay culture and Christian life? I've never seen anyone be able to connect the two in all reality.

There is no "gay agenda." There is no "gay culture." You may as well ask me to show the compatibility between n9qnr82-n3peFUO and Christian life.

I am.

According to the gay agenda, same gender sexual behavior is quite OK. In gay culture that is. As is of course the redefining of marriage to same gender individuals. Although a wife is the female partner of a male husband in a Christian marriage, and a husband a male married partner in a Christian marriage, it isn't to the gay agenda and gay culture.

[Haven]

I am.

According to the gay agenda, same gender sexual behavior is quite OK. In gay culture that is. As is of course the redefining of marriage to same gender individuals. Although a wife is the female partner of a male husband in a Christian marriage, and a husband a male married partner in a Christian marriage, it isn't to the gay agenda and gay culture.

What gay agenda? What gay culture? What evidence do you have that these things exist Support your claim with verifiable evidence (not right-wing hate sites) or retract it.

[99percentatheism]

I am.

According to the gay agenda, same gender sexual behavior is quite OK. In gay culture that is. As is of course the redefining of marriage to same gender individuals. Although a wife is the female partner of a male husband in a Christian marriage, and a husband a male married partner in a Christian marriage, it isn't to the gay agenda and gay culture.

What gay agenda? What gay culture? What evidence do you have that these things exist Support your claim with verifiable evidence (not right-wing hate sites) or retract it.

I actually explained it in the words of mine that you quoted but ignored completely. Are you saying that the gay agenda of altering and redefining marriage to be same gender isn't actually a demand of the gay agenda? That there isn't a gay culture of two women that want to call their relationship a "marriage?" That there are two men that want to call their relationship a "marriage?" Are you saying that I am imagining things here? If so, and this isn't happening via a gay agenda and in gay culture, I will be most happy to see this and just move on to other movements that are attacking The Church. Maybe I should post things from the HRC? A website that looks strikingly like a left-wing hate site?

Here ya go: http://www.hrc.org/

I guess I have should have used left-wing hate sites?

HRC seeks to improve the lives of LGBT Americans by advocating for equal rights and benefits in the workplace, ensuring families are treated equally under the law and increasing public support among all Americans.


- hrc.org

And from the same home page:

HRC strongly condemns yesterday’s vote by the Republican majority on the House Committee on Veterans’ Affairs to defeat an amendment that would have extended equal benefits to active duty service members and veterans legally married to someone of the same sex.

Kinda sounds like recruiting to me. Or a kind of proselytizing huh?

But you do know (by now) that there is no such thing as same gender marriage anywhere in the New Testament right?

This discussion we are having is about "Christian" life and culture. Compared to the gay agenda and gay culture of promoting homosexuality in many guises.

If there is a www.debatingnonorantichristianity.com please let me know. I'll avoid it.

[UFO]

Many conservative Christians on this forum (and elsewhere) have asserted that marriage for same-sex couples, and gay people in general, are somehow harmful to children and the institution of family, which they believe is based on the heterosexist Biblical model. This is despite the fact that at least nine million American kids have gay parents, and this causes them no problems. So, why do these individuals oppose gay parenting and nuclear families headed by couples who happen to be same-sex?

Debate questions: Is parenting by gay people bad? Is the traditional Christian model of the heterosexual family the only familial structure that is good for children? Is there any evidence that kids do better in families headed by heterosexual couples versus lesbian or gay ones? What evidence can you supply that the traditional Christian family structure is more beneficial? Should LGBT couples be allowed to adopt?

Parenting by bad parents is bad.
Parenting by good parents is good.
That's the facts. There's nothing about one's sexuality listed in those facts. We must then conclude that sexuality has little to nothing to do with parenting.
I know a couple parents of gay kids and they're much more pleasant to be around than some others. Does that mean gay parents are better? No, just that they're not all totally bad.

[Clownboat]

Why don't you or Haven (the author of the OP) show us the compatibility between the gay agenda, gay culture and Christian life? I've never seen anyone be able to connect the two in all reality.

There is no "gay agenda." There is no "gay culture." You may as well ask me to show the compatibility between n9qnr82-n3peFUO and Christian life.

I am.

According to the gay agenda, same gender sexual behavior is quite OK. In gay culture that is. As is of course the redefining of marriage to same gender individuals. Although a wife is the female partner of a male husband in a Christian marriage, and a husband a male married partner in a Christian marriage, it isn't to the gay agenda and gay culture.

What about when a man is born with a vagina, has hidden testicles, was raised as a girl and didn't find out that she was a man until they checked his chromosomes many years after marrying his high school sweet heart?
- Should this man divorce his husband?
- Should this man stay in his gay marriage?
- Should this man stay married, but stop using his vagina with his partner?

You use the New Testament as your justification to judge homosexuality, so I ask you what your guide book would suggest that such a person should do?

It seems to me, that if you "were" right, they would then have to live their life feeling like they are an abomination that deserves to go to hell. This is over something they have no control over either, thus I reject your New Testament condemnation of my fellow gay humans due to it being abhorrent IMO. I'm open to changing my mind though, but as you can see, you will need to do better than suggesting an incomplete guide book to make the determination. So far, that is all you seem to have.

These are legitimate questions and me pointing out my disagreement with your stance, not hostility, or some agenda or whatever else poops into your head.

[Clownboat]

Are you saying that the gay agenda of altering and redefining marriage to be same gender isn't actually a demand of the gay agenda?

No 99%, it is the demand of people. This agenda you keep referring to is not an agenda at all. These are real people, both gay and straight that are fighting for equal rights.

Was the woman's equal rights movement just an agenda too? I propose it was real people fighting for what they believed was right. The male chauvinistic Bible be damned on top of it all ironically.

I repeat, these are people you are talking about, not some agenda. I'm not gay nor part of any agenda on the issue. I make my stance as a person.

Perhaps classifying these people that you disagree with as an agenda helps to distance you from feeling altruistic?

Can we claim that you are apart of an agenda to continue to speak at churches, radio stations and such against homosexuality in order to maintain some monetary gain or an allusion of being an authority?

People are fighting for equal rights for homosexuals because they feel it is the right thing to do. I see no evidence of any agenda. I see you calling people "agendas" though, and feel it should be pointed out due to the possible implications.