How did you find out that Christianity was just bull manure?

[trencacloscas]

This is a question topic applied only to atheists/agnostics in general and former Christians specially.

When and how did you reach the conclusion that Christianity doesn't bear anything sacred or true? I agree with that writer who said "abandoning God and religion was my most priced spiritual adventure". So, how was your personal path to deconversion? What made you suspect it was all fake? How did you cop out with it?

Just for the sake of exchanging vital experiences..

[OccamsRazor]

Sleepy, when I saw the previous post. i.e.:

Can I pray for you all?

I could not decide exactly how to respond.

My instant reaction was, "you may do whatever you please".

I would certainly not say "no", because why should I wish to stop you?
I would also not say "yes", because I do not believe that there is a reason to do so.

So in conclusion I stick with my first thought.

Sleepy, do whatever you wish to do.

[McCulloch]

Then by all means pray for us.

Then let us know if your God lets you down.

[Sleepy]

I'll be praying I always ask permission because it is not always wanted and that I respect despite my beliefs. If there is ever anything specific just message me.

Oh and Occam - loved the reply! Smart fella, do you mind if I take that as an ok rather than a rather you didn't? ?

I'm in spain for a couple of weeks so see you all soon.

[The Happy Humanist]

I'll be praying I always ask permission because it is not always wanted and that I respect despite my beliefs. If there is ever anything specific just message me.

Oh and Occam - loved the reply! Smart fella, do you mind if I take that as an ok rather than a rather you didn't? ?

I'm in spain for a couple of weeks so see you all soon.

Just wandered back in here for a glimpse of what's happening. Wow, somebody's off to a quick start. 65 posts in three days? Gotta be close to a record for a newbie. Welcome aboard!

Question for you, Sleepy: May we think for you?

[Cathar1950]

I remeber Playing Santa for my children. It was fun and I have fond memories then and when I was a child.
I don’t recall actually quitting belief but changing and growing. I have spent most of my life studying religion. I even went to a undergraduate bible college for two years and a seminary for a year. One day it dawned on me God forgives and the death of Jesus was a political execution. Why was Jesus forgiving and asking us to forgive before his death? I realized much of Christianity was a Pauline invention and his words or metaphors seem to have been taken literally. I studied the Jewish roots and it was interesting having Jewish ancestry helped the some times painful transitions. But it did give me a clearer perspective on Christian beginnings. I found the same reworking of ancient ideas. I think it is the certainty that others have that bothers me the most. I just don’t see it and find it is better explained with Psychology, sociology and anthropology. When some one of deep faith or a spiritual view just believes I find it hard to fault them. I tend to see the world with a sympathetic eye. I see God in my friends, family and the smiles and laughter of my children. I also see God in their sorrows. I tend to see God as a way of extending our reach but often there for comfort.
It is a private yet social way of being. I might have more in common with Bernie, Mack, O. Razor, HH, QED, micatala, Mel, Dan, Jose, otseng, Grumpy and others(I am sure I am forgetting many) then I do with the die-hard believers. Lotan and Scotum make me laugh and I do enjoy their contributions, they often find references I have a hard time recovering and they make good point I often take for granted. Goat is a welcome rational Jewish view that makes me feel at home. I seem to but heads with Harvey’s ideas but this might be due to my rejection of dualism and Platonic idealism. You would think with the influence that Whitehead and Hartshorne have had on me I would get over it. But what fun would that be?

[QED]

What a wonderful tone the last few posts have taken. A delight to read. Cathar1950, I'm always inspired by your take on things. It's pretty obvious to me that we've all lead very similar lives really -- despite our professed beliefs here. It's probably a self-selecting effect of having the time and resources to engage in online debating. Maybe the voices that are absent here would be those who could shed a different light on the world.

I can't believe that theists could think they have in any way a monopoly on all the "good" things like love and kindness. But it sometimes comes across that way, with atheists being cast as nihilistic pessimists who (without prayer) are unable to reach out to others. I also despair at those who argue that without God we have no measure of "good". The universe is full of potential and it has (at least here on Earth!) become self-aware. That property is enough in my view to provide a reference for "goodness" and having such a view makes the Christian message not only redundant but also infinitely more confusing.

[bernee51]

I'll be praying I always ask permission because it is not always wanted and that I respect despite my beliefs.

I scratch my head at christians who tell me that they will pray for me. Do they think it is not going to work if they don't tell me?

[The Happy Humanist]

OK, my two cents.

I can't pinpoint a time in my life when I had an epiphany about God, but I do remember a "meme" that had, and continues to have, a great influence on my thinking.

"If God didn't exist, man would have to invent him."

This one thought, laden with so much truth on so many levels, can almost be said to anchor my doubts. I continually test the polemics of theists against it. When somebody tells me God exists, or Jesus rose from the dead, or any of a number of superstitious "truisms," the thought flashes through my head, "This person would believe that whether or not it were true." And that to me is the difference between a theist and a freethinker: We non-theists may have our "beliefs" or "presuppositions" or "assumptions," but we seem less wedded to them than the average religionist. If evolution didn't exist, I can't see us having to "invent" it. And if it were proven wrong tomorrow, we would abandon it - albeit with a lot of head-scratching and grumbling, but in the end, we wouldn't have a choice.

Anyway, that's the thought that "greased the skids" for my slide into the Dark Side....

[QED]

"If God didn't exist, man would have to invent him."

Absolutely true. And what an enormous benefit can be gained from such an invention! The gains would be written all over the history books as well as in the minds of individuals struggling with the concept of their own mortality. People wouldn't have to look far for the form of this invention either. Man, the great creator, with his capacity for love and mercy (rarely seen in other living things -- unless you look carefully enough) might be all the inspiration that was needed. And what if, as the theist would have us believe, this is all back to front? Why it would require evolution by natural selection to be baseless! No wonder it's such a hot-topic around here!

[The Happy Humanist]

"If God didn't exist, man would have to invent him."

Absolutely true.

The beauty of it lies in its inarguability.

And what an enormous benefit can be gained from such an invention!

Yet another level on which it is inarguable.