Pre-marital sex and relationships

[agnosticatheist]

Christians, you contend we are not supposed to have sex before we are MARRIED.

What is wrong with a couple who has been together for a long time having sex before they get married?

If you buy a car, or a house, dont you want to check it out before you buy it?

What if you are moving towards getting married? Dont you want to know what the person you will spend the rest of your life with looks like naked? And there's practical issues too. I dont want to get too graphic here, but the tightness of the female v***** varies from individual to individual, and the thickness of the male p**** varies from individual to individual. Dont you want to make sure your organs are compatible and not mismatched? Dont you want to know what your partner smells and tastes like? Dont you want to know if the female is or isnt allergic to your semen? Dont you want to know if your partner is frigid and non expressive or vibrant and expressive? Dont you want to know if your partner is down for trying a lot or is not open to much more than missionary?

Oh but no, you and God tell us we are supposed to basically do a blind buy with respect to one of the most important aspects of a normal marriage.

Yeah, sorry, but im going with reason here.

[OnceConvinced]

I'm not knocking you if it is an opinion... as I am sure you have reasons for the opinion.. but the stats do not appear to back this opinion, since divorce rates are not lessening. Unless they are? If there is information showing that people who have sex with their partner before marrying that partner have more successful relationship, then that would be interesting. But I don't think such stats exist.

So how can you use your stats against me? You can't. They don't back up me and they don't back up you. They are insufficient to be able to make a judgement. We would both need to see stats that show a correlation between those who waited until marriage for sex vs those that had sex before marriage. We are both in the same boat here with our perspective claims. The stats are best ignored until we have more information.

However if we look at rationally, it makes way more sense to try before you buy. I can't see how it can be argued against. If you want to find out whether you are compatible with someone, the only way to do it is to experiment.

The same rule would apply to anything you want to buy or take part in. Test it out first. Does it work for you? Do you really want this?

You buy a car, you test it out first to see whether it meets your needs. You don't just buy it and hope for the best.

You play a sport first before you fork out the money to be part of a club. After all, what if it ends up you don't enjoy playing the sport?

Whenever you can, you try things out first before you invest in them.

Let's focus on a future partner

With your future partner you spend hours getting to know them first, you don't just marry them. You find out everything about them. What their personality traits are. What irks them. What are the deal breakers?

It would be foolish to leave sex out of all that. If only I'd learnt that before I married my so-called Christian wife who was completely sexually incompatible with me.

All the rule does is encourage people to rush into marriage. I sure am glad that with my last relationships I didn't get married first. It would have been disastrous. Ours would have just added to the statistics.

The stats also don't show us who rushed into marriage because they want to have guilt-free sex. So they don't really get to know each other properly first. And that is a major problem with a species that has a strong natural urge to wanting to have sex. It is a problem that is rife even within religion. Let's get married as soon as possible! Then we can get to the sex part! That's can't be healthy but that's what the whole "no sex" rule encourages. People rushing into marriage without really getting to know each other properly.

[Peds nurse]

[Replying to post 21 by OnceConvinced]

The stats also don't show us who rushed into marriage because they want to have guilt-free sex. So they don't really get to know each other properly first. And that is a major problem with a species that has a strong natural urge to wanting to have sex. It is a problem that is rife even within religion. Let's get married as soon as possible! Then we can get to the sex part! That's can't be healthy but that's what the whole "no sex" rule encourages. People rushing into marriage without really getting to know each other properly.

I know, I'm getting in the middle of your discussion...sorry.

All the Christians I know who are married by a pastor, have to go through some premarital counseling. There isn't any rushing. I would think that if two people really wanted to have sex so bad that they rushed to get married, that they would probably have sex before the date arrived. I don't think marriage is as esteemed as it once was. I could be wrong, but the divorce rate tells me otherwise.

[OnceConvinced]

[Replying to post 21 by OnceConvinced]

The stats also don't show us who rushed into marriage because they want to have guilt-free sex. So they don't really get to know each other properly first. And that is a major problem with a species that has a strong natural urge to wanting to have sex. It is a problem that is rife even within religion. Let's get married as soon as possible! Then we can get to the sex part! That's can't be healthy but that's what the whole "no sex" rule encourages. People rushing into marriage without really getting to know each other properly.

I know, I'm getting in the middle of your discussion...sorry.

You are welcome to jump in and add in your 10 cents worth.

All the Christians I know who are married by a pastor, have to go through some premarital counseling. There isn't any rushing. I would think that if two people really wanted to have sex so bad that they rushed to get married, that they would probably have sex before the date arrived. I don't think marriage is as esteemed as it once was. I could be wrong, but the divorce rate tells me otherwise.

That doesn't mean they're not rushing though. They can go into counselling and convince the counselor that God wants them married. It's not difficult, especially if the councilor respects you. My ex-wife and I were engaged after two months of dating. We set a date for 10 months later. We went through church counselling first and we had the counselor/assistant-pastor convinced God was in our relationship and wanted us married.

We truly believed God wanted us married. Everything seemed to be pointing to that being what God wanted. We were married only after a year of knowing each other and the church were right behind us.

I'm not saying we were rushing it so we could have guilt free sex. We just wanted to be together as a couple. But of course nobody going to counselling is going to admit they want to move the wedding forward just so they can start having guilt free sex.

I agree that marriage is no longer as esteemed as it once was and even once married it's easier to divorce than it was before, and the stigma is not there as it once was. There is also a push now for equality in marriage, rather than the man being the head of the home. Even in churches. So even the good Christians wifes aren't putting up with being the man's possession anymore and rightfully so. They want to be equals. They don't want to be ruled by their husband.

So those things taken into consideration, it's no wonder there are more divorces now. If woman would be submissive wives who obeyed their husbands commands and were afraid of being labeled a divorcee, there would be way more "successful" marriages. But who wants to go back to that old sexist regime? Who wants to go back to a time when people stayed married because they felt they had to even when they were completely miserable.

I would think that if two people really wanted to have sex so bad that they rushed to get married, that they would probably have sex before the date arrived.

But even if they don't wait, the guilt is still there. As Christians they still want to do the right thing and be able to be in a situation where there is no longer any guilt. So they move the wedding date forward. Makes perfect sense. Who wants to sneak around for years only having sex when the odd opportunity arises?

Embarrassment and pride can be a huge factor too. My holier-than-thou younger sister used to think she was so pure and chaste and better than everyone else. Yet she was the only one out of us that got pregnant before marriage. She tried to hide it by bringing the wedding date forward and then announcing her pregnancy a few months later. However, once the baby came it was not difficult to do the maths and then realise why they brought the date forward.

Now imagine there had been no issue with premarital sex. If it was quite ok for Christians to have sex and even get pregnant before marriage. There would have been no need to bring the date forward.

Fortunately my sister and her husband are still together even now after 20 years, however they are probably very lucky that they were suited to each other. But even being staunch Christians who knows whether they are happy in their marriage. After having 10 children (yes ten), who knows whether they just stay in the marriage for the sake of their kids?

[Hamsaka]

I am of the opinion that you should have sexual relations before marriage. You should find out as much as you can about all aspects of your relationship before you get married. Sex is an important part of marriage, especially in the early years, and you need to ensure you are compatible.

The problem is that you aren't learning the important stuff by that method. Ideally what you should do is temporarily paralyze your potential partner for a year and take care of them. If you can do that then perhaps that wold be a better test than simply enjoying the fruits of the relationship?

There are other ways to put a relationship to the 'test' thank goodness

What I sense Wootah is getting at is that we learn a lot about a person's character when they are under pressure. Adversity brings out a person's character like nothing else

It's the last thing I can think of WANTING to do, in the first blushes of love. Therefore, a sexual relationship is the next best thing to, say, paralyzing them or killing their cat to see how they react. Sex brings out both the best and worst in a person in equal measure.

Sex flattens certain interpersonal boundaries that would otherwise be up and obscuring things about each other. Two people who've been sexually bonded (because that's what happens, more on the female side though) can let their hair down. People are 'close' when they can pass gas freely in the presence of the beloved. Sounds like I'm being silly, but it's true.

So yes, sex is a valuable 'getting to know you' tool for the toolbox. It unmasks 'tools' in other semantic configurations as well

[Wootah]

[Replying to post 24 by Hamsaka]

What I meant was that I want my wife to be my wife even after some horrible accident happens to me. Her finding out how good in bed I am doesn't help me learn about her.

Sex before marriage doesn't teach you the important things you need to know.

[Bust Nak]

What I meant was that I want my wife to be my wife even after some horrible accident happens to me. Her finding out how good in bed I am doesn't help me learn about her.

Sex before marriage doesn't teach you the important things you need to know.

I get that sex before marriage doesn't teach you all the important things you need to know. But are you suggesting how good in bed you are for your partner isn't important to know?

Sure sex isn't everything in a marriage, but it's quite a different matter to suggest bad sex won't hurt a marriage.

[ttruscott]

However test driving surely has to be better than never test driving at all.

The important problem not discussed yet is that sex before marriage has little to do with test driving but mostly with going for a joy ride then getting back to drinking with your friends.

[Peds nurse]

[Replying to post 27 by ttruscott]

....or getting someone pregnant and not living up to the responsibility.

[Peds nurse]

[Replying to post 26 by Bust Nak]

I get that sex before marriage doesn't teach you all the important things you need to know. But are you suggesting how good in bed you are for your partner isn't important to know?

Sure sex isn't everything in a marriage, but it's quite a different matter to suggest bad sex won't hurt a marriage.
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Hello Bust Nak, hope you are well!

I was wondering at what age it might be okay to take someone for a test run? Right now, at this very moment, I am helping my teen daughter and her baby. Yes, they had several test runs, I am sure. The problem with taking test runs, is that not everyone is prepared to take on the responsibilities of what might happen. Sex is a beautiful gift in marriage. A couple of trial runs might be rocky at first, or great sex at first, might turn rocky later. There are no guarantees. What helps, what makes the sex great, is knowing that your partner, loves you regardless or not if your having an off week or an off month for that matter. When you love someone and you want to spend the rest of your life with them, you learn what pleases them....and that IS great sex!

[OnceConvinced]

[Replying to post 24 by Hamsaka]

What I meant was that I want my wife to be my wife even after some horrible accident happens to me. Her finding out how good in bed I am doesn't help me learn about her.

Sex before marriage doesn't teach you the important things you need to know.

I disagree. What if one partner has a high sex drive and the other doesn't? The one with the high sex drive then begins to believe that the other doesn't find them sexually desirable and then it blows out into a big issue. I have experienced this myself. My ex-wife and I. It ended up becoming one of the buggiest issues in our marriage and we were both committed Christians.