Sins and forgiveness

[E.G]

They told you: Jesus main purpose coming to earth was to forgive your sins…Really!?

I considered myself one among those who once fell into a trap set by false teachers, crooked preachers or pastors, also false doctrines that have caused confusions to many people, later disappointments . I was naive at that time and bought into the doctrine of fear, guilt and intimidation.

What saved me and put me on the track of success was KNOWLEDGE, and knowledge came to me through reading, studying and asking questions:

Knowledge of the TRUTH from the Bible:

Why did Jesus Christ come to earth?

John 10:10 “…I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full.� Most interestingly is that this verse starts with this statement, “The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy.� Those are the crooks I am speaking of. Do not get me wrong, there are honest preachers, but they are very few and you need to search diligently to find one.

Then in Matthew 11:28 Lord Christ said: "Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest.

[center]This is called the Spirit of the teaching and the core of the mission.[/center]
Would be there also a forgiveness of sin and a need for repentance? Of course, but that was not the main purpose of his coming to earth, how do I know that?, from the Biblical teaching in 1 John 4:8, “…because God is love.� and from Ephesians 5:2, “He loved us and offered himself as a sacrifice for us.�

So, why do many teachers, preachers, pastors or priests put the emphasis in their message on sin and how lucky you are that your sin can be forgiven and forgotten, etc.,?
In my opinion and in one word: Control; they want to control your mind and soul then manipulate you any way they desire.
[center]What is your opinion? and what are you going to do about this "sin"?[/center]

[Yahu]

They told you: Jesus main purpose coming to earth was to forgive your sins…Really!?

I considered myself one among those who once fell into a trap set by false teachers, crooked preachers or pastors, also false doctrines that have caused confusions to many people, later disappointments . I was naive at that time and bought into the doctrine of fear, guilt and intimidation.

What saved me and put me on the track of success was KNOWLEDGE, and knowledge came to me through reading, studying and asking questions:

Knowledge of the TRUTH from the Bible:

Why did Jesus Christ come to earth?

John 10:10 “…I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full.� Most interestingly is that this verse starts with this statement, “The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy.� Those are the crooks I am speaking of. Do not get me wrong, there are honest preachers, but they are very few and you need to search diligently to find one.

Then in Matthew 11:28 Lord Christ said: "Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest.

[center]This is called the Spirit of the teaching and the core of the mission.[/center]
Would be there also a forgiveness of sin and a need for repentance? Of course, but that was not the main purpose of his coming to earth, how do I know that?, from the Biblical teaching in 1 John 4:8, “…because God is love.� and from Ephesians 5:2, “He loved us and offered himself as a sacrifice for us.�

So, why do many teachers, preachers, pastors or priests put the emphasis in their message on sin and how lucky you are that your sin can be forgiven and forgotten, etc.,?
In my opinion and in one word: Control; they want to control your mind and soul then manipulate you any way they desire.
[center]What is your opinion? and what are you going to do about this "sin"?[/center]

Well when you get rid of the consequences of sin don't you have life and more abundant life? Isn't the wages of sin death and curses upon your life?

The reasons for Yeshua's coming was to pay the sin debt upon our life. More abundant life is a consequence of the sin debt being paid.

Now I do agree with you that many pastors and churches are all about control. That is a major problem within the churches. Too many people worry about the splinters in their brother's eye and not about the beam in their own.

[Saved75]

They told you: Jesus main purpose coming to earth was to forgive your sins…Really!?

I considered myself one among those who once fell into a trap set by false teachers, crooked preachers or pastors, also false doctrines that have caused confusions to many people, later disappointments . I was naive at that time and bought into the doctrine of fear, guilt and intimidation.

What saved me and put me on the track of success was KNOWLEDGE, and knowledge came to me through reading, studying and asking questions:

Knowledge of the TRUTH from the Bible:

Why did Jesus Christ come to earth?

John 10:10 “…I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full.� Most interestingly is that this verse starts with this statement, “The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy.� Those are the crooks I am speaking of. Do not get me wrong, there are honest preachers, but they are very few and you need to search diligently to find one.

Then in Matthew 11:28 Lord Christ said: "Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest.

[center]This is called the Spirit of the teaching and the core of the mission.[/center]
Would be there also a forgiveness of sin and a need for repentance? Of course, but that was not the main purpose of his coming to earth, how do I know that?, from the Biblical teaching in 1 John 4:8, “…because God is love.� and from Ephesians 5:2, “He loved us and offered himself as a sacrifice for us.�

So, why do many teachers, preachers, pastors or priests put the emphasis in their message on sin and how lucky you are that your sin can be forgiven and forgotten, etc.,?
In my opinion and in one word: Control; they want to control your mind and soul then manipulate you any way they desire.
[center]What is your opinion? and what are you going to do about this "sin"?[/center]

The reason why Jesus came, was to save sinners, Jn 3: 16--17. 1 Tim 1: 15.

[E.G]

[Replying to Yahu]

Adam and Eve let down God and chose to reject their loving creator, thus, they insulted and hurt God’s feeling by accepting his enemy’s offer and rejecting God clear loving instruction to them.

In-depth reading and understanding of the Bible would reveal this amazing truth, that the main purpose and the NO.1 reason why Lord Christ came to earth was to restore glory to God after Adam and Eve committed this unjustifiable sin in the Garden. Without restoring glory to God, there will be no forgiveness of sin, but, have you ever wonder why those preachers do not speak about this and focus on sin, guilt, etc., Back to control…

In John 12, 27-28 we read, “It was for this very reason I came to this hour. 28. Father, glorify your name, then a voice came from heaven, I have glorified it, and will glorify it again.�
And from John 17:1-4, “1 After Jesus said this, he looked toward heaven and prayed: “Father, the hour has come. Glorify your Son, that your Son may glorify you. 2. For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him. 3. Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent�.

I encourage you to read the article titled, “Was the main purpose of Jesus death saving you?� on page 5.

[dio9]

Sin is the result of ignorance leading to wrong thinking delusion and wrong practices greed, taking too much .

[Elijah John]

Jesus mission is best summed up by Luke 4.17-19:

17 And there was delivered unto him [a]the book of the prophet Isaiah. And he opened the book, and found the place where it was written,
18
[c]The Spirit of the Lord is upon me,
[d]Because he anointed me to preach [e]good tidings to the poor:
He hath sent me to proclaim release to the captives,
And recovering of sight to the blind,
To set at liberty them that are bruised,
19
To proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord.

And also, in his trial before Pilate when he say that the reason he was born was to "bear witness to the truth".

In light of that passage from Luke at the start of his ministry, his mission statement seems to have been: to preach and proclaim the Father's mercy, and his favor for the oppressed and downtrodden.

This in stark contrast to that Pauline interpretation(Evangelical) that he was born to die to "pay for" the sins of humanity.

[ttruscott]

Sin is the result of ignorance leading to wrong thinking delusion and wrong practices greed, taking too much .

...or sin is the rebellion of rejecting YHWH as your GOD or rejecting HIS plans for our lives which starts a character change in which rebellion is thought to be independence and is sought more and more until it permeates every thought and decision. It is accepted because it is felt as independance, not rebellion.

One can independently accept another's direction, right? But then there is no proof of independence which only being contrary can provide.

This is how sin which is rebellion can become a real 'thing' as a character trait or nature of the sinner which grows until it embodies their personality fully as see in Satan.

[ttruscott]

In light of that passage from Luke at the start of his ministry, his mission statement seems to have been: to preach and proclaim the Father's mercy, and his favor for the oppressed and downtrodden.

This in stark contrast to that Pauline interpretation(Evangelical) that he was born to die to "pay for" the sins of humanity.

But does not the Father's mercy need some method to achieve the redemption? Does "paying for" one's sin actually re-create him as righteous and no more a sinner?

[bjs]

[Replying to post 1 by E.G]

In Mark 10:45 Jesus told us why he came to earth. He described his own mission by saying, “For even the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.�

Jesus described his mission by saying that he would die to ransom many people. By his death, resurrection, and ascension he secured a pardon for sins, brought glory to God, provided abundant life, sent the Holy Spirit to live within us, and made the way for eternal life with God. These ideas cannot be separated from one another. They are all interconnected. Forgiveness of sins is the first step in the full glory that God has revealed in Jesus Christ.



Drop the “control� stuff. It is a silly conspiracy theory. The overwhelming majority of pastors and priests are individuals who have studied the scriptures and are preaching the truth as they understand it from the Bible. The ad hominem attack against millions of men and women whom you have never met and know nothing about does not strengthen your case.

[E.G]

[Replying to bjs]

Very impressive responses to this discussion from knowledgeable people and I can see the desire to unveil the truth through this dialog. My motive in writing is to encourage you to let the truth set them free and in turn, do the same to others in their own sphere of influence.

So, let us continue the discussion, as I mentioned in a previous post Titled, “Was the main purpose of Jesus death saving you?� (shown in page 5): Lord Christ mission had three dimensions:
“In John 13 we see the threefold accomplishment of the Lord Christ countering the threefold blow that took place in the Garden of Eden:
- Preparing to march toward the battle of the cross where Jesus defeated Satan and won the war.
- As a result, all prophecies about his first mission on earth were fulfilled and reconciliation was God was completed and sealed with his blood.
- The washing of the disciples feet (in the same chapter) was one of his final acts on earth, leading by example, which was the third part of his multipurpose mission, “leaving us an example, that you should follow his steps� (1 Peter 2:21).

The response by “bjs� eloquently emphases this fact with one point poses a major difference, which I will discuss:
bjs mentioned:

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“By his death, resurrection, and ascension he secured a pardon for sins, brought glory to God, provided abundant life, sent the Holy Spirit to live within us, and made the way for eternal life with God. These ideas cannot be separated from one another.�

First, I would like you to contemplate on this though: God gave Adam and Eve a paradise, if you and I today won a house in a lottery we will be so happy and make sure we keep it, so, how could Adam and Eve manage to lose a paradise? The deception by Satan must been very powerful.

Now you would agree with me that salvation is a gift from God, when someone gave you a gift, naturally you first show a gratitude and thankfulness to this person before you start bragging about what this gift is going to do for you, but in bjs’ statement, you can see that securing a pardon for sins came before bring glory to God?. This is exactly what I meant by the power of Satan to deceive, and the crooked preachers who are working for him to feed this poisonous teaching.

This is by no means a small point, before talking about the forgiveness of our sin we must understand and recognize that Lord Christ mission on earth was first and foremost to restore Glory to God, as a result the door has been opened again to humanity to have access to God through reconciliation by Christ. And God main purpose for all those who come back to him is: “to have life, and have it to the full, John 10:10�.
In a more accurate translation the words “and have it to the full� refer to the glory that is waiting for the saints after this life journey is completed.