Abiogenesis

Creationism, Evolution, and other science issues

Moderator: Moderators

Post Reply
liamconnor
Prodigy
Posts: 3170
Joined: Sun May 31, 2015 1:18 pm

Abiogenesis

Post #1

Post by liamconnor »

Again, I rarely wander over to the sciences and more rarely set up an argument. Not my forte.

But I recall reading that a famous atheist became a theist (not a Christian) because of the problem of abiogenesis.

Now, as I understand the term, it refers to the theory that life can come from non-life.

In simplistic terms, a rock can, over time, produce (on its own, nothing added to it; the development happens "within") cells.


Question:

Do I understand the term "abiogenesis"?


Based on my (or your corrected version's) definition, has it been reproduced by scientists?

DanieltheDragon
Savant
Posts: 6224
Joined: Mon Jun 17, 2013 1:37 pm
Location: Charlotte
Been thanked: 1 time

Post #371

Post by DanieltheDragon »

[Replying to post 367 by For_The_Kingdom]
False. When you are sad, it isn't your brain that is sad. Yet, you are sad. So, there is something true about you that isn't true about your brain, making YOU and your brain unidentical.

See when people experience the feeling of sadness their brains are flooded with Cortisol a hormone related to a stress response. Your conscious mind interprets this chemical reaction with your brain as sadness.

So your body reacts to a stimulus this reaction is experienced as sadness. So yes our brains get sad. It's just a rose by any other name.

Logic 101 free of charge.
Post 1: Wed Apr 01, 2015 10:48 am Otseng has been banned
Otseng has been banned for having multiple accounts and impersonating a moderator.

User avatar
Clownboat
Savant
Posts: 9342
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2008 3:42 pm
Has thanked: 883 times
Been thanked: 1242 times

Post #372

Post by Clownboat »

Kingdom wrote:Just give Christ more time. He will be here.
Since I don't have a Watchtower that dictates my life, how can I know this statement to be true? Can you show that you speak the truth?

Hopefully your point wasn't just to inform us of the beliefs your religion has foisted upon you. I assure you, that is well known already.
You can give a man a fish and he will be fed for a day, or you can teach a man to pray for fish and he will starve to death.

I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU

It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco

If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb

User avatar
rikuoamero
Under Probation
Posts: 6707
Joined: Tue Jul 28, 2015 2:06 pm
Been thanked: 4 times

Post #373

Post by rikuoamero »

Clownboat wrote:
Kingdom wrote:Just give Christ more time. He will be here.
Since I don't have a Watchtower that dictates my life, how can I know this statement to be true? Can you show that you speak the truth?

Hopefully your point wasn't just to inform us of the beliefs your religion has foisted upon you. I assure you, that is well known already.
If Christ appears and is as merciful, kind and compassionate as he's said to be, he'll understand why Clownboat and myself didn't believe.
Image

Your life is your own. Rise up and live it - Richard Rahl, Sword of Truth Book 6 "Faith of the Fallen"

I condemn all gods who dare demand my fealty, who won't look me in the face so's I know who it is I gotta fealty to. -- JoeyKnotHead

Some force seems to restrict me from buying into the apparent nonsense that others find so easy to buy into. Having no religious or supernatural beliefs of my own, I just call that force reason. -- Tired of the Nonsense

User avatar
Neatras
Guru
Posts: 1045
Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 11:44 pm
Location: Oklahoma, US
Been thanked: 1 time

Post #374

Post by Neatras »

Clownboat wrote:
Kingdom wrote:Just give Christ more time. He will be here.
Since I don't have a Watchtower that dictates my life, how can I know this statement to be true? Can you show that you speak the truth?

Hopefully your point wasn't just to inform us of the beliefs your religion has foisted upon you. I assure you, that is well known already.
I find it ironic that when we point out that science is an ongoing process, and experiments are being performed right now to find evidence for the origins of life, FTK is dismissive, one might even say hypocritically so, about such an enterprise. But he is adamant that he's right, so we just have to be patient and eventually we'll see how right he is. His time-dependent enterprise is entirely legitimate.

On the bright side, FTK, the experiments and theories will continue to develop whether or not we wait for some supernatural entity to drop in and say hello. And every day, we learn more and more; surprisingly, what we're learning doesn't jive with your baseless assertions.

For_The_Kingdom
Guru
Posts: 1915
Joined: Thu May 05, 2016 3:29 pm

Post #375

Post by For_The_Kingdom »

Bust Nak wrote: That is not a reason that demonstrate that it is a false equivalency, because it does not change the fact that I am comparing one example of capturing an visual image by collecting reflected light with another example of capturing an visual image by collecting reflected light.
But the area of contention is the cause, not the effect. We agree that visual images are manifested. We are debating over what is the cause of the manifestation. The means. The method.
Bust Nak wrote: DING DING DING, we have a winner. That's is a great analogy.
Smh.
Bust Nak wrote: And that's irrelevant when you are debating getting cold air in your face.
We agree that the cold air is blowing...no need in debating something that we both agree on. We are in disagreement on how/why the air is blowing and by what means is it blowing.
Bust Nak wrote: That is 100% correct.
Smh. You people have problems with me shaking my head. But sometimes, that is all one can do. *shrugs*.
Bust Nak wrote: No, I want you to help, donate to the biological department of your local university, that will help.
I am an organ donor and I strongly believe in organ donation. That is my contribution to science. What is your contribution to Christianity?
Bust Nak wrote: All the material but not all the knowledge required. There can be no excuse more legitimate than that.
But Mother Nature did it with no knowledge at all. So basically, Mother nature is getting more stuff done by accident than intelligent human beings are getting done on purpose. LOL.
Bust Nak wrote: Well that's what you wrote, so be explicit, what exactly was the scenario you had in mind re: batman logo egg?
Re-read the scenario.
Bust Nak wrote: I told you, your local natural history museum.
What is funny is the fact that you keep referring me to check my local natural history museum, when you know full well that it won't provide those kind of answers to these kind of questions. You know this, yet, you keep referring me to them LMAO.
Bust Nak wrote: Then why are you still here if you are satisfied?
?
Bust Nak wrote: In the loosest sense, sure.
I would say in about the same sense.
Bust Nak wrote: 2000 years not long enough?
2,000 years seems like only yesterday when compared to how long its been since we've seen life come from nonliving material.

In fact, compare 2,000 years to "Never", and 2,000 years seems as close as a few hours ago LOL.
Bust Nak wrote: But you said you would do it. Are you going back on your words?
I know..I said I would when I decide to waste valuable time. I haven't decided to waste valuable time yet.

For_The_Kingdom
Guru
Posts: 1915
Joined: Thu May 05, 2016 3:29 pm

Post #376

Post by For_The_Kingdom »

rikuoamero wrote:
If Christ appears and is as merciful, kind and compassionate as he's said to be, he'll understand why Clownboat and myself didn't believe.
Yet, the Bible says that man is without excuse for disbelief (Rom 1:20).

For_The_Kingdom
Guru
Posts: 1915
Joined: Thu May 05, 2016 3:29 pm

Post #377

Post by For_The_Kingdom »

Neatras wrote: I find it ironic that when we point out that science is an ongoing process, and experiments are being performed right now to find evidence for the origins of life, FTK is dismissive, one might even say hypocritically so, about such an enterprise. But he is adamant that he's right, so we just have to be patient and eventually we'll see how right he is. His time-dependent enterprise is entirely legitimate.
Hey, you guys (naturalists) are waiting for a faith/hope that you have...and we (Christians) are waiting for a faith/hope that we have.

We will see which one comes first.
On the bright side, FTK, the experiments and theories will continue to develop whether or not we wait for some supernatural entity to drop in and say hello. And every day, we learn more and more; surprisingly, what we're learning doesn't jive with your baseless assertions.
What we've learned over the past century through science is that; science has corroborated premises of theistic arguments. So, far from baseless.

For_The_Kingdom
Guru
Posts: 1915
Joined: Thu May 05, 2016 3:29 pm

Post #378

Post by For_The_Kingdom »

DanieltheDragon wrote: See when people experience the feeling of sadness their brains are flooded with Cortisol a hormone related to a stress response. Your conscious mind interprets this chemical reaction with your brain as sadness. So your body reacts to a stimulus this reaction is experienced as sadness. So yes our brains get sad. It's just a rose by any other name
You've just distinguished your conscious mind from your brain. Thank you for proving my point.

User avatar
Clownboat
Savant
Posts: 9342
Joined: Fri Aug 29, 2008 3:42 pm
Has thanked: 883 times
Been thanked: 1242 times

Post #379

Post by Clownboat »

For_The_Kingdom wrote:
rikuoamero wrote:
If Christ appears and is as merciful, kind and compassionate as he's said to be, he'll understand why Clownboat and myself didn't believe.
Yet, the Bible says that man is without excuse for disbelief (Rom 1:20).
This thread is not about reasons as to why the Bible is ignorant and false.
Thanks for pointing it out though.

The Christian god concept is one that is willing to commit genocide. And you want to point to a verse in its ignorant book to claim that I'm without excuse to believe in this genocidal god concept?

IMO, it is on you to excuse your belief in this god concept. Why should I, like you, celebrate an ineffective, punishing god concept that commits genocide?

The unbeliever is without excuse you quote? Hardly. What is your excuse for defending such a god concept? IMO, you need to justify your belief in such a concept.
You can give a man a fish and he will be fed for a day, or you can teach a man to pray for fish and he will starve to death.

I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU

It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco

If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb

For_The_Kingdom
Guru
Posts: 1915
Joined: Thu May 05, 2016 3:29 pm

Post #380

Post by For_The_Kingdom »

Clownboat wrote: This thread is not about reasons as to why the Bible is ignorant and false.
Thanks for pointing it out though.
LOL.
Clownboat wrote: The Christian god concept is one that is willing to commit genocide. And you want to point to a verse in its ignorant book to claim that I'm without excuse to believe in this genocidal god concept?
Sure, God just woke up on morning and said "I think I am gonna kill me a bunch of people today". That is exactly how it happened, eh?

Second, on atheism, I am not sure why genocide is so wrong anyway.
Clownboat wrote: IMO, it is on you to excuse your belief in this god concept. Why should I, like you, celebrate an ineffective, punishing god concept that commits genocide?
God has the right to give life, take life, and restore life. Second, how many flys have you killed in your life? On atheism, a human life doesn't have any more virtue than a fly, ant, or roach. In fact, on atheism, humans ARE animals...and in the animal kingdom, animals kill each other all the time. Its what we do.
Clownboat wrote: The unbeliever is without excuse you quote? Hardly. What is your excuse for defending such a god concept? IMO, you need to justify your belief in such a concept.
The arguments for the Resurrection of Jesus Christ is my justification.

Post Reply