Many Christians like to say, "Atheists believe there is no God." But atheism is not a belief there is no God because to have a belief is to hold a proposition. There are thousands of other things that Christians, like atheists, do not have a belief in, from Sasquatch to elves. If the mechanism is correct that the non-existence of God is a proposition held by atheists, then both Christians and atheists must also have matching propositions for the non-existence of all other imaginary things, which clearly we do not, since we can only name a few.
So for the record:
Christians believe in the existence of Yahweh and they do not believe in the existence of Zeus.
Atheists do not believe in the existence of Yahweh and they also do not believe in the existence of Zeus.
Perhaps the underlying motivation for some Christians to say atheists believe there is no God is a suspicion they have that believing in something is inferior to understanding something. And perhaps it is enabled by the same sloppy reasoning that results in some Christians saying evolution is “only a theory� as if that were a bad thing.
"Atheists believe there is no God"
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Re: "Atheists believe there is no God"
Post #301[Replying to post 298 by paarsurrey1]
There is no need to study the Quran once it is realized that it is based on belief in a supernatural god being similar to Christianity and other religions. And no such beings have ever been shown to exist in any form. This alone is sufficient reason to classify the Quran the same as the Christian bible and other similar holy books, and reject them as simple myth and allegory written by scientifically illiterate people living in different times.
Children generally adopt the religion of their parents and local society and mostly stick with it for the rest of their lives. It is hard to get many people to step back and look objectively at their religion, and draw conclusions based on a rational analysis of their history, the origin of the various stories involved, etc. They just blindly believe and never question, and willfully remain ignorant of other ideas and viewpoints.
So I'd argue that religion is borne more of ignorance than atheism. The refusal of a huge number of people to even look at the big picture and do their own analysis almost guarantees this.
Did one study Quran from cover to cover, please.
There is no need to study the Quran once it is realized that it is based on belief in a supernatural god being similar to Christianity and other religions. And no such beings have ever been shown to exist in any form. This alone is sufficient reason to classify the Quran the same as the Christian bible and other similar holy books, and reject them as simple myth and allegory written by scientifically illiterate people living in different times.
Children generally adopt the religion of their parents and local society and mostly stick with it for the rest of their lives. It is hard to get many people to step back and look objectively at their religion, and draw conclusions based on a rational analysis of their history, the origin of the various stories involved, etc. They just blindly believe and never question, and willfully remain ignorant of other ideas and viewpoints.
So I'd argue that religion is borne more of ignorance than atheism. The refusal of a huge number of people to even look at the big picture and do their own analysis almost guarantees this.
In human affairs the sources of success are ever to be found in the fountains of quick resolve and swift stroke; and it seems to be a law, inflexible and inexorable, that he who will not risk cannot win.
John Paul Jones, 1779
The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read.
Mark Twain
John Paul Jones, 1779
The man who does not read has no advantage over the man who cannot read.
Mark Twain
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Re: "Atheists believe there is no God"
Post #302[Replying to post 297 by marco]
Regards
One interpreted the process wrong. If one found one religion say Christianity wrong, then Gnosticism then another religion wrong; it was wrong to conclude that that makes Atheism right. Atheism is to be found right irrespective of the others. It is not the fault of the process, it is reading and leading the process and interpreting it wrong. One's reasoning process was not error-free. Right, please?marco
atheism is arrived at by a process of reasoning.
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Re: "Atheists believe there is no God"
Post #303[Replying to post 297 by marco]
Regards
One's study of Quran is not error-free, please. Since one says one has read Quran, please make everybody wise by giving the verses related to the above quotes from one. Right, please?marco
For example: you say God wrote a book in which he says that heaven has furniture in it, such as couches. Reason suggests this is silly. So I bring reason to the table to show your claim has no weight.
God, in his alleged book, says that corpses will be revived to have non-marital sex with girls. This seems an absurdity, given corpses don't indulge in sexual activity.
Regards
Re: "Atheists believe there is no God"
Post #304Atheism is the default mode. We are all born atheists and later in life a religion is indoctrinated into some of us. For that matter, you are an atheist when it comes to all gods but your Allah, we share exactly the same conclusions, for most all of religion, I just carry it one tiny god further.paarsurrey1 wrote: [Replying to post 297 by marco]
One interpreted the process wrong. If one found one religion say Christianity wrong, then Gnosticism then another religion wrong; it was wrong to conclude that that makes Atheism right. Atheism is to be found right irrespective of the others. It is not the fault of the process, it is reading and leading the process and interpreting it wrong. One's reasoning process was not error-free. Right, please?marco
atheism is arrived at by a process of reasoning.
Regards
Last edited by H.sapiens on Sun Nov 05, 2017 3:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: "Atheists believe there is no God"
Post #305We are all born atheists and later in life a religion is indoctrinated into some of us, some of the indoctrinated then manage to escape the clutches of these illogical belief systems.paarsurrey1 wrote: [Replying to post 297 by marco]
One interpreted the process wrong. If one found one religion say Christianity wrong, then Gnosticism then another religion wrong; it was wrong to conclude that that makes Atheism right. Atheism is to be found right irrespective of the others. It is not the fault of the process, it is reading and leading the process and interpreting it wrong. One's reasoning process was not error-free. Right, please?marco
atheism is arrived at by a process of reasoning.
Regards
The idea that highly specialized knowledge is required to see the absurdity of all supernatural belief is highly questionable, especially when it comes to belief systems that are so similar as, say, all Abrahamics.
Last edited by H.sapiens on Sun Nov 05, 2017 3:38 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: "Atheists believe there is no God"
Post #306Is it from:H.sapiens wrote:Atheism is the default mode. We are all born atheists and later in life a religion is indoctrinated into some of us.paarsurrey1 wrote: [Replying to post 297 by marco]
One interpreted the process wrong. If one found one religion say Christianity wrong, then Gnosticism then another religion wrong; it was wrong to conclude that that makes Atheism right. Atheism is to be found right irrespective of the others. It is not the fault of the process, it is reading and leading the process and interpreting it wrong. One's reasoning process was not error-free. Right, please?marco
atheism is arrived at by a process of reasoning.
Regards
~science or
~from a Revealed Religion or
~just one's conjecture, please?
Kindly make us all wise in the regards, please.
Regards
Re: "Atheists believe there is no God"
Post #307It is from direct observation, I guess one could call that science ... atheism is the state that in which we are all born.paarsurrey1 wrote:Is it from:H.sapiens wrote:Atheism is the default mode. We are all born atheists and later in life a religion is indoctrinated into some of us.paarsurrey1 wrote: [Replying to post 297 by marco]
One interpreted the process wrong. If one found one religion say Christianity wrong, then Gnosticism then another religion wrong; it was wrong to conclude that that makes Atheism right. Atheism is to be found right irrespective of the others. It is not the fault of the process, it is reading and leading the process and interpreting it wrong. One's reasoning process was not error-free. Right, please?marco
atheism is arrived at by a process of reasoning.
Regards
~science or
~from a Revealed Religion or
~just one's conjecture, please?
Kindly make us all wise in the regards, please.
Regards
Last edited by H.sapiens on Sun Nov 05, 2017 12:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: "Atheists believe there is no God"
Post #308paarsurrey1 wrote: [Replying to post 297 by marco]
One interpreted the process wrong. If one found one religion say Christianity wrong, then Gnosticism then another religion wrong; it was wrong to conclude that that makes Atheism right. Atheism is to be found right irrespective of the others. It is not the fault of the process, it is reading and leading the process and interpreting it wrong. One's reasoning process was not error-free. Right, please?marco
atheism is arrived at by a process of reasoning.
Regards
One did not misinterpret the process. I have NOT concluded there is NO God; I have consistently said I have no idea what is beyond my existence. I have, however, used reason to dismiss Allah and Yahweh. Allah has been badly constructed on Yahweh, so deserves less attention but unfortunately gets too much attention today.
Since you did not use reason to come to your conclusions about Allah, then my limited use of reason surely excels your zero use. Given my many excursions in mathematics, languages and philosophy I think, without being arrogant, that my reasoning processes are healthy.
I think it is incorrect to say: there is NO God. Thus I am no atheist. I do believe FIRMLY that there is no Allah. I am grateful for this. He sounds horrible, as does Yahweh his brother.
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Re: "Atheists believe there is no God"
Post #309[Replying to post 299 by DrNoGods]
But then there is no compulsion for one to see the things closely and intently. There is nothing like "supernatural" in Quran/Islam/Muhammad, please.
Regards
So, sorry, I believe that one even did not read the teachings of Jesus as one thinks that Islam/Quran/Muhammad and the Pauline-Christianity are one and the same. One's generalization is wrong.DrNoGods
it is realized that it is based on belief in a supernatural god being similar to Christianity
But then there is no compulsion for one to see the things closely and intently. There is nothing like "supernatural" in Quran/Islam/Muhammad, please.
Regards
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Re: "Atheists believe there is no God"
Post #310[Replying to post 305 by H.sapiens]
Regards
H.sapiens
Atheism is the default mode. We are all born atheists and later in life a religion is indoctrinated into some of us.
paarsurrey1
Is it from:
~science or
~from a Revealed Religion or
~just one's conjecture, please?
Kindly make us all wise in the regards, please.
Regards
guess and science!!!???H.sapiens
It is from direct observation, I guess one could call that science ... atheism is the state that in which we are all born.
Regards