I have presented previously three groups of atheist, through these ongoing intelligent discussions a fourth group was presented, which I suggest to be another form of “emotional reaction�
The first three groups were arguably presented in Post 1: Sun Sep 11, 2016, titled: Atheism, the art of defying logic, reason and commonsense.
I would like to state first that the purpose of my open dialog is in line with the objective of this site debate format through civil and engaging debate in pursuit of knowledge and truth. There is nothing I would like to gain personally, and I have no intention to “defeat� others’ opinions, but rather, through dialog, the truth may reveal itself.
The discussion here will focus mainly on group -4
The scientific argument:
- This concept is applied to any system closed to all transfers…an isolated system.Mass can neither be created nor destroyed… and so the universe's entire mass can be concentrated at one point. Without God
- The concept of mass conservation was discovered in chemical reactions by Antoine Lavoisier in the late 18th century, the closely related concept of matter conservation was found to hold good in chemistry to such high approximation, it failed only for the high energies treated by the later refinements of relativity theory. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservation_of_mass
The very fact that the theory failed for the high energies based on modern theory of relativity can be seen as an indicative of the presence of a higher power (energy, some prefer to name it “God�).
Claims made by religion? Who made those claims? are they trustworthy, and how can a claim made by a “religion� relate directly to the question of the existence, or nonexistence of God?I humbly suggest you are missing at least one group.
4- Those who decided to research the claims made by religion and found them to be unsupportable. This group has found no compelling reason to believe in any god based on all evidence so far.
what are those all evidence in your post? This is not fitting nicely within a “ Reasoning rebuttal�, rather emotional.This group has found no compelling reason to believe in any god based on all evidence so far
“there are an ever increasing number of folks who aren't constrained by the beliefs born in the Dark Ages, when Judeo-Christianity murdered science along with every man woman and child who disagreed with what didn't make sense in the Bible.�
This argument also could be classified as "emotional", since there is no evidence from Biblical verses requiring killing “science� or those who disagree. This act was taken by people who had their own motive, using religion as a cover. Therefore, this argument is rather week and frankly, irrelevant.
Once again, this argument proves the point that there are these groups of crooks, within Christianity, who had their own motive, using religion as a cover.I propose that if these "people of God" would just quit using their religious beliefs as a cudgel 'Cause "You'll believe, or you'll burn in Hell"
The Biblical teaching (taken directly from the Bible) is, “I came that they may have life, and may have it abundantly.� John 10:10
“Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest.� Matthew 11:28-30.
The question is, why some do allow themselves to listen and fall in a trap set by the crooks and those whom the Bible describes as, "Watch out for false prophets. They come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ferocious wolves.� Matthew 7:15.
Scientifically, you need to provide a credible statistic supporting the claim “the overwhelming number of Christians�, on the other hand, I would agree with the general premise of your statement.I would suggest that the overwhelming number of Christians "believe" in Christianity because they were indoctrinated into it, and they have simply bought into the teachings that if they dare to question this God or doubt him they will be cast into eternal damnation for their insubordination. I believe most Christians keep the faith out of fear of damnation, or the lust for the promised reward.
A classic example of “Group 4�:
I would like to ask if you had a chance to examine the fact that modern-day Christians often bring their own interpretation to their reading of the Bible, not considering how deeply their underrating of the Bible is affected by 21st.- century worldview.My family is very religious, I have not had negative personal encounters with religion. I keep my beliefs to myself. I will dabble anonymously on the internet not for fame or fortune, but simplly to have an intellectually stimulating conversation. I don't fit into any of the categories you listed. Perhaps it's time you start revising your position.
I am an atheist because after years of biblical study I started finding issues with the written word itself. To me it became a self contradiction. it was no longer logically compatible. Yet it was not here where I gave up on religion and spirituality. I had just posited to myself that the written word had been lost to time and just trust in God to show me the way. This led to varies religious and/or spiritual beliefs. In the end one by one they continually failed in terms of logical and reason. At this point it would be intellectually dishonest for me to be a believer.
The faith that we profess today was birthed in the land of Israel, and is inextricably linked with the culture, customs and societal mores of the Jewish people. Without having a good grip and understanding of the Bible background, we can’t come to a just and reasonable interpretation for our modern days, since the core Biblical message is universal and generational?
I need also to ask myself, am I clear on the notion that modern explosion of information and the surrounding noise could affect my thought process, and, sometimes, drifts my mind from the state of being unbiased thinker to leaning more toward emotion, based on past experiences?
May I suggest once more to all, that there is a difference that can't even be measured by the distance separating heaven from earth, between the loving true God of the Bible, who once took the form of a human, came and dwelt among us, taught for three years across the lands, left an example and a teaching that has changed the entire world. A teaching of moral and social system, upon which, nations have framed their constitutions and justice systems. Later, those nations became the envy of the rest of the world and the most desired destination for many people seeking a new home.
Yes, there is a magnificent difference between this proven fact, and the prevailing twisted message of the Bible by false prophets. It is unfortunate that many have fallen into the trap and ended up being hurt and rejecting the true God.