Paradise on Earth

[onewithhim]

When I learned that the Bible speaks of a restored Garden of Eden and the restoration of mankind to the perfection and endless life that Adam forfeited, I was thrilled. Who doesn't want to keep living on this beautiful earth, with our loved ones, and being able to do all the things we love to do---endlessly?

If God said to you today, "When do you want to die?" would you say "now!!"? I don't think very many people would say that.

We CAN live forever here on Earth. The Bible tells us that we can.

Matthew 5:5
Psalm 37:9-11,29

[onewithhim]

[Replying to post 520 by Elijah John]

Dang, I did it again! I am surprised that I did so when I recently got reprimanded for that exact thing.

[onewithhim]

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Moderator removed Cheerleader and SPAM post

For complimenting or agreeing use the "Like" function or the MGP button. For anything else use PM.

This post is so beautiful, I would like to show my appreciation for it . . .

[onewithhim]

What is the Paradise that Jesus promised to the thief who died beside him?

The thief requested of Jesus that he remember him when he got into his kingdom, suggesting that it was basically understood by people who had heard anything about the kingdom, that it would be something Jesus would go to somewhere in the future. Jesus said, "Truly I tell you today you will be with me in Paradise." We have to remember that the punctuation in this verse must depend on the translator's understanding of the sense of Jesus' words, since no punctuation was used in the original Greek text. (Punctuation in the modern style did not become common until about the ninth century A.D.)

Whereas many translations put the comma before the word "today," and thereby give the impression that the thief entered Paradise that same day, there is nothing in the rest of the Scriptures to support this. Jesus himself was dead and in the tomb until the third day and was then resurrected as "the firstfruits" of the resurrection (Acts 10:40; I Corinthians 15:20; Colossians 1:18). He then ascended to heaven 40 days later (John 20:17; Acts 1:1-3,9).

The evidence is, therefore, that Jesus' use of the word "today" was not to give the time of the thief's being in Paradise, but, rather, to call attention to the time in which the promise was being made and during which the thief had shown a measure of faith in Jesus.

Recognizing that the emphasis is correctly placed on the time of the promise's being made rather than on the time of its fulfillment, other translations rendered the text in a form similar to the NWT, such as those in English by Rotherham and Lamsa; German by Reinhaardt and W. Michaelis; in the Curetonian Syriac of the 5th century A.D.

Regarding the Paradise that Jesus spoke about, it is not synonymous with the heavenly Kingdom of Christ, where people would go to rule with him. Earlier that day the prospect of going to heaven to rule was held out to faithful disciples who had "stuck with him in his trials," something the thief had never done. The thief had obviously not been "born again." which Jesus showed was a prerequisite to be able to get into the Kingdom of heaven.

So it is undoubtedly a fact that the thief would be resurrected back to the earth in paradise conditions, when Jesus rules in his Kingdom. (John 5:28; Acts 24:15; Psalm 37:29)

[William]

[Replying to post 523 by onewithhim]

As has been shown already, the belief in living forever in heaven and the belief in living forever on a new earth/universe , are renditions of the same beliefs, just translated differently but not being different at all at the fundamental level.

Both the new earth and heaven are for all intent and purpose in different universes than this present one.

There seems little need for doctrinal arguments re interpretation as nether idea has been shown to be significantly different from the other as to make any argument necessary.

[OnceConvinced]

[Replying to post 516 by OnceConvinced]

I am sorry that you mar my post about the beauty of God's creation with such sad pictures and comments. Why did you seek to destroy something positive that I tried to share?

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It's not an attempt to destroy anything, just add some balance to it. This world is not all beautiful.

[onewithhim]

[Replying to post 516 by OnceConvinced]

I am sorry that you mar my post about the beauty of God's creation with such sad pictures and comments. Why did you seek to destroy something positive that I tried to share?

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It's not an attempt to destroy anything, just add some balance to it. This world is not all beautiful.

I see. But isn't it a good idea to try and steer away from the unpleasantness in the present world? I think that Satan would like nothing more than to keep everyone mired in negative thinking.

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[William]

[Replying to post 516 by OnceConvinced]

I am sorry that you mar my post about the beauty of God's creation with such sad pictures and comments. Why did you seek to destroy something positive that I tried to share?

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It's not an attempt to destroy anything, just add some balance to it. This world is not all beautiful.

I see. But isn't it a good idea to try and steer away from the unpleasantness in the present world? I think that Satan would like nothing more than to keep everyone mired in negative thinking.

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Keeping the balance is not being mired in negative thinking.

All that is being shown is that unpleasant critters exist. Unless you are suggesting that GOD and SATAN are co-creators of this universe, and this explains why there is apparent beauty and ugliness?

[marco]

Jesus said, "Truly I tell you today you will be with me in Paradise." We have to remember that the punctuation in this verse must depend on the translator's understanding of the sense of Jesus' words

We have visited this area already. It would be silly to imagine that the dying Christ had first to remind the thief that he was talking "today" as opposed to yesterday. If we take this absurd reading, then we can invent eternal earths. What Christ almost certainly intended was: "Today you shall be with me in paradise."

That is the sensible interpretation. You add, mysteriously:

"So it is undoubtedly a fact that the thief would be resurrected back to the earth in paradise conditions, when Jesus rules in his Kingdom. "

I have already expressed near certainty that Christ's words can be taken as meaning the thief would be enjoying paradise that day with Jesus. It is a message of hope and blessing rather than a theological pronouncement on the future of the cosmos. There is therefore no "undoubtedly" and no "fact". In addition, the thief, the recipient of the words, would take the ordinary meaning. The alternative complexity would never occur to him. That should be justification enough for discarding "I'm speaking to you today thief... in a few thousand years you will join me in paradise." It surprises me that anyone even considers this as reasonable, never mind fact.

[onewithhim]

Jesus said, "Truly I tell you today you will be with me in Paradise." We have to remember that the punctuation in this verse must depend on the translator's understanding of the sense of Jesus' words

We have visited this area already. It would be silly to imagine that the dying Christ had first to remind the thief that he was talking "today" as opposed to yesterday. If we take this absurd reading, then we can invent eternal earths. What Christ almost certainly intended was: "Today you shall be with me in paradise."

That is the sensible interpretation. You add, mysteriously:

"So it is undoubtedly a fact that the thief would be resurrected back to the earth in paradise conditions, when Jesus rules in his Kingdom. "

I have already expressed near certainty that Christ's words can be taken as meaning the thief would be enjoying paradise that day with Jesus.

I see....even though Jesus didn't go to heaven for another 40 days after he was resurrected, and the thief couldn't have been a part of the group of co-rulers that Jesus made a covenant with for a Kingdom because they had "stuck with him in his trials" and the thief obviously hadn't?

[marco]

I see....even though Jesus didn't go to heaven for another 40 days after he was resurrected, and the thief couldn't have been a part of the group of co-rulers that Jesus made a covenant with for a Kingdom because they had "stuck with him in his trials" and the thief obviously hadn't?

OR - OR - your view of things is maybe not correct, if we go by what Christ said. You do not possess an hour to hour diary of what Christ did, after his resurrection. He appeared and he vanished. Presumably he could move backwards and forwards to heaven if he chose to, and accompanying the thief there was all part of a day's work.

Perhaps it is time to revise your views on kingdoms and co-rulers. Do you honestly suppose these nearly obsolete terms have any literal value?