If the Bible is indeed

[Elijah John]

If the Bible is indeed proven to be fallible and imperfect, what can be salvaged from it and the Judeo-Christian tradition?

Does one of necessity need to toss out the "baby with the bathwater"?

If so, why, if not, why not?

[Zzyzx]

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If the Bible is indeed proven to be fallible and imprerfect, what can be salvaged from it and the Judeo-Christian tradition?

EJ, why struggle to salvage parts of the Bible (except for nostalgic or emotional purposes)? Is there ANY useful information in the Bible that is not available elsewhere without the baggage of ancient tales and supernaturalism?

The 'Diamonds in the dung heap' argument does not hold water when one can more effectively find diamonds where they are concentrated and free of dung.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 1 by Elijah John]

Who decides what is baby and what is bath Water? What if someone decides that God’s name is superfluous and tosses that? That Jesus isn't God's son, no miracles are possible, war is regretable but necessary for the advancevent of the species, in fact that God himself was put in it by an over zealous scribe high on mushrooms... Is there a problem with any of the above? To be consistent is it not best to say "That's cool it's all good, as long as you're happy." And then point them towards the excellent Christian rock band playing later.


Others can keep the cover and the title (in case there's a cold winter and a need for kindle arises)...and we Jehovah’s Witnesses will teach the content to those hundreds of thousands of people that contact us each year asking for help to understand it. Sounds like an excellent plan, it's effectively what is going on anyway, the only problem we have is keeping up with the demand.

I believe that is what one calls a closed market.

[Elijah John]

[Replying to post 1 by Elijah John]

Who decides what is baby and what is bath Water? What if someone decides that God’s name is superfluous and tosses that? That Jesus isn't God's son, no miracles are possible, war is regretable but necessary for the advancevent of the species, in fact that God himself was put in it by an over zealous scribe high on mushrooms... Is there a problem with any of the above? To be consistent is it not best to say "That's cool it's all good, as long as you're happy." And then point them towards the excellent Christian rock band playing later.


Others can keep the cover and the title (in case there's a cold winter and a need for kindle arises)...and we Jehovah’s Witnesses will teach the content to those hundreds of thousands of people that contact us each year asking for help to understand it. Sounds like an excellent plan, it's effectively what is going on anyway, the only problem we have is keeping up with the demand.

I believe that is what one calls a closed market.

OK, a bit of a detour here. It just occured to me. When did God declare all war "not OK"? He seems to have empowered quite a bit of it in the Bible, justified or not.

So how can JWs now declare that "all war is wrong"?

You still did not quite anwer the OP which calls for a hypothetical. What IF the Bible was proven to be fallible and imperfect?

What would you (and granted we may differ on some major and minor points) as a JW find salvagible in the "Old" and New Testaments?

I'm guessing the impalement vs crucifixiion thing is not essential to salvage. Also the "Michael the Archangel is pre-incarnate Jesus"...non essential or essential?

I know we both agree though, that God's Holy Name is essential. And that is the main thing I respect about the JWs.

[Elijah John]

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If the Bible is indeed proven to be fallible and imprerfect, what can be salvaged from it and the Judeo-Christian tradition?

EJ, why struggle to salvage parts of the Bible (except for nostalgic or emotional purposes)? Is there ANY useful information in the Bible that is not available elsewhere without the baggage of ancient tales and supernaturalism?

The 'Diamonds in the dung heap' argument does not hold water when one can more effectively find diamonds where they are concentrated and free of dung.

Z, where do you find the most refined, pure pile of Diamonds outside of the Judeo-Christian tradition?

Try to put on a Theistic thinking cap for the sake of argument. If you were a Theist and believed in God the Father, where would you turn to find abetter representation of Him?

And what you call "nostalgia" I call "heritage".. The JC heritage is part of our culture, or as the Fiddler on the Roof might say, "tradition,... tradition.., TRADITION!"

Also, you and I may disagree but despite it's flaws, the Bible contains TONS of Diamonds for mining and Spiritual inspiration!

[Zzyzx]

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Z, where do you find the most refined, pure pile of Diamonds outside of the Judeo-Christian tradition?

Try to put on a Theistic thinking cap for the sake of argument. If you were a Theist and believed in God the Father, where would you turn to find abetter representation of Him?

EJ, I did not realize that the OP assumed that “what can be salvaged from [the Bible]� referred to “a better representation of [God].�

That being the case, I have no suggestions because I make no assumptions regarding God – with or without the Bible – and a theist thinking cap is not among my possessions.

Also, you and I may disagree but despite it's flaws, the Bible contains TONS of Diamonds for mining and Spiritual inspiration!

Again, I did not realize that what was to be salvaged was 'spiritual inspiration'. As you are aware, I am a realist, not a spiritualist. The closest I might come to the latter is a walk in the forest or mountains – or kayaking / canoeing a (largely) unspoiled river or lake.

[Elijah John]

[Replying to post 6 by Zzyzx]

I thought perhaps you had a "for the sake of argument" Theistic thinking cap stashed away somewhere. .

Also, there is no Cathedral quite so magnificient as a deep forest or a mountain valley. So you and I are not all that far apart on that.

[JJ50]

I think the Bible, which is a human creation, makes some good points amongst all the garbage.

[Justin108]

If the Bible is indeed proven to be fallible and imperfect, what can be salvaged from it and the Judeo-Christian tradition?

If tradition is all that needs to be salvaged then it's pretty easy; just stick with whatever is tradition in the Bible. Something can be tradition without being based on reality

As for...

Does one of necessity need to toss out the "baby with the bathwater"?

If so, why, if not, why not?

If the Bible is rife with inaccuracies, I see no reason to consider it as anything more than just a book.

What, in your opinion, deserves to not be tossed out? We've had this discussion many times before and I know for a fact that you, for some reason, believe God had something to do with the Bible but you have yet to explain to me why you believe this

[Justin108]

Try to put on a Theistic thinking cap for the sake of argument. If you were a Theist and believed in God the Father, where would you turn to find abetter representation of Him?

I'm not sure how one could "put their Theistic thinking cap on" and still consider the Bible to be flawed. If I were a theist and found flaws in my holy book, I would unbecome a theist. I might consider Deism, but I would still completely abandon Christianity. Yet here you ask us to pretend to believe the Bible is flawed and still consider it to be the word of God

With my Theistic thinking cap on, I would look at the flawed Bible, abandon it as not the word of God and then migrate to pure Deism. The Bible would become just another book to me, even if I believed in God