Satan: The Big Misconception

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Satan: The Big Misconception

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Post by American Deist »

In Christianity, Satan is public enemy #1. He is the rebellious, fallen angel that was cast out of Heaven. His role is that of an antagonist on Earth, working against God and tempting us with evil. But is any of that true?

The term 'Satan' comes from the Hebrew 'ha-satan,' and it is actually a title, not a name. In Hebrew, ha = the, and satan = adversary. The correct usage when fully translated into English would be 'the adversary.' Interestingly enough, the YLT version of the Bible, written over 150 years ago, did exactly that. If we are going to translate Yeshua [Hebrew] into Jesus [English], then so should we translate the Hebrew term 'satan' into adversary.

Furthermore, the concept of Satan as the devil is a Christian construct. Judaism does not have that concept. Jewish scholars will tell you that Christians have butchered the role of Satan and made him into something he is not. Many will cite the Book of Job as proof that Satan is evil, but a closer inspection of that story will reveal some startling information. Satan did not go looking for Job; God brought up Job to Satan. God wanted Satan to test Job. To take it a step further, God made the rules for the tests and Satan had no choice but to obey.

God, as the creator of the universe and everything in it, could simply snap those divine fingers and uncreate Satan if he were truly this fallen, arch enemy. There's no need for all the mythology surrounding the story. God could cut right through the red tape and be done with it. Remember, it is God's will that is done in Heaven, so there is no way that an angel(s) could rebel unless God willed it.

Under Judaism (which knows the OT far better than Christianity, as they understand it in Hebrew) Satan is in the role of district attorney. He brings you up on charges of sin, and God sits as the judge and jury. Because God is the omnipotent creator, Satan can't do anything without permission. He is fulfilling his divine role given to him by God.

There was a belief that Hell was inside the Earth. The 1611 KJV kept that belief when it translated Revelation 12:9 and stated that "...he [Satan] was cast out [of Heaven] into the earth." Modern translations have removed "into the earth" and replaced it with "to the earth." It is because of that ancient belief that Heaven was "up" and Hell was "down."

Satan is often referred to as Lucifer. This is also incorrect. The term lucifer is Latin, and the 4th century CE monk named Jerome can be blamed for its usage. In writing his Latin Vulgate for the RCC, he got to Isaiah 14:12 and for reasons unknown, capitalized the L in lucifer, thus making it a proper noun [name]. The 1611 KJV kept the erroneous translation and that has led many people to use it over the years. Modern translations have since removed the term completely after realizing the error.

The term lucifer [Latin] comes from he�sphoros [Greek], and it is in reference to the planet Venus, otherwise known as the dawn star because it can be seen at dawn. Venus is the morning star; the dawn bringer or the light bringer. Interestingly enough, Jesus is also referred to as the morning star [lucifer].

Some will quote Isaiah 14:12 and link it to Luke 10:18, as proof of Satan and his fall from Heaven. However, Isaiah 14:12 is NOT about a fallen angel. The entire chapter is about a fallen Babylonian king, and if you study Judaism you'd understand that. The Jews HATED the Persian Empire, especially Nebuchadnezzar II, since he destroyed the temples in Jerusalem. The writer was mocking the fallen king in his death.

So why do Christians believe in Satan as God's nemesis? Because they want a supernatural boogeyman to blame all the bad stuff on. The irony is that God is the one that causes evil in the world, and even says so in Isaiah 45:7 - "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things."

Besides, the scrolls that made up what was to become the Bible, were written thousands of years ago. The stories were Earth centric, and did not take into account other planets because they did not know about other planets. They did not have telescopes. What does that have to do with anything? If "Satan" was cast down to the Earth, then every other planet in the universe does not have to worry about him!

How about them apples?! :-k
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Re: Satan: The Big Misconception

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Post by Tired of the Nonsense »

American Deist wrote: In Christianity, Satan is public enemy #1. He is the rebellious, fallen angel that was cast out of Heaven. His role is that of an antagonist on Earth, working against God and tempting us with evil. But is any of that true?

The term 'Satan' comes from the Hebrew 'ha-satan,' and it is actually a title, not a name. In Hebrew, ha = the, and satan = adversary. The correct usage when fully translated into English would be 'the adversary.' Interestingly enough, the YLT version of the Bible, written over 150 years ago, did exactly that. If we are going to translate Yeshua [Hebrew] into Jesus [English], then so should we translate the Hebrew term 'satan' into adversary.

Furthermore, the concept of Satan as the devil is a Christian construct. Judaism does not have that concept. Jewish scholars will tell you that Christians have butchered the role of Satan and made him into something he is not. Many will cite the Book of Job as proof that Satan is evil, but a closer inspection of that story will reveal some startling information. Satan did not go looking for Job; God brought up Job to Satan. God wanted Satan to test Job. To take it a step further, God made the rules for the tests and Satan had no choice but to obey.

God, as the creator of the universe and everything in it, could simply snap those divine fingers and uncreate Satan if he were truly this fallen, arch enemy. There's no need for all the mythology surrounding the story. God could cut right through the red tape and be done with it. Remember, it is God's will that is done in Heaven, so there is no way that an angel(s) could rebel unless God willed it.

Under Judaism (which knows the OT far better than Christianity, as they understand it in Hebrew) Satan is in the role of district attorney. He brings you up on charges of sin, and God sits as the judge and jury. Because God is the omnipotent creator, Satan can't do anything without permission. He is fulfilling his divine role given to him by God.

There was a belief that Hell was inside the Earth. The 1611 KJV kept that belief when it translated Revelation 12:9 and stated that "...he [Satan] was cast out [of Heaven] into the earth." Modern translations have removed "into the earth" and replaced it with "to the earth." It is because of that ancient belief that Heaven was "up" and Hell was "down."

Satan is often referred to as Lucifer. This is also incorrect. The term lucifer is Latin, and the 4th century CE monk named Jerome can be blamed for its usage. In writing his Latin Vulgate for the RCC, he got to Isaiah 14:12 and for reasons unknown, capitalized the L in lucifer, thus making it a proper noun [name]. The 1611 KJV kept the erroneous translation and that has led many people to use it over the years. Modern translations have since removed the term completely after realizing the error.

The term lucifer [Latin] comes from he�sphoros [Greek], and it is in reference to the planet Venus, otherwise known as the dawn star because it can be seen at dawn. Venus is the morning star; the dawn bringer or the light bringer. Interestingly enough, Jesus is also referred to as the morning star [lucifer].

Some will quote Isaiah 14:12 and link it to Luke 10:18, as proof of Satan and his fall from Heaven. However, Isaiah 14:12 is NOT about a fallen angel. The entire chapter is about a fallen Babylonian king, and if you study Judaism you'd understand that. The Jews HATED the Persian Empire, especially Nebuchadnezzar II, since he destroyed the temples in Jerusalem. The writer was mocking the fallen king in his death.

So why do Christians believe in Satan as God's nemesis? Because they want a supernatural boogeyman to blame all the bad stuff on. The irony is that God is the one that causes evil in the world, and even says so in Isaiah 45:7 - "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things."

Besides, the scrolls that made up what was to become the Bible, were written thousands of years ago. The stories were Earth centric, and did not take into account other planets because they did not know about other planets. They did not have telescopes. What does that have to do with anything? If "Satan" was cast down to the Earth, then every other planet in the universe does not have to worry about him!

How about them apples?! :-k
The Christian concept of Satan has much more in common with the Persian concept of the evil opponent of God (Ahura Mazda) called Ahriman (Angra Mainyu) than it does with the Jewish concept of Satan.

Wikipedia
Ahriman
Ahriman, Avestan Angra Mainyu (“Destructive Spirit�), the evil destructive spirit in the dualistic doctrine of Zoroastrianism. He is the twin brother of Spenta Mainyu, the Holy Spirit. Both spirits were created by Ahura Mazd� (Ormizd or Ormazd), the Wise Lord and supreme deity of Zoroastrianism.

Ahriman’s essential nature is expressed in his principal epithet—Druj, “the Lie,� which expresses itself as greed, wrath, and envy. To aid him in attacking the light (Spenta Mainyu, the good creation of Ahura Mazd�), Ahriman created a horde of demons embodying envy and similar qualities. Despite the chaos and suffering effected in the world by his onslaught, believers expect Ahriman to be defeated in the end of time by Ahura Mazd�. Confined to their own realm, his demons will devour each other, and his own existence will be quenched.
https://www.britannica.com/topic/Ahriman
Image "The word God is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honorable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this." -- Albert Einstein -- Written in 1954 to Jewish philosopher Erik Gutkind.

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Post #3

Post by Willum »

So Hebrew had no vowels.

So Satan would have been STN or HSTN. When you write it that way it does indeed seem Arabian. If it is Hebew we can be sure of the vowels.

If is it Satan, it is not Saytan, but Saton.

There is the legend that Lucifer is Nebuchadnezzar, angry Jewish people slandered that King for ending the line of David.

There is a possibility, with the whole cast of of Heaven story, that it is a corruption of Saturn, who was also cast out of Heaven. (The battle between God and Satan, is copied from the war between Titans and the Greek Gods.)

I am afraid I am all over the board on this one, but that's what I got.

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Post #4

Post by Willum »

Corrections - good grief!
Willum wrote: So Hebrew had no vowels.

So Satan would have been STN or HSTN. When you write it that way it does indeed seem Arabian. If it is Hebew we can't be sure of the vowels. Modern Hebrew is simply plagiarized Lebanese Canaan coupled with hopes and dreams.

If it is Satan, it is not Saytan, but Saton. Like "satin," short 'a.'

There is the legend that Lucifer is Nebuchadnezzar, angry Jewish people slandered that King for ending the line of David.

There is a possibility, with the whole cast out of Heaven story, that it is a corruption of Saturn, who was also cast out of Heaven. (The battle between God and Satan, is copied from the war between Titans and the Greek Gods.)

I am afraid I am all over the board on this one, but that's what I got.
It might prove a fruitful exercise to pix and mix any combination of vowels to see if any other spirit or deity's name matches.

Still another wrinkle is:
Satan - or the serpent is the Egyptian serpent god, Apophis, or through the magic of ancient vowel manipulation - Apep. He vied with the Egyptian mother goddess, Ma'at. In the OT these roles were Satan (OK, whatever) and Eve. The part of Adam was played by Ra. Only Ra, Ma'at and Apep predate them by over 500 years.
I will never understand how someone who claims to know the ultimate truth, of God, believes they deserve respect, when they cannot distinguish it from a fairy-tale.

You know, science and logic are hard: Religion and fairy tales might be more your speed.

To continue to argue for the Hebrew invention of God is actually an insult to the very concept of a God. - Divine Insight

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Re: Satan: The Big Misconception

Post #5

Post by theophile »

[Replying to post 1 by American Deist]

I fully agree that Satan needs to be rethought. As usual, the popular understanding is not the most faithful to the text.

And this holds across at least three levels. The serpent. The satan (of Job). Satan.

We can't conflate these characters but need to understand their relationship, if any.

Take the serpent. Sure, such works as Paradise Lost have led to this popular notion of a fall before the fall and the serpent as definitively evil. That is not necessarily the case, and textual evidence for the serpent as a good creature is in fact stronger than it being evil.

(That said, we can still uphold John's claim of Satan as "that ancient serpent" in the sense that the serpent is somehow the progenitor of Satan. This fits John's language just fine, as well as the curse that God declares in Gen 3 of a mounting enmity between human and serpent-kind...)

There is also the satan of Job to your point. I agree it is the adversary. I would not go in the direction of district attorney or agent of God (which I know is a traditional view, but I find it uninspiring). I would rather see the satan as a free creature that has come from the earth (explicitly) with something clearly upsetting it, and that God senses.

What's upsetting it? Well, in coming from the earth it is presumably God's plan for the earth that is upsetting it, which we know from Genesis 1 is for humankind to rule. Thus, the satan has a beef with humankind, and because of this, God.

We also know from Genesis 3, to the point made, that the satan may be the leading edge of a mounting enmity between serpent and humankind... So this fits quite nicely.

Hence God's question: "Have you considered Job? There is nobody like him in all the earth..." And the satan's vigorous argument against Job - having lost faith in humankind and needing a solid defense in order to restore it (i.e., Job's tests).

With this, we get a completely different context for the book of Job, one that is far richer and biblically rooted I think than the satan simply being some evil character that God baits, or a district attorney seeking out fault in God's creation. And yes, it does not conflate the satan with Satan but sees them as separate (while also related). The satan is a spirit in the world that has come to dissent from God's plan, but is not yet in outright rebellion against it... That would be the next level of enmity when the adversary spirit is personified as Satan.

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Re: Satan: The Big Misconception

Post #6

Post by Goose »

American Deist wrote:Furthermore, the concept of Satan as the devil is a Christian construct. Judaism does not have that concept. Jewish scholars will tell you that Christians have butchered the role of Satan and made him into something he is not. Many will cite the Book of Job as proof that Satan is evil, but a closer inspection of that story will reveal some startling information. Satan did not go looking for Job; God brought up Job to Satan. God wanted Satan to test Job. To take it a step further, God made the rules for the tests and Satan had no choice but to obey.
The concept of Satan as the devil and evil is evident in the Jewish Apocrypha literature which predates Christianity. So, it’s unlikely this was a wholesale Christian construct.


�but through the devil's envy death entered the world, and those who belong to his party experience it.� – Wisdom of Solomon 2:24

Jewish Encyclopedia wrote: In the Apocrypha.

The evolution of the theory of Satan keeps pace with the development of Jewish angelology and demonology. In Wisdom ii. 24 he is represented, with reference to Gen. iii., as the author of all evil, who brought death into the world; he is apparently mentioned also in Ecclus. (Sirach) xxi. 27, and the fact that his name does not occur in Daniel is doubtless due merely to chance. Satan was the seducer and the paramour of Eve, and was hurled from heaven together with other angels because of his iniquity (Slavonic Book of Enoch, xxix. 4 et seq.). Since that time he has been called "Satan," although previously he had been termed "Satanel" (ib. xxxi. 3 et seq.). The doctrine of the fall of Satan, as well as of the fall of the angels, is found also in Babylonia (Schrader, l.c. p. 464), and is mentioned several times in the New Testament. Satan rules over an entire host of angels (Martyrdom of Isaiah, ii. 2; Vita Adæ et Evæ, xvi.). Mastema, who induced God to test Abraham through the sacrifice of Isaac, is identical with Satan in both name and nature (Book of Jubilees, xvii. 18), and the Asmodeus of the Book of Tobit is likewise to be identified with him, especially in view of his licentiousness. As the lord of satans he not infrequently bears the special name Samael. It is difficult to identify Satan in any other passages of the Apocrypha, since the originals in which his name occurred have been lost, and the translations employ various equivalents. An "argumentum a silentio" can not, therefore, be adduced as proof that concepts of Satan were not wide-spread; but it must rather be assumed that reference to him and his realm is implied in the mention of evil spirits of every sort (comp. Demonology, and Kautzsch, "Apokryphen," Index).

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Re: Satan: The Big Misconception

Post #7

Post by bjs »

American Deist wrote: The term 'Satan' comes from the Hebrew 'ha-satan,' and it is actually a title, not a name. In Hebrew, ha = the, and satan = adversary. The correct usage when fully translated into English would be 'the adversary.' Interestingly enough, the YLT version of the Bible, written over 150 years ago, did exactly that. If we are going to translate Yeshua [Hebrew] into Jesus [English], then so should we translate the Hebrew term 'satan' into adversary.
“Satan� or “ha-satan� is a transliteration, not a translation. “Yeshua� is also a transliteration. If we translate “Satan� then it would be “adversary.� If we translate “Yeshua� then it would be “Yahwey saves� or “I AM saves.� Satan is used as a name, not a title, in the Hebrew scriptures (though in that culture names were descriptions of character, so all names were kind of like titles). We usually transliterate proper names into English, as opposed to translating them.
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Re: Satan: The Big Misconception

Post #8

Post by American Deist »

[Replying to post 7 by bjs]

Wrong! It is a title, which is why in Hebrew the term is preceded by the definitive article 'the.' When 'the' is placed before another word, it makes it a common noun (title) not a proper noun (name). Besides, Jews will tell you that "Satan" was created by God and his divine purpose is to be a stumbling block, so that you get stronger as you overcome whatever obstacle was before you. It helps to study Hebrew.
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Re: Satan: The Big Misconception

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Post by American Deist »

[Replying to post 6 by Goose]

There is a reason the Apocrypha was not included in the Tanakh.
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Re: Satan: The Big Misconception

Post #10

Post by Goose »

American Deist wrote: [Replying to post 6 by Goose]There is a reason the Apocrypha was not included in the Tanakh.
I'm sure there was. Feel free to elaborate as to how this is relevant to the point I'm making. As far as I can see your remark here does nothing to falsify the fact that Satan was conflated with the devil and portrayed as the embodiment of evil in Jewish literature and thought well before Christianity. Therefore, it could not have been a Christian construct.

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