What is God?
Is God not beyond definition?
Why do we argue about the existence of that which is beyond definition?
What is God?
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paarsurrey1
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Re: What is God?
Post #71Which scripture one means? Please name it.Clownboat wrote:
Here is the thing you are not considering though. We can be good without scripture, and sense scriptures can also contain bad with the good, they cannot be a trusted source.It is good for people to be exhorted by sacred scripture to do good.
Whatever the scripture, be it a Hinduism or Buddhism or Zoroastrianism or Judaism or Christians, none is to be accepted in blind faith?
The founders of these great religions did not accept anything blindly. Did they, please?
Regards
Re: What is God?
Post #72[Replying to post 70 by Clownboat]
can't you see? life and everything animal plant and mineral everything is sacred .
can't you see? life and everything animal plant and mineral everything is sacred .
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William
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Re: What is God?
Post #73[Replying to post 69 by paarsurrey1]
1: The shoulder?
2: The elbow?
3: The wrist?
4: The hand?
5: The arm.?
Please and thank you.
Which is most important.One is wrong and sees things topsy-turvy, a big supposition.
Logic is sure a discipline of Philosophy . Science loans it from Philosophy and cannot get going without it. Right , please?
Philosophy generated Mathematics and Mathematics generated Science, one should recollect, please.
1: The shoulder?
2: The elbow?
3: The wrist?
4: The hand?
5: The arm.?
Please and thank you.
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OnlineClownboat
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Re: What is God?
Post #74paarsurrey1 wrote:Clownboat wrote:
Here is the thing you are not considering though. We can be good without scripture, and sense scriptures can also contain bad with the good, they cannot be a trusted source.It is good for people to be exhorted by sacred scripture to do good.All of them. Humans can be good without scripture.Which scripture one means?
Don't you agree?
Faith is necessary in order to believe in false things. Why should we accept anything on faith?Whatever the scripture, be it a Hinduism or Buddhism or Zoroastrianism or Judaism or Christians, none is to be accepted in blind faith?
They were much more ignorant then us of today. I would imagine they invented all sorts of concepts, some good, some bad and some of which they accepted blindly. However, if we are being honest, we just don't know.The founders of these great religions did not accept anything blindly.
You can give a man a fish and he will be fed for a day, or you can teach a man to pray for fish and he will starve to death.
I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU
It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco
If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb
I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU
It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco
If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb
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OnlineClownboat
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Re: What is God?
Post #75Why must you war with the English language in order to try to make a point? Is it not embarrassing?dio9 wrote: [Replying to post 70 by Clownboat]
can't you see? life and everything animal plant and mineral everything is sacred .
sa·cred
ˈs�krəd/Submit
adjective
connected with God (or the gods) or dedicated to a religious purpose and so deserving veneration.
"sacred rites"
synonyms: holy, hallowed, blessed, consecrated, sanctified, venerated, revered; archaicblest
"the priest entered the sacred place"
religious rather than secular.
"sacred music"
synonyms: religious, spiritual, devotional, church, ecclesiastical
"sacred music"
(of writing or text) embodying the laws or doctrines of a religion.
Perhaps you meant to use a different word?
You can give a man a fish and he will be fed for a day, or you can teach a man to pray for fish and he will starve to death.
I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU
It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco
If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb
I blame man for codifying those rules into a book which allowed superstitious people to perpetuate a barbaric practice. Rules that must be followed or face an invisible beings wrath. - KenRU
It is sad that in an age of freedom some people are enslaved by the nomads of old. - Marco
If you are unable to demonstrate that what you believe is true and you absolve yourself of the burden of proof, then what is the purpose of your arguments? - brunumb
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paarsurrey1
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Re: What is God?
Post #76[Replying to post 74 by Clownboat]
paarsurrey:
Doesn't one has faith in Science, please?
If faith is essential to believe in Science, why it should be bad in Religion, please?
One shouldn't have blind-faith in science and or religion, please.
Regards
paarsurrey:
ClownboatWhatever the scripture, be it a Hinduism or Buddhism or Zoroastrianism or Judaism or Christians, none is to be accepted in blind faith?
Faith is necessary in order to believe in false things. Why should we accept anything on faith?
Doesn't one has faith in Science, please?
If faith is essential to believe in Science, why it should be bad in Religion, please?
One shouldn't have blind-faith in science and or religion, please.
Regards
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Danmark
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Re: What is God?
Post #78No, scientists do not have 'faith' in the current findings of science. Just the opposite, scientists and those who value science simply accept the scientific method as the most reliable method (so far) for understanding the natural world; i.e., the world that is discoverable thru observation. The scientific method [SM]is the opposite of the faith you speak of. The SM is continually self correcting as it seeks to find errors in current conclusions and methodologies of science.paarsurrey1 wrote: Doesn't one has faith in Science, please?
If faith is essential to believe in Science, why it should be bad in Religion, please?
OTOH, 'faith' seeks to avoid change and challenge and only seeks self promotion and preservation of its frequently fallacious beliefs.
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William
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Re: What is God?
Post #79[Replying to post 76 by paarsurrey1]
So faith is holding onto some concept or another as if it were truth. Science methodology is not offering truth about anything in relation to philosophical or theistic ideas, and seldom goes there at all, and when it does, it usually isn't that well funded to do any real turning of every stone aka thorough research, but to be fair, there is not a lot of theistic subjects which can be examined in such a way. Science is not the best tool for the job.
What can be done though, is something similar to what James Randi used to do. He used to expose fraudulent claims by so-called mediums and other charlatans parading around as theists.
What we can do ourselves is examine theistic stories (in the bible for example) and find inconsistencies therein - investigate and detect - and present those discrepancies, for debate with folk who believe the stories but often haven't gone so far as to examine the stories for inconsistencies because faith is holding onto some concept or another as if it were truth. Examining them is seen as not having faith, and I suppose that is what faith is about, although some say it is not about that at all.
Some believe that they have examined the stories and explain the inconsistencies but the explanations often have a foundation in faith, so that is problematic and so the explanations are of little to no value as far as determining what the truth really is.
No. Where faith might come into it is in how the data of scientific method may be interpreted, and those interpretations held to as if they were truth.Doesn't one has faith in Science, please?
So faith is holding onto some concept or another as if it were truth. Science methodology is not offering truth about anything in relation to philosophical or theistic ideas, and seldom goes there at all, and when it does, it usually isn't that well funded to do any real turning of every stone aka thorough research, but to be fair, there is not a lot of theistic subjects which can be examined in such a way. Science is not the best tool for the job.
What can be done though, is something similar to what James Randi used to do. He used to expose fraudulent claims by so-called mediums and other charlatans parading around as theists.
What we can do ourselves is examine theistic stories (in the bible for example) and find inconsistencies therein - investigate and detect - and present those discrepancies, for debate with folk who believe the stories but often haven't gone so far as to examine the stories for inconsistencies because faith is holding onto some concept or another as if it were truth. Examining them is seen as not having faith, and I suppose that is what faith is about, although some say it is not about that at all.
Some believe that they have examined the stories and explain the inconsistencies but the explanations often have a foundation in faith, so that is problematic and so the explanations are of little to no value as far as determining what the truth really is.
Last edited by William on Thu Aug 31, 2017 10:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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paarsurrey1
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Re: What is God?
Post #80Danmark wrote:No, scientists do not have 'faith' in the current findings of science. Just the opposite, scientists and those who value science simply accept the scientific method as the most reliable method (so far) for understanding the natural world; i.e., the world that is discoverable thru observation. The scientific method [SM]is the opposite of the faith you speak of. The SM is continually self correcting as it seeks to find errors in current conclusions and methodologies of science.paarsurrey1 wrote: Doesn't one has faith in Science, please?
If faith is essential to believe in Science, why it should be bad in Religion, please?
OTOH, 'faith' seeks to avoid change and challenge and only seeks self promotion and preservation of its frequently fallacious beliefs.
It is appreciable that the scientist don't have blind-faith in science, though I find that the eulogizers of science sometimes do have blind-faith in science.No, scientists do not have 'faith' in the current findings of science.
Similarly, the truthful religion also does not have blind-faith, attributes of God are always at work so the realities of Universe/s are constantly changing:
[55:27] All that is on it (earth) will pass away.
[55:28] And there will remain only the Person of thy Lord, Master of Glory and Honour.
[55:29] Which, then, of the favours of your Lord will you twain deny? [55:30] Of Him do beg all that are in the heavens and the earth. Every day He reveals Himself in a different state*.
https://www.alislam.org/quran/search2/s ... 5&verse=27
*constant change.
Regards
