Is this Jewish and Christian expectation for Messiah same.

[dio9]

It struck me like a bolt of lightening from nowhere that the story of Jesus is just one of the continuing stories of Hebrew history. Jesus' times were the times of Messianic expectation. His story is just the most outrageously unjust story of them all.

question for discussion and debate , If you will:
Is The Jewish Messiah and the Christian Messiah the same Messiah?
a Rabbi professor , when I was in seminary school said the Messiah is the one who does it. Did Jesus make it happen?
freedom from Rome and the kingdom of God, Jesus' mission is incomplete .

Is the Christian commission to carry on and complete it?
Is this Jewish and Christian expectation the same?

[dio9]

I don't think the expectation is the same. Christians knew it wasn't and looked forward to Christ's return.To do what? establish the Rule Government Dominion of righteousness. It didn't happen. They earnestly tried and believed but could not establish the kingdom of God of Jesus' vision. They had a powerful influence on the empire but still it was not enough. Is such a thing humanly possible? We pride ourselves saying we are God's image on earth. But the challenge of my Rabbi remains. Are we able to realize a Jesus worldview?

[Mithrae]

Where in the Tanakh is the term 'messiah' used in reference to any specific future figure or period?

[Realworldjack]

[Replying to post 1 by dio9]

Is this Jewish and Christian expectation the same?

I believe you can find this answer in the Bible. John the Baptist, came an announced the coming of Jesus. John certainly must have had a different expectation of the Messiah himself. In other words, he believed with all the Jews at the time, including the disciples, that the Messiah would come and rescue the Jews form Roman occupation.

With this being the case, John showed no fear in confronting Herod about his sin. When John was arrested, he must have surely been under the impression that when Jesus took care of the Romans, that he would surely be set free.

However, when the days, began to turn into weeks, John begins to wonder, and sends his own disciples to Jesus to ask, "are you the Christ, are should we look for another."

So then, I am not sure it is correct to ask, "Is this Jewish and Christian expectation the same?" Since, Christians have no "expectation" believing that the Christ has already arrived, while the Jews continue their expectations.

[dio9]

Where in the Tanakh is the term 'messiah' used in reference to any specific future figure or period?

I don't think the tanakh refers to a second coming of the Messiah. I'm quite sure Jesus' age was a Messianic age.

[dio9]

[Replying to post 1 by dio9]

Is this Jewish and Christian expectation the same?

I believe you can find this answer in the Bible. John the Baptist, came an announced the coming of Jesus. John certainly must have had a different expectation of the Messiah himself. In other words, he believed with all the Jews at the time, including the disciples, that the Messiah would come and rescue the Jews form Roman occupation.

With this being the case, John showed no fear in confronting Herod about his sin. When John was arrested, he must have surely been under the impression that when Jesus took care of the Romans, that he would surely be set free.

However, when the days, began to turn into weeks, John begins to wonder, and sends his own disciples to Jesus to ask, "are you the Christ, are should we look for another."

So then, I am not sure it is correct to ask, "Is this Jewish and Christian expectation the same?" Since, Christians have no "expectation" believing that the Christ has already arrived, while the Jews continue their expectations.

Christians actually do have an expectation of a second coming of Christ the Messiah. But what Christ comes back to do is not clear. Does he return to turn Human foolishness into kingdom of Godness at long last or something else ? Christians don't know what to expect , a real way to restoration of pre-fallen humanity to where salvation is restoration or the end of the world?
Its the mission of the messiah that has continued to live through the ages and that is actually the same , belief faith and hope in the restoration of a world belonging to God given to people.

[liamconnor]

[Replying to post 1 by dio9]

Jesus fulfilled almost none of the Jewish expectations.

That does not mean he is not the Jewish God's anointed Messiah; it merely means that their expectations would require adjustment.

[dio9]

[Replying to post 1 by dio9]

Jesus fulfilled almost none of the Jewish expectations.

That does not mean he is not the Jewish God's anointed Messiah; it merely means that their expectations would require adjustment.

I do believe with you Jesus was is God's anointed Messiah Can you say what adjustments would have been required?

[liamconnor]

[Replying to post 8 by dio9]

Simply compare the office of Jesus in the N.T. with the expectations as extrapolated from the relevant Jewish material:

There was to be nothing divine about the Messiah. Certainly, the Messiah was not to replace the temple, let alone the efficacy of the sacrifices. His death as atoning for sins?! Bah (so a Jew would say).

His job was: restore Israel to independence and greatness (as in the days of Solomon); rule with justice according to the law of MOses. There are some clauses about subduing the world. Ancient Jewish beliefs were rather ambiguous with the place of the Gentiles in their future vision.

Christians who attack Jews as being 'blind to the obvious fact that Jesus is their Messiah' are not familiar with the historical expectations of the Messiah.

[alwayson]

Septuagint version of Zechariah 3 and 6 gives the exact Greek name of Jesus, describing him as confronting Satan, being crowned king in heaven, ‘rising’ from his place below, and building up God’s house, given supreme authority over God’s domain and ending all sins in a single day.

Daniel 9 describes a messiah dying before the end of the world.

Isaiah 52-53 describes the cleansing of the world's sins by the death of a servant.