Atrocities of God

[liamconnor]

Much talk has been made on the morality of God; for instance:

JW and others calling themselves 'Christian' have advanced the argument that since God created the world and human beings, if he tortures, kills, or rapes his creatures; or tells people to do it, this is not evil because God created them and their world.

But I have seen few biblical references. Here is a chance to present individual cases for discussion. Please present the passage, with book, chapter, and verse.

As a preliminary, I argue that the majority of the Psalms are not a legitimate source for the morality of God; they are written from the human perspective alone. We have no indication in them that when the psalmist looked forward to a day when Babylonian babies would be bashed against rocks, the God of the bible approved. For his moral standards, we need to look to the law and portions of the Bible where God is said to speak for himself (the prophets; histories).

Secondly, I for one recall no instances in which God demands the torture of anyone, nor does he rape anyone. Torture is the intention to prolong pain; even in cases of stoning (from what I have heard, a pretty quick execution) we have no command to allow the victim to recover so the treatment can be repeated. Rape involves physical penetration and the absence of consent; neither obtain in the case of Mary.

[Tired of the Nonsense]

Mr. Conner has yet to respond. I submit that this is because the answer to his question has been provided.

[Danmark]

Mr. Conner has yet to respond. I submit that this is because the answer to his question has been provided.

A question remains from the OP, one that I missed if it has been addressed. It involves this, from the OP:

I argue that the majority of the Psalms are not a legitimate source for the morality of God; they are written from the human perspective alone. We have no indication in them that when the psalmist looked forward to a day when Babylonian babies would be bashed against rocks, the God of the bible approved. For his moral standards, we need to look to the law and portions of the Bible where God is said to speak for himself (the prophets; histories).

Tho' I agree the Psalms are written from the human author's POV, why then are they considered scripture at all if they do not come from God? Herein lies a dilemma for the 'Bible Believer.' Either the believer accepts what is written, warts and all, or the authority of scripture is lost.

Additionally, the prophets, the histories, the Pentateuch, are ALL written by men, but accorded the status of 'scripture' because supposedly they are written with 'divine inspiration.' Why give the Psalms a different status?
In any event, in addition to the Psalms, horrifically immoral stances have been attributed to this God by the various authors.

[DanieltheDragon]

[Replying to post 16 by Hawkins]


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[marco]

> God drowning every living thing on the planet - not the worst but hardly the nicest way to die - save eight humans and two of "every animal"

I have never understood this argument.

There is nothing much to understand: a being destroys almost all humankind by a deliberate act. That would normally be termed murder. If someone dies of old age or from cancer or from an accident, the murderous being wasn't involved.

However, if you are crediting God with causing the deaths of all humans by inventing a whole variety of murderous means, then the original charge of brutality stands, through this admission. Usually, we criticise him only for the murders he has admitted.

[amortalman]

[Replying to post 1 by liamconnor]

I would like to refer to the last part of your comment where you state,"Secondly, I for one recall no instances in which God demands the torture of anyone, nor does he rape anyone."

God was, in fact, complicit in the crime of rape against the women of his own chosen people as recorded in Zachariah 14:1-2:

Lo, a day shall come for the Lord when the spoils shall be divided in your midst. And I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem for battle: the city shall be taken, houses plundered, women ravished; half of the city shall go into exile, but the rest of the people shall not be removed from the city. (Zechariah 14:1-2 NAB)

The women of Jerusalem were ravished (raped) by Israel's enemies with the wholehearted approval of God. Of course, this was not an isolated incident. Women were treated as the property of their fathers or husbands, sold as slaves, taken as spoils of war (but only the young virgins, the grown men, and women were slaughtered) all with a nod from their male God. But don't fret. After all, it's only fiction, as nasty as it is.

[ttruscott]

> God drowning every living thing on the planet - not the worst but hardly the nicest way to die - save eight humans and two of "every animal"

I have never understood this argument.

There is nothing much to understand: a being destroys almost all humankind by a deliberate act. That would normally be termed murder.

...unless it was by the legal and just sentence of a proper Judge. Executions are not murder.

[Danmark]

[Replying to post 26 by ttruscott]

We had an existence with a free will in Sheol before the creation of the physical universe. Here we chose to be able to become holy or to be eternally evil in YHWH's sight. Then the physical universe was created and all sinners were sent to earth.

This is the most fantastic, utterly ridiculous idea I've ever heard of. You continue to trot this nonsense out again and again, but you have ZERO support for it. Nothing in the Bible or in nature supports such a fantasy. There's as much support for this claim as there is for "Thetans" and and "Xenu" from Scientology.

Hubbard wrote that Xenu was the ruler of a Galactic Confederacy 75 million years ago, which consisted of 26 stars and 76 planets including Earth, which was then known as "Teegeeack".
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xenu

You might as well be talking about a galactic bunny rabbit. I believe you have previously said, Ted, that NO ONE shares your belief. No one.

[wiploc]

... since God created the world and human beings, if he tortures, kills, or rapes his creatures; or tells people to do it, this is not evil because God created them and their world.

Who made that rule? Not a good god.