Ann Coulter's new book? Godless Liberals.

[1John2_26]

Quote:
ENIGMA wrote:
Did anyone ever get around to providing a question for debate?

Why would a liberal claim to be a Christian when their preaching, statements, beliefs and actions are contradicted by the Gospels and the letters of the New Testament?

[Cathar1950]

They're relevant questions. Something makes a person chose to use their sex organs wrongly.

Have you been drinking?
They were not relevant questions they were nonsense.

micatala said it best.

This is truly ridiculous.

They're relevant questions. Something makes a person chose to use their sex organs wrongly.

First we don't agree they are using them wrongly. That is an unsupported opinion of yours.
Making them? What does that mean? Are you giving up the idea that is all choice and free will or did they just give themselves over to Satan?

And there is only specualtion about the whole "born gay" thing. No supporting facts except politics.

It is only speculation and bias on your part that says they are not born that way.
There are studies unlike your politics that suggest they are biological or genetic factors. Unlike your opinion that all they got to do is get married.

It actually and literally means that something went wrong in the womb if you assertion is to be looked at logically.

Again you are assuming it is wrong and not just a variation. It might have happened on a genetic level before the womb. But we do know for certain that is not crack or liberals. There were homosexuals before there was crack and the liberal idea is ridiculous.

Why are the born wanting to do things that their genitalia proves they shouldn't have the thoughts to do with them? Genitalia are a sexual orienting statement.

I am only going to guess what you mean here but it sounds ridiculous too.
They do things before they are born with there genitals.
I don't think it is a “want” it is an instinct and pleasure. I can hardly imagine a fetus wanting to play being they wouldn’t have the concept. What does self-stimulation of the fetus and the new born? Are you saying the hand is an unnatural way to use the genitals?
They do it before birth. Is that God’s doing or do you think it is a consequence of the fall and man’s sinful nature he acquired when he was made in the image of God and made the wrong choice? I suggest you take some sex education courses.

[Wyvern]

They're relevant questions. Something makes a person chose to use their sex organs wrongly.

Rather strange, you agreeing that god might be guilty of some shoddy workmanship.

All three of these are completely speculative and without any evidence in fact.

And there is only specualtion about the whole "born gay" thing. No supporting facts except politics.

Just as there is even less supporting evidence for homosexuality being a choice as you purport.

They are simply offered to dodge the fact that evidence supporting the contention the homosexuality in most cases is inborn implies, for those that believer in God, that God is ultimately responsible.

It actually and literally means that something went wrong in the womb if you assertion is to be looked at logically.

Indeed, and as you surely must agree nothing happens without gods approval. Unless you now think god is not in as much charge as you posit.

Why are the born wanting to do things that their genitalia proves they shouldn't have the thoughts to do with them? Genitalia are a sexual orienting statement.

Well in your world view it can only mean that either god or satan is responsible. Going from your view that god created everything and from the realization that homosexuality has existed from the earliest of times biblically it seems logical that god created homosexuality for a purpose. Simply because you find evidence for arguing against it in the bible does not take away from the obvious divine intervention that happened to make it possible in the first place. Are you now going to say that god was wrong in creating homosexuality in the first place? For who but god COULD have created such a thing given your understanding of how things came about? By your understanding god created EVERYTHING including homosexuals, who are you to question what god has made?

[1John2_26]

Quote:
They're relevant questions. Something makes a person chose to use their sex organs wrongly.

Have you been drinking?
They were not relevant questions they were nonsense.

I respond to posts and quote what I am rebutting. Hint.

micatala said it best.
Quote:
This is truly ridiculous.

Wow you agreed with micatala.

Quote:
They're relevant questions. Something makes a person chose to use their sex organs wrongly.

First we don't agree they are using them wrongly. That is an unsupported opinion of yours.

Remember that the rules have been changed so I cannot use the graphic facts to prove my point. Suffice it to say, any good parent doesn't want their children to do what liberals celebrate gays and lesbians do do.

Making them? What does that mean? Are you giving up the idea that is all choice and free will or did they just give themselves over to Satan?

Free will or a congenital birth defect. You only have two choices (actually one). Anatomy and physiology proves that. I can't go any further than that. I have to stay PG-13.

Quote:
And there is only specualtion about the whole "born gay" thing. No supporting facts except politics.

It is only speculation and bias on your part that says they are not born that way.

Ahhh, I see. No freewill. You don't see your position as rather insulting to gays and lesbians? They are just people too. Isn't that the salespitch?

There are studies unlike your politics that suggest they are biological or genetic factors.

Theory and hypothesis. Not even the gay and lesbians sites are posting a scientific fact are they?

Unlike your opinion that all they got to do is get married.

Marriage is a man and a woman. If "they" qualify they qualify. far from it from me to deny a man and a woman from getting married. Especially if they desire children. As we learned in elementary school "that" takes a man and a woman. Even in a petri dish. You may not want to turn this debate towards factual evidence.

Quote:
It actually and literally means that something went wrong in the womb if you assertion is to be looked at logically.

Again you are assuming it is wrong and not just a variation.

I am not apologizing for NOT being a lemming. I prefer reason and logic over emotionalism and political hype.

It might have happened on a genetic level before the womb. But we do know for certain that is not crack or liberals. There were homosexuals before there was crack and the liberal idea is ridiculous.

When your right your right. finally. We'll go with the birth defect thing then? Don't most people born with a malady seek a cure for it? Don't they give meds to ADHD sufferers? That is behavior based too. Please though "not" the purple pill.

Quote:
Why are they born wanting to do things that their genitalia proves they shouldn't have the thoughts to do with them? Genitalia are a sexual orienting statement.

I am only going to guess what you mean here but it sounds ridiculous too.

It only sounds ridiculaous because the rules were changed to deny the use of graphics. Literally. I found that oh so liberal tactic.

They do things before they are born with there genitals.

Talk about a ridiculous statement. Man, I ain't going there.

I don't think it is a “want” it is an instinct and pleasure. I can hardly imagine a fetus wanting to play being they wouldn’t have the concept. What does self-stimulation of the fetus and the new born? Are you saying the hand is an unnatural way to use the genitals?

No one is born through the palm. Again, I'd advise staying away from anatomical truth. Just drive your political machine. It looks like loiberals will get the power to "alter" society if the predictions of the upcoming elections woefully bear out. Still, I'll be just fine. You cannot catch immorality accidently.

They do it before birth. Is that God’s doing or do you think it is a consequence of the fall and man’s sinful nature he acquired when he was made in the image of God and made the wrong choice?

Plaesure can get corrupted into a crime cannot it not?

I suggest you take some sex education courses.

My presentation of human anatomy and physiology shows I passed the classes with a A+. No need to repeat the basics.

Good night. By the way I'm glad you're rich. I'll need your taxes when I retire. Lot's of them. Enjoy your cafe.

[Cathar1950]

The ones over in Africa feeding the millions starving over there? Or the liberals marching in comfy downtown streets?

Liberals are helping millions. Even atheists have feed people.
How many comfy right-wing evangelical TV personalities are there? Talk about calling the pot black.

You:

Ever read Mere Christianity by Lewis?

Me:

When I was 12 again when I was in my 20. What is your point?

You:
It's just a question. Trust me, I am not trying to convert you. That ain't my gig.

It was a rather useless unrelated question. I read everything he had published when I was 12.

It speaks like thunder. There is no reason why the Israelite scribes had any reason to paint their God dwelling among that. But they did it anyway. It's why I have such an amazing trust in Jewish people.

They could have made it up. If I remember they were trying to tell the readers it was their fault. It just makes he story juicy. Or it could have happened; people have eaten others before and since. You are amazing all right.
That makes no sense and you read that somewhere and didn’t understand that it is a lame idea.

Being honest can be very embarassing. Most people would lie about their graet God and heroes.

Maybe it is embarrassing to you but people lie about stuff all the time. Maybe you would lie about your great God and heroes. I think you have been accused of it a few times. Or may be it was part of the tale and you are making a big deal about it because it makes no sense.

Bend over buddies. Is that how I should address some of your heroes? John was beheaded. How insensitive and insulting your denigrating him. He was a Jew too. Should I accuse you of anti-Semitism too? As we'll see in a moment you "almost" pulled that card on me.

Bend over buddies? What does that mean?
Why wouldn’t I address my heroes that way? I actually heard it from a scholar’s description of him. That is what John did. I was not being insensitive insulting or denigrating and I wonder why you would even think that. I wonder why you think that is insulting? That is what baptism was. Why would I accuse him of anti-Semitism? You get weirder all the time. I am presenting Just facts and truth. It in not way reflects on your arguments. They fail on their own.

Me:

Does this mean you have not grown up yet?

You:

In some ways yes. In some ways no. I still like to fight bullies.

Are we big bad bullies? I get a kick out of your hero complex and vastly over inflated ego.

It comes from the dip you use.

If I were going to use “dip” as a slur I would use I on you.

My dealings on this website have gotten me noticed by some people that surprised me (friends that is). I use many things offered here in my dealings with youth. It has been very useful. Many decent people have no real idea that some people really do hold some of the views presented here.

I bet they have got you noticed.

But mostly as I look at this thread as so many others, I can understand Lot's position in a way.

I would think you would more identify with Lot’s daughters. Silly me.

Though I am not scared of the crowd and certainly my children will not be offered up.

No comment.

This is just fun.

You are right it is fun.

[Wyvern]

Remember that the rules have been changed so I cannot use the graphic facts to prove my point. Suffice it to say, any good parent doesn't want their children to do what liberals celebrate gays and lesbians do do.

I really think you confuse the ideas of acceptance and celebration.

Free will or a congenital birth defect. You only have two choices (actually one). Anatomy and physiology proves that. I can't go any further than that. I have to stay PG-13.

Anatomy and physiology prove no such thing. Anatomy identifies an object and places it within a body while physiology identifies how it works, nothing more, please get it right for once. Strange how you can't see that by your view god created both of your options and thus god knows what he is doing by allowing such to occur and yet you still can't see his grand design because you are tied to the bible and what it says.

And there is only specualtion about the whole "born gay" thing. No supporting facts except politics.

Just like there is no support for you saying it is a choice, so what's your point?

Marriage is a man and a woman. If "they" qualify they qualify. far from it from me to deny a man and a woman from getting married. Especially if they desire children. As we learned in elementary school "that" takes a man and a woman. Even in a petri dish. You may not want to turn this debate towards factual evidence.

What does reproduction have to do with marriage? As you have gone to great lengths to point out a child can result from a merely sexual union.

I am not apologizing for NOT being a lemming. I prefer reason and logic over emotionalism and political hype.

You say this and yet have difficulty separating your arguments from the emotional and political language that you insist on using.

When your right your right. finally. We'll go with the birth defect thing then? Don't most people born with a malady seek a cure for it? Don't they give meds to ADHD sufferers? That is behavior based too. Please though "not" the purple pill.

Many things have no cure, and as we can see with deaf people even when a cure is possible it is not universally embraced because they want to preserve their culture.

No one is born through the palm. Again, I'd advise staying away from anatomical truth. Just drive your political machine. It looks like loiberals will get the power to "alter" society if the predictions of the upcoming elections woefully bear out. Still, I'll be just fine. You cannot catch immorality accidently.

There you go again with your sex is only for reproduction thing, please I implore you use your supposed great knowledge of anatomy to prove this point, heck while you are at it you can show how anatomy(the actual science) proves how homosexuality is immoral. I can provide you with plenty of links to help you out in this endeavour if you need assistance.

My presentation of human anatomy and physiology shows I passed the classes with a A+. No need to repeat the basics.

Your presentation shows you never took a course in human anatomy and of course physiology is split up so much it can only be said you only have a vague idea of what it is. I have taken a course in human anatomy and I can say for certain that never, not even once was morality or the proper use of any part of the body was ever mentioned. Whenever you mention anatomy you merely reinforce the idea that you have never bothered to even open a book on the subject for fear that it might contradict your preconcieved notions on the subject.

[Cathar1950]

Remember that the rules have been changed so I cannot use the graphic facts to prove my point. Suffice it to say, any good parent doesn't want their children to do what liberals celebrate gays and lesbians do do.

The rules have not changed they are just enforcing them. I see no need for you graphic displays of emotion.

Free will or a congenital birth defect. You only have two choices (actually one). Anatomy and physiology proves that. I can't go any further than that. I have to stay PG-13.

Neither I was thinking of variation.

No one is born through the palm. Again, I'd advise staying away from anatomical truth. Just drive your political machine. It looks like loiberals will get the power to "alter" society if the predictions of the upcoming elections woefully bear out. Still, I'll be just fine. You cannot catch immorality accidently.

But most of us are born with palms and use them even before birth.
I guess you think the fetus and newborns are evil lascivious creatures ruled by Satan.
The immoral is just your politics and emotions at work.

Plaesure can get corrupted into a crime cannot it not?

Maybe? I don’t think that is how crime usually works. Although some have said “I did it for fun”. But we are not talking about crime. We are talking about love between two people of the same sex.

My presentation of human anatomy and physiology shows I passed the classes with a A+. No need to repeat the basics.

Did you go to a school that had inflated grades? I think maybe you went to one of those schools that teach only from the bible.

I think they are watching you for a new sitcom.

[melikio]

My dealings on this website have gotten me noticed by some people that surprised me (friends that is). I use many things offered here in my dealings with youth. It has been very useful. Many decent people have no real idea that some people really do hold some of the views presented here.

All that really supports, is the concept that there are more people who are hateful than we actually know about personally. It also shows that you do spread distortions to children and are stacking more trouble onto existing social problems.

The things you say, 1John, are hateful or easily used as tools of hate. If I were wanting pointers in finding ways to hurt homosexuals, I'd certainly study more carefully the things you have said. I don't really know the arrangement in your heart (only you and God really know), but it is highly possible that the things you have said in this forum reflect your actual beliefs.

I have seen so little in what you say, that would really help a homosexual person (aside from just helping them feel bad about being homosexually-oriented). I mean, what would you say to a discouraged, (celibate) homosexual person, to help them along in life? (I have been that person for most of my life). You see, I know what really helps such a person, but I haven't seen it come in the form of the words you've shared here. I know what helped me in life.

And it is something many political conservatives have done, ignored the full range of people's needs and overall humanity. That stands in stark contrast to Jesus' life and ways. Jesus wasn't a BAD person masquerading as a GOOD one; He was (by all accounts) a supremely GOOD person, FULL of real concern for others because of "love"... not wierdly-motivated because of politics or a pet sin.

I think most people could scan the forum and see where you are coming from, you needn't worry that you are communicating "something", but I think you should be concerned that your view of Christ (the effect of that person) doesn't line up with the "character" described in the Bible.

From all I've read in the Bible, and learned from every other source, including hundreds of sermons, Jesus wouldn't talk the way you do to people or about people; you haven't proven to me that if He were posting here, that people would see your teachings match his.

And for anyone truly wondering, lurking or reading this forum passively, I encourage them to make THAT specific comparison. For it would be hard for me to believe (by your words) that you are kind or compassionate to people (especially homosexuals); and if Coulter's book is such awesome "conservative" reading, then your intense approval of it reinforces my overall reasoning for not being "conservative".

Then again, even though I'm not a "conservative" Christian, I will give Coulter far more props for her ability to say something that makes sense. Although I haven't read her book, I doubt that it would be as simple a task to criticize (in a Christian sense) the things she says, compared to the things I so often see in your posts.

-Mel-

[Cathar1950]

I doubt Ann shares your quasi-Christian views.

I use many things offered here in my dealings with youth.

I think this is a good example of why children need sex education.
If parents let you teach their kids then they are in need of the same education.

[melikio]

I think this is a good example of why children need sex education.

Exactly.

To put it nicely: The existing variances in Christian or religious views, dictates that everyone be taught something more foundational in the universal sense; especially concerning human sexuality.

Otherwise, people's perceptions of "right" and "wrong" will be less than a stone's throw from reasonableness to hatred (concerning homosexuality and other related issues).

Homosexuality is not contagious, and it's not a crime or illness... but that is precisely what some wish to teach that it is.

If the ONLY "problem" was people hating homosexuals, what would "Christians" do about it?

-Mel-

[Grumpy]

Mel

If the ONLY "problem" was people hating homosexuals, what would "Christians" do about it?

And an even more important question would be "What would Jesus do???"

A good way of investigating that would be to look to his words. Jesus, speaking of the judgement of god:

Matthew

25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
25:33 And he shall set the sheep on his right hand, but the goats on the left.
25:34 Then shall the King say unto them on his right hand, Come, ye blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world:
25:35 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me drink: I was a stranger(you know, those different in their beliefs and practices, even the gay people-Grumpy), and ye took me in:
25:36 Naked, and ye clothed me: I was sick, and ye visited me: I was in prison(therefore a sinner-Grumpy), and ye came unto me.
25:37 Then shall the righteous answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, and fed thee? or thirsty, and gave thee drink?
25:38 When saw we thee a stranger, and took thee in? or naked, and clothed thee?
25:39 Or when saw we thee sick, or in prison, and came unto thee?
25:40 And the King shall answer and say unto them, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye have done it unto one of the least of these my brethren, ye have done it unto me.
25:41 Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels:
25:42 For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink:
25:43 I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not.
25:44 Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee?
25:45 Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me.

Were I a Theistic Christian, this would put me in fear for my afterlife if I had treated ANYONE in WORD or in DEED as less than Jesus himself. That is what Christianity truly is. And there is no room in that for hatred, condemnation or bigotry. Of ANYONE. For ANY REASON. PERIOD.

Grumpy