When did a 2nd 70 years/weeks of Daniel 9:24 begin?

[showme]

When did a 2nd 70 years of Daniel 9:24 begin paralleling the first 70 weeks of years?

As there is nothing new under the sun, and “that which has been is that which will be� (Ecc 1:9), when was the start of the 70 weeks before there is an “end of sin�, atonement has been made for iniquity (Hosea 5:11), and the most holy place is anointed (Dan 9:24)? As the “wicked� still thrive, and Ephraim and Judah have yet to acknowledge their guilt (Hosea 5:15), when did the 70 weeks begin, and when will it end? Apparently there are two answers; One starting with the decree of Cyrus, and time, times and half a time later (Daniel 7:25), after 69 1/2 weeks, another start. Apparently, Judah started coming out of the nations starting at the Balfour declaration after WWI, which allowed the Zionist to start coming to Judea around 1918. 50 years later, on the Jubilee of that event, 1948, 70 years ago, the nation of Israel was born, giving a new formal decree for their new home. Using the Holy days as a reference, as to the coming “awesome day of the LORD�, when the son of man was given dominion over “all the peoples, nations , and men of every language� (Daniel 7:13-14). First Daniel 2:35 & 44 must be met, which is to crush all the kingdoms of Daniel 2:35, which would be done in Zechariah 14. The start would be with the Passover Feast of Unleavened Bread, the passing over of the angel of death, when those in Jerusalem and on Zion can escape (Joel 2:32). The end would be the after the feast of trumpets, the repentance of Judah and Ephraim (Hosea 5:15) and the feast of atonement, which is for the forgiveness of sins, and the feast of Booths, whereas, Israel/Ephraim, which is scattered among the nations (Ez 36:24), and after being doubly repaid for their iniquity (Jer 16:18) will be hunted down (Jer 16:16), reunited with the "stick of Judah" (Ez 37:15-25) and brought back to the land of Jacob (Ze 37:1-25), and have one shepherd/king (Ez 37:24) & (Ez 34:23-24).

New American Standard Bible Daniel 9:24
"Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to make an end of sin, to make atonement for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy place.


New American Standard Bible Ecclesiastes 1:9
That which has been is that which will be, And that which has been done is that which will be done. So there is nothing new under the sun.

[JehovahsWitness]

If you choose the first command by Cyrus in 539 BC and take away 483 years away, we come to 56 BC.
WHAT HAPPENED IN 56 BC? NOTHING THAT CONCERN JESUS.

Yes, nothing of note, so the above must be wrong.

If we choose the second command by Artaxexes in 457 BC and take away the 483 years, we come to 27 AD.

Except that Artexertes made no such decree in 457 and Jesus wasn't baptised in 27 CE - so this also must be wrong.

Now, what happens if we count 483 years from 455 BCE?

JW



1 "week" = 7 years
69 "weeks" (7 x 69) = 483 years


FURTHER READING
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1200003915#h=8

[Pipiripi]

My problem is that I don't have a computer yet to show you how all is fit together and it is so long to write over.

[Mithrae]

If we choose the second command by Artaxexes in 457 BC and take away the 483 years, we come to 27 AD.

Except that Artexertes made no such decree in 457 and Jesus wasn't baptised in 27 CE - so this also must be wrong.

Now, what happens if we count 483 years from 455 BCE?

Artaxerxes made no such decree in 455BCE either; the 20th year of his reign would have been around 445.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artaxerxes_I_of_Persia

Nor did it take 49 years for Nehemiah to complete his task: The wall - the primary focus of his mission and the only reason this date might be a reasonable alternative to the decree of Cyrus - was completed in 52 days (Neh. 6:13) and Nehemiah returned to the king within twelve years (Neh. 13:6).

[JehovahsWitness]

Now, what happens if we count 483 years from 455 BCE?

Artaxerxes made no such decree in 455BCE either; the 20th year of his reign would have been around 445.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artaxerxes_I_of_Persia

There is some disagreement in historical writings with regard to the reigns of Xerxes and of Artaxerxes. Many reference works place Artaxerxes’ accession year in 465 BCE, however is strong evidence for calculating the last year of Xerxes and the accession year of Artaxerxes as being 475 B.C.E. The evidence is threefold: from Greek sources, from Persian sources, and from Babylonian sources.

Evidence from Greek sources.

• An event in Greek history can help us determine when Artaxerxes began ruling. Greek statesman and military hero Themistocles fell into disfavor with his countrymen and fled for safety to Persia. According to Greek historian Thucydides (I, CXXXVII, 3), who has gained fame for his accuracy, at that time Themistocles “sent on a letter to King Artaxerxes son of Xerxes, who had lately come to the throne.â€� Plutarch’s Lives (Themistocles, XXVII, 1) gives the information that “Thucydides and Charon of Lampsacus relate that Xerxes was dead, and that it was his son Artaxerxes with whom Themistocles had his interview.â€� Charon was a Persian subject who lived through the change of rulership from Xerxes to Artaxerxes. From the testimonies of Thucydides and of Charon of Lampsacus, we can see that when Themistocles arrived in Persia, Artaxerxes had recently begun ruling.
  
  We can establish the time when Artaxerxes began ruling by calculating back from when Themistocles died. Not all reference books give the same date for his death. However, historian Diodorus Siculus (Diodorus of Sicily, XI, 54, 1; XI, 58, 3) relates his death in an account of things that happened “when Praxiergus was archon in Athens.� Praxiergus was archon in Athens in 471/470 B.C.E. (Greek and Roman Chronology, by Alan E. Samuel, Munich, 1972, p. 206) According to Thucydides, Themistocles’ arrival in Persia was followed by a year of language study in preparation for an audience with Artaxerxes. Thereafter the king granted him settlement in Persia with many honors. If Themistocles died in 471/470 B.C.E., his settlement in Persia must have been not later than 472 B.C.E. and his arrival a year earlier, in 473 B.C.E. At that time Artaxerxes “had lately come to the throne.�
  
  Concerning the time when Xerxes died and Artaxerxes ascended the throne, M. de Koutorga wrote: “We have seen that, according to the chronology of Thucydides, Xerxes died towards the end of the year 475 B.C.E., and that, according to the same historian, Themistocles arrived in Asia Minor shortly after the coming to the throne of Artaxerxes Longimanus.�​—Mémoires présentés par divers savants à l’Académie des Inscriptions et Belles-Lettres de l’Institut Impérial de France, first series, Vol. VI, second part, Paris, 1864, p. 147.
  
  As further support of this, E. Levesque noted the following: “Therefore it is necessary, according to the Alexandrian Chronicle, to place Xerxes’ death in 475 B.C.E., after eleven years of reign. The historian Justin, III, 1, confirms this chronicle and the assertions of Thucydides. According to him, at the time of Xerxes’ murder, Artaxerxes, his son, was but a child, puer [a boy], which is true if Xerxes died in 475. Artaxerxes was then 16 years old, whereas in 465 he would have been twenty-six years old, which would not justify anymore Justin’s expression. According to this chronology, since Artaxerxes began to reign in 475, the 20th year of his reign proves to be in 455 and not in 445 as it is said quite commonly.�​—Revue apologétique, Paris, Vol. 68, 1939, p. 94.
  
  If Darius died in 486 B.C.E. and Xerxes died in 475 B.C.E., how could it be explained that some ancient documents allot to Xerxes a reign of 21 years? It is well known that a king and his son might rule together in a double kingship, or coregency. If this was the case with Darius and Xerxes, historians could count the years of Xerxes’ reign either from the start of a coregency with his father or from his father’s death. If Xerxes ruled 10 years with his father and 11 years by himself, some sources could attribute to him 21 years of rulership, while others might give him 11 years.
  
  There is solid evidence for a coregency of Xerxes with his father Darius. The Greek historian Herodotus (VII, 3) says: “Darius judged his [Xerxes’] plea [for kingship] to be just and declared him king. But to my thinking Xerxes would have been made king even without this advice.� This indicates that Xerxes was made king during the reign of his father Darius.

Evidence from Persian sources.

• A coregency of Xerxes with Darius can be seen especially from Persian bas-reliefs that have come to light. In Persepolis several bas-reliefs have been found that represent Xerxes standing behind his father’s throne, dressed in clothing identical to his father’s and with his head on the same level. This is unusual, since ordinarily the king’s head would be higher than all others. In A New Inscription of Xerxes From Persepolis (by Ernst E. Herzfeld, 1932) it is noted that both inscriptions and buildings found in Persepolis imply a coregency of Xerxes with his father Darius. On page 8 of his work Herzfeld wrote: “The peculiar tenor of Xerxes’ inscriptions at Persepolis, most of which do not distinguish between his own activity and that of his father, and the relation, just as peculiar, of their buildings, which it is impossible to allocate to either Darius or Xerxes individually, have always implied a kind of coregency of Xerxes. Moreover, two sculptures at Persepolis illustrate that relation.â€� With reference to one of these sculptures, Herzfeld pointed out: “Darius is represented, wearing all the royal attributes, enthroned on a high couch-platform supported by representatives of the various nations of his empire. Behind him in the relief, that is, in reality at his right, stands Xerxes with the same royal attributes, his left hand resting on the high back of the throne. That is a gesture that speaks clearly of more than mere successorship; it means coregency.â€�
  
  As to a date for reliefs depicting Darius and Xerxes in that way, in Achaemenid Sculpture (Istanbul, 1974, p. 53), Ann Farkas states that “the reliefs might have been installed in the Treasury sometime during the building of the first addition, 494/493–492/491 B.C.; this certainly would have been the most convenient time to move such unwieldy pieces of stone. But whatever their date of removal to the Treasury, the sculptures were perhaps carved in the 490’s.�

Evidence from Babylonian sources.

• Evidence for Xerxes beginning a coregency with his father during the 490’s B.C.E. has been found at Babylon. Excavations there have unearthed a palace for Xerxes completed in 496 B.C.E. In this regard, A. T. Olmstead wrote in History of the Persian Empire (p. 215): “By October 23, 498, we learn that the house of the king’s son [that is, of Darius’ son, Xerxes] was in process of erection at Babylon; no doubt this is the Darius palace in the central section that we have already described. Two years later [in 496 B.C.E.], in a business document from near-by Borsippa, we have reference to the ‘new palace’ as already completed.â€�
  
  Two unusual clay tablets may bear additional testimony to the coregency of Xerxes with Darius. One is a business text about hire of a building in the accession year of Xerxes. The tablet is dated in the first month of the year, Nisan. (A Catalogue of the Late Babylonian Tablets in the Bodleian Library, Oxford, by R. Campbell Thompson, London, 1927, p. 13, tablet designated A. 124) Another tablet bears the date “month of Ab(?), accession year of Xerxes.� Remarkably, this latter tablet does not attribute to Xerxes the title “king of Babylon, king of lands,� which was usual at that time.​—Neubabylonische Rechts- und Verwaltungsurkunden übersetzt und erläutert, by M. San Nicolò and A. Ungnad, Leipzig, 1934, Vol. I, part 4, p. 544, tablet No. 634, designated VAT 4397.
  
  These two tablets are puzzling. Ordinarily a king’s accession year begins after the death of his predecessor. However, there is evidence that Xerxes’ predecessor (Darius) lived until the seventh month of his final year, whereas these two documents from the accession year of Xerxes bear dates prior to the seventh month (one has the first month, the other the fifth). Therefore these documents do not relate to an accession period of Xerxes following the death of his father but indicate an accession year during his coregency with Darius. If that accession year was in 496 B.C.E., when the palace at Babylon for Xerxes had been completed, his first year as coregent would begin the following Nisan, in 495 B.C.E., and his 21st and final year would start in 475 B.C.E. In that case, Xerxes’ reign included 10 years of rule with Darius (from 496 to 486 B.C.E.) and 11 years of kingship by himself (from 486 to 475 B.C.E.).
  
  On the other hand, historians are unanimous that the first regnal year of Darius II began in spring of 423 B.C.E. One Babylonian tablet indicates that in his accession year Darius II was already on the throne by the 4th day of the 11th month, that is, February 13, 423 B.C.E. (Babylonian Chronology, 626 B.C.–A.D. 75, by R. Parker and W. H. Dubberstein, 1971, p. 18) However, two tablets show that Artaxerxes continued to rule after the 11th month, the 4th day, of his 41st year. One is dated to the 11th month, the 17th day, of his 41st year. (p. 18) The other one is dated to the 12th month of his 41st year. (Old Testament and Semitic Studies, edited by Harper, Brown, and Moore, 1908, Vol. 1, p. 304, tablet No. 12, designated CBM, 5505) Therefore Artaxerxes was not succeeded in his 41st regnal year but ruled through its entirety. This indicates that Artaxerxes must have ruled more than 41 years and that his first regnal year therefore should not be counted as beginning in 464 B.C.E.
  
  Evidence that Artaxerxes Longimanus ruled beyond his 41st year is found in a business document from Borsippa that is dated to the 50th year of Artaxerxes. (Catalogue of the Babylonian Tablets in the British Museum, Vol. VII: Tablets From Sippar 2, by E. Leichty and A. K. Grayson, 1987, p. 153; tablet designated B. M. 65494) One of the tablets connecting the end of Artaxerxes’ reign and the beginning of the reign of Darius II has the following date: “51st year, accession year, 12th month, day 20, Darius, king of lands.� (The Babylonian Expedition of the University of Pennsylvania, Series A: Cuneiform Texts, Vol. VIII, Part I, by Albert T. Clay, 1908, pp. 34, 83, and Plate 57, Tablet No. 127, designated CBM 12803) Since the first regnal year of Darius II was in 423 B.C.E., it means that the 51st year of Artaxerxes was in 424 B.C.E. and his first regnal year was in 474 B.C.E.

SOURCE Insight on The Scriptures Vol II p. 614
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1200003447#h=21

Therefore, testimonies from Greek, Persian, and Babylonian sources agree that Artaxerxes’ accession year was 475 B.C.E. and his first regnal year was 474 B.C.E. That places the 20th year of Artaxerxes, [...] in 455 B.C.E.

[JehovahsWitness]

Nor did it take 49 years for Nehemiah to complete his task: The wall - the primary focus of his mission and the only reason this date might be a reasonable alternative to the decree of Cyrus - was completed in 52 days (Neh. 6:13)

DANIEL 9: 25
From the issuing of the word to restore and to rebuild Jerusalem until Messiah the Leader, there will be 7 weeks, also 62 weeks.

The main focus of the prophecy was not when the project would be completed but when it would start. The prophecy has the issuing of permission as a starting point (455 see details post #14 above) and counts forward in time to the advent of the Messiah. The parenthesis of "7 weeks" may well indicate that the entire project (which was not to simply rebuilt the walls but to rebuild the entire city "Jerusalem") would take many decades. Although the walls were complete in 52 days, it evendenly took another 49 years for all structures and habitations within the city to be completed.

Nehemiah returned to the king within twelve years (Neh. 13:6).

Nehemiah himself is not specifically mentioned in the prophecy nor does his presence have any direct bearing on the periods described (in short even if he had sent permission by courrier and never himself visited Jeruselmen, nothing would have changed).

The fact that he was not present for the entire project is essentially irrelevant.



JW

[Pipiripi]

If we choose the second command by Artaxexes in 457 BC and take away the 483 years, we come to 27 AD.

Except that Artexertes made no such decree in 457 and Jesus wasn't baptised in 27 CE - so this also must be wrong.

Now, what happens if we count 483 years from 455 BCE?

Artaxerxes made no such decree in 455BCE either; the 20th year of his reign would have been around 445.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artaxerxes_I_of_Persia

Nor did it take 49 years for Nehemiah to complete his task: The wall - the primary focus of his mission and the only reason this date might be a reasonable alternative to the decree of Cyrus - was completed in 52 days (Neh. 6:13) and Nehemiah returned to the king within twelve years (Neh. 13:6).

This study is very long for me to write it over. I will see how can I used part of the Bible and let you see. To much for me to write it over.

[showme]

If you choose the first command by Cyrus in 539 BC and take away 483 years away, we come to 56 BC.
WHAT HAPPENED IN 56 BC? NOTHING THAT CONCERN JESUS.

Yes, nothing of note, so the above must be wrong.

If we choose the second command by Artaxexes in 457 BC and take away the 483 years, we come to 27 AD.

Except that Artexertes made no such decree in 457 and Jesus wasn't baptised in 27 CE - so this also must be wrong.

Now, what happens if we count 483 years from 455 BCE?

JW



1 "week" = 7 years
69 "weeks" (7 x 69) = 483 years


FURTHER READING
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1200003915#h=8

[TripleZ]

When did a 2nd 70 years of Daniel 9:24 begin paralleling the first 70 weeks of years?

As there is nothing new under the sun, and “that which has been is that which will be� (Ecc 1:9), when was the start of the 70 weeks before there is an “end of sin�, atonement has been made for iniquity (Hosea 5:11), and the most holy place is anointed (Dan 9:24)? As the “wicked� still thrive, and Ephraim and Judah have yet to acknowledge their guilt (Hosea 5:15), when did the 70 weeks begin, and when will it end? Apparently there are two answers; One starting with the decree of Cyrus, and time, times and half a time later (Daniel 7:25), after 69 1/2 weeks, another start. Apparently, Judah started coming out of the nations starting at the Balfour declaration after WWI, which allowed the Zionist to start coming to Judea around 1918. 50 years later, on the Jubilee of that event, 1948, 70 years ago, the nation of Israel was born, giving a new formal decree for their new home. Using the Holy days as a reference, as to the coming “awesome day of the LORD�, when the son of man was given dominion over “all the peoples, nations , and men of every language� (Daniel 7:13-14). First Daniel 2:35 & 44 must be met, which is to crush all the kingdoms of Daniel 2:35, which would be done in Zechariah 14. The start would be with the Passover Feast of Unleavened Bread, the passing over of the angel of death, when those in Jerusalem and on Zion can escape (Joel 2:32). The end would be the after the feast of trumpets, the repentance of Judah and Ephraim (Hosea 5:15) and the feast of atonement, which is for the forgiveness of sins, and the feast of Booths, whereas, Israel/Ephraim, which is scattered among the nations (Ez 36:24), and after being doubly repaid for their iniquity (Jer 16:18) will be hunted down (Jer 16:16), reunited with the "stick of Judah" (Ez 37:15-25) and brought back to the land of Jacob (Ze 37:1-25), and have one shepherd/king (Ez 37:24) & (Ez 34:23-24).

New American Standard Bible Daniel 9:24
"Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and your holy city, to finish the transgression, to make an end of sin, to make atonement for iniquity, to bring in everlasting righteousness, to seal up vision and prophecy and to anoint the most holy place.


New American Standard Bible Ecclesiastes 1:9
That which has been is that which will be, And that which has been done is that which will be done. So there is nothing new under the sun.

The 70 years of Jeremiah 29:10-14 which were, are again. Judah, as the nation of Israel, has been living among the nations for 70 years. Now the "son of man" will crush all the nations, and rule them (Daniel 7:13-14). Now it is time for Ephraim/the house of Israel to return (Ez 36:22-24).

Jeremiah 29:10“For thus says the LORD, ‘When seventy years have been completed for Babylon, I will visit you and fulfill My good word to you, to bring you back to this place. 11‘For I know the plans that I have for you,’ declares the LORD, ‘plans for welfare and not for calamity to give you a future and a hope. 12‘Then you will call upon Me and come and pray to Me, and I will listen to you. 13‘You will seek Me and find Me when you search for Me with all your heart. 14‘I will be found by you,’ declares the LORD, ‘and I will restore your fortunes and will gather you from all the nations and from all the places where I have driven you,’ declares the LORD, ‘and I will bring you back to the place from where I sent you into exile.’

and what of the sixty two weeks ? and when did the first 70 weeks start and or end ?

Dan 9:23 At the beginning of your prayers, an answer was given; and I have come to say what it is; because you are greatly loved. Therefore look into this answer, and understand the vision.
Dan 9:24 "Seventy weeks have been decreed for your people and for your holy city for putting an end to the transgression, for making an end of sin, for forgiving iniquity, for bringing in everlasting justice, for setting the seal on vision and prophet, and for anointing the Especially Holy Place.
Dan 9:25 Know, therefore, and discern that seven weeks [of years] will elapse between the issuing of the decree to restore and rebuild Yerushalayim until an anointed prince comes. It will remain built for sixty-two weeks [of years], with open spaces and moats; but these will be troubled times.
Dan 9:26 Then, after the sixty-two weeks, Mashiach will be cut off and have nothing. The people of a prince yet to come will destroy the city and the sanctuary, but his end will come with a flood, and desolations are decreed until the war is over.
Dan 9:27 He will make a strong covenant with leaders for one week [of years]. For half of the week he will put a stop to the sacrifice and the grain offering. On the wing of detestable things the desolator will come and continue until the already decreed destruction is poured out on the desolator."

[TripleZ]

The 70 years of prophecy in Daniel begin at 457 BC - Ezra 7-13,20 and ended at 27 AD When JESUS baptized.

Close, but not quite. Ezra 7:13, 20 is regarding Cyrus' decree to rebuild the TEMPLE (Jehovah's "house") not Jerusalem and that was in any case in 537 BCE.

The order to {quote} "restore and rebuild Jerusalem" would happen in the days of Nehemiah (see Neh 2:1, 5).



1 "week" = 7 years
7 weeks (7 x 7) = 49 years
70 "weeks" (7 x 70) = 490 years


FURTHER READING
https://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/1200003915#h=8

btw, you have missed great deal, the topic includes the restoring/rebuilding of the Temple, which at the moment is held by Islam..We now see the world heading towards israel's return to power in the Middle East. Jews from all over the world are sending money to Israel week by week, year after year and they are doing military service also. They return to Israel and then back to their home Nations..Israel is rising up again as Gods word has told us it will.
The Temple will be restored, because, how can the man of lawlessness enter into a non existence Temple ?

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 18 by TripleZ]

Daniel 9:24-27 makes no mention of the temple.

It alludes to the Messiah.