Jackpot: the probability of the prophecy.

Tart · Post by **Tart** » Mon Apr 02, 2018 10:37 pm

We see it all the time.. Nonbelievers say that the prophecies are so vague, that they are self fulfilling... They say that "of course that prophecy was going to be fulfilled"...

Yet a mathematician actually calculated, like a Powerball Jackpot, how likely it was that the prophecies of Messiah would be fulfilled....

You can watch the first 10 minutes of this video to understand the methods these calculations were made.

Turns out that these "vague" and "self fulfilling" prophecy, have the odds of less then any jockpot ever invented...

Whats the probability of a man actually fulfilling the prophecies of the Messiah? Its 1 in trillion*trillion*trillion*trillion*trillion.. Less then that... Its essentially 0

For ANY man to fulfill the prophecy of the Messiah.. The odds tells us, these prophecies (that were proven to be written pre-Jesus: Dead Sea Scrolls), should have just died off with impossible odds...

And then Jesus, and even his historically accepted rolls, tell us Jesus hit that jackpot... He is the Messiah...

So what does that Mathematician conclude.
""Any man who rejects Christ as the Son of God is rejecting a fact proved perhaps more absolutely than any other fact in the world."~Peter Stoner

But dont trust me, I challenge any atheist, to study every prophecy... Every single one... And try to make sense of them all in its entirety.. Come back, and share with us a coherent explanation of how you make sense out of the entire picture... Not just one prophecy you pick apart... Make sense of them all...

FarWanderer · Post by **FarWanderer** » Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:08 am

Tart wrote:
FarWanderer wrote: [Replying to post 56 by Tart]

Matthew was written after 70 A.D.

Funny, that.
Ya perhaps that's true... The older gospel is mark though, has the same prophecy in it...

Which also may have been written after the temple was destroyed. And if not, it was almost certainly written after the rebellion started and a Roman response was already in motion.

Tart wrote:But so you think they made up the prophecy, fabricated Jesus saying it, after the Romans destroyed the temple in 70ad?

It's likely. Or it was an educated guess made after the rebellion started. It's so vague that it could never be proven false, anyway.

By the way, "fabrication" is not necessarily lying. People "remember" incorrect details all the time, even just minutes after they happen (any psychologist will tell you this). Mark is writing DECADES after the events and already considers Jesus to be the Messiah. Naturally, he'll "remember" details in such a way to affirm that belief.

FarWanderer · Post by **FarWanderer** » Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:16 am

Tart wrote:
rikuoamero wrote:Also...what about what is called the Wailing Wall? Re-read what Jesus says in Matthew 24 and Luke 21. "Not one stone". Given that we have an entire wall still left over...seems to me Jesus's prediction did not come true.
That is like an infinite regress, a fallacy... For every prophecy, ever, there is going to be a specific limited amount of predicted knowledge conveyed in the prophecy.. Just like there would be a specific amount of knowledge for every sentence, or book, ever written...

"Not one stone" is awfully precise. If it's not literally true then why say it at all? It's theatrical hyperbole at best.

rikuoamero · Post by **rikuoamero** » Mon Apr 16, 2018 2:54 am

[Replying to post 60 by Tart]

For every prophecy, ever, there is going to be a specific limited amount of predicted knowledge conveyed in the prophecy

Which would have to be correct. Which would have to be specific. If I predict that one day a nation will fall...do you say I have made a prophecy if twenty years later, the country of {Insert Country Here} does indeed fall?
No. What I said was so incredibly vague and broad that I stand virtually no chance of being wrong. After all, in Matthew Jesus says something like "You will hear about war and rumours of war". Wow...no-one human could ever have figured that out! Only a GOD could have known that!

So I want you to analyze the prophecy from Matthew/Luke and tell me what it is Jesus predicted would happen.
As far as I can see, he predicts that the Temple would be destroyed, and every stone cast down.
He got one part wrong.

Astonishingly, that prophecy also didnt predict the street address you would live on

That prophecy doesn't in any way shape or form have anything to do with what street I lived on.
But tell me...imagine if Jesus HAD given a prophecy like that. He predicts that "Tart would live at this address"...only for you to never actually be there throughout your life...would you still call that a prophecy?
Seems to me you would, tart. After all, we have you citing the destruction of the second temple prophecy where Jesus says not one stone, only for you to completely ignore the Wailing Wall's continued existence.

It looks to me like you'll believe things are prophecies even if they get things completely wrong, even if what happens in actual history doesn't line up with what they predict.

OnceConvinced · Post by **OnceConvinced** » Mon Apr 16, 2018 4:49 pm

Tart wrote: This is good though, we are figuring things out... That is why i love studying the Bible, because you can stumble upon truth after truth, prophecy after prophecy... Its why i read it ever day... This is true knowledge, you could study the for the rest of your life, and continue to be amazed at the very next verse... Because the Bible is reliable, and continues to give answers for doubts...

I have found the bible to be completely unreliable actually. 40 years studying it and still studying it to a certain extent... 40 years of living it and following it's advice.... has shown to me it can't be relied upon. It's promises, assurances and advice can't be relied upon.

I wonder how many years you have lived it and studied it, Tart?

Post by **otseng** » Mon Apr 16, 2018 8:41 pm

Tart wrote: I think its a bit insane of you to suggest this thing is just a normal occurrence...

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Tart · Post by **Tart** » Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:17 pm

OnceConvinced wrote:
Tart wrote: This is good though, we are figuring things out... That is why i love studying the Bible, because you can stumble upon truth after truth, prophecy after prophecy... Its why i read it ever day... This is true knowledge, you could study the for the rest of your life, and continue to be amazed at the very next verse... Because the Bible is reliable, and continues to give answers for doubts...
I have found the bible to be completely unreliable actually. 40 years studying it and still studying it to a certain extent... 40 years of living it and following it's advice.... has shown to me it can't be relied upon. It's promises, assurances and advice can't be relied upon.

I wonder how many years you have lived it and studied it, Tart?

Surely that doesnt matter in logic... Right?