Was Christ intelligent?

[marco]

Some might suppose that Jesus was more intelligent than any other human. Some might say he was a very simple man with simple tastes.

There is no evidence, as I see it, that Jesus pondered science while someone like Lucretius, born a century before Jesus, was able to talk of atoms and the void. Jesus gave no hint that he pondered the beginnings of life; his statements are very simple and do show a study of Scripture and little else. When he does move to secular matters he seems to be on shaky ground - as with the mustard seed.

Would we expect Jesus to be highly intelligent?
Is there evidence to show he was among the intelligent men of history?

[1213]

...Is there evidence to show he was among the intelligent men of history?

I think his teachings are super intelligent. But unfortunately, it seems to be just matter of opinions, what is intelligent. We probably think differently on what is really intelligent.

[steveb1]

[Replying to marco]

There are several types of intelligence. Jesus's was not "scientific" but rather "soulful" and spiritual. His aim was the transformation of the spirit, not the exploration of the universe. His Ultimate was not nature or the cosmos, but rather his own conception and claimed experience of his heavenly Father, and his mission was to be the agent of the Father's in-breaking Kingdom. It was in the metaphysical, transcendental realm that Jesus's intelligence operated.

His quips, comebacks, and his way of reversing intellectual traps and springing them on foes hints at a very sharp, alert intelligence that was able to successfully deal with a variety of circumstances, some of them potentially lethal to Jesus.

[Inigo Montoya]

Would we expect Jesus to be highly intelligent?
Is there evidence to show he was among the intelligent men of history?

Certainly if Jesus had some connection with the creator of the cosmos, something beyond a passing nod, we should absolutely expect him to be quite brilliant on matters apart from Jewish scripture. Of course you'll instead hear that he wasn't on Earth to teach us maths and science and biology and astronomy, but rather to show the dim folk how to get to heaven.

As far as evidence, there's arguably none that give us any idea at all what the man might have been like. The "historical biographies" are dubious, at best, regarding authorship that can be said to even know the lad, and likely only rehash what Christian communities were telling each other about him at the time.

We really have no idea who he might have been and how bright he was.

I didn't see Steve's post when I was responding, but would like to say these "quips and comebacks and traps" are part of a narrative written by folk we have no way of knowing even knew the guy. It's like giving William Wallace credit for the inspiring pre-battle speeches in Braveheart because Mel Gibson wrote them for the character.

[steveb1]

Would we expect Jesus to be highly intelligent?
Is there evidence to show he was among the intelligent men of history?

Certainly if Jesus had some connection with the creator of the cosmos, something beyond a passing nod, we should absolutely expect him to be quite brilliant on matters apart from Jewish scripture. Of course you'll instead hear that he wasn't on Earth to teach us maths and science and biology and astronomy, but rather to show the dim folk how to get to heaven.

As far as evidence, there's arguably none that give us any idea at all what the man might have been like. The "historical biographies" are dubious, at best, regarding authorship that can be said to even know the lad, and likely only rehash what Christian communities were telling each other about him at the time.

We really have no idea who he might have been and how bright he was.

I didn't see Steve's post when I was responding, but would like to say these "quips and comebacks and traps" are part of a narrative written by folk we have no way of knowing even knew the guy. It's like giving William Wallace credit for the inspiring pre-battle speeches in Braveheart because Mel Gibson wrote them for the character.

[Elijah John]

Would we expect Jesus to be highly intelligent?
Is there evidence to show he was among the intelligent men of history?

Regarding the first question, yes and steveb1 makes a good case that he was.

One of the most intelligent in history? No evidence he was that. Certainly not regarding the natural world of the sciences, such as they were in his day and age.

But that was not his focus, or his mission.

Now if Jesus were actually "God Incarnate" could we reasonably have expected him to show evidence of shining in every sphere of knowledge?

Yes, I think so. And the fact that he didn't can be seen as even more evidence that Jesus was not God.

The fact that "Jesus" seems to have seen himself in the Psalms, says to me that there were limits to his knowledge of his own Scriptural tradition as well.

Or it's evidence that NT propagandists put words on Jesus lips to make him appear to conform to OT "prophecy".

[steveb1]

Would we expect Jesus to be highly intelligent?
Is there evidence to show he was among the intelligent men of history?

Certainly if Jesus had some connection with the creator of the cosmos, something beyond a passing nod, we should absolutely expect him to be quite brilliant on matters apart from Jewish scripture. Of course you'll instead hear that he wasn't on Earth to teach us maths and science and biology and astronomy, but rather to show the dim folk how to get to heaven.

As far as evidence, there's arguably none that give us any idea at all what the man might have been like. The "historical biographies" are dubious, at best, regarding authorship that can be said to even know the lad, and likely only rehash what Christian communities were telling each other about him at the time.

We really have no idea who he might have been and how bright he was.

I didn't see Steve's post when I was responding, but would like to say these "quips and comebacks and traps" are part of a narrative written by folk we have no way of knowing even knew the guy. It's like giving William Wallace credit for the inspiring pre-battle speeches in Braveheart because Mel Gibson wrote them for the character.

I'm a Christ mythicist, but I was addressing the post from the historicist POV.

Intelligence is not always scientific. There is no reason to think that Jesus, as a member of a pre-scientific society, would be disseminating scientific information. As the Christian "God the Son" he might be expected to, but of course, Jesus made no such Trinitarian claims about himself. I see him as an enlightened mystic and sage, not "God". I believe the following was written by the late John Sanders, and it explains why Jesus's message, although non-scientific, is nonetheless a timeless one:

"Jesus' personality and teachings are unique and not historically conditioned because they do not stem from [an external] human source, but are rooted in his consciousness of the inner world through which comes his awareness of the holy God whom the prophets before him had known in the past.

The beauty of the teachings of Jesus is that they do not depend upon any system of thought, for Jesus did not express himself by means of jargon or concepts, but by means of living images, figures, and parables. In this way he succeeded in freeing his message from history and making it timeless and applicable to all ages. His teachings do not come from man's conceptualized and historically conditioned world, but are drawn from the well of life itself.

...the parables...make their points by drawing upon images from the storehouse of the human soul... Jesus' teaching[s] are not conceptualized statements, but images in which we may see our own selves reflected. It is for this reason that his parables and sayings speak to the human condition right now as they did to the men of his own time."

[bluethread]

All of those things that modern scientific types think He should have spoken about, would have been of little use to the people of the time, if they had even been interested. What He did speak to were the core values and social structures of the time. The accounts, if you consider them to be accurate, do show Him having a firm grasp on those things.

[imhereforyou]

Some might suppose that Jesus was more intelligent than any other human. Some might say he was a very simple man with simple tastes.

There is no evidence, as I see it, that Jesus pondered science while someone like Lucretius, born a century before Jesus, was able to talk of atoms and the void. Jesus gave no hint that he pondered the beginnings of life; his statements are very simple and do show a study of Scripture and little else. When he does move to secular matters he seems to be on shaky ground - as with the mustard seed.

Would we expect Jesus to be highly intelligent?
Is there evidence to show he was among the intelligent men of history?

I think it depends on what we mean by 'intelligent'. Did he think about chemical reactions or talk about quasars? Not that I can see. Was he smart enough to make it through his society? That's debatable since he didn't live very long (though many claim that was his destiny and/or choice) but he did seem to say thought provoking things (if we choose to believe his verbiage as it's written).
There's no way of knowing but if one thinks he's God, then he must know everything there is to know so he'd have to be beyond intelligent.
Best we can honestly say is "?".

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 1 by marco]

Intelligence is in the eye of the beholder.

I suspect all the atheists will say that Jesus was a complete moron that could barely tie his own sandal laces whose stupidity got him killed (... and never existed)

I'm a Christian and believe (based on my interpretation of certain bible passages) that Christ had a prehuman existence, which included playing an active role in the creation of the universe with an intellect and memory that encompassed all that this would mean. And that as an adult he had access to all this information.

So you can perhaps guess which position I hold.

JOHN 7:15
The Jews were amazed and asked, "How did this man attain such learning without having studied?"

JW