To hell or not to hell?

[William]

For some folk, the idea of some people just dying and that is the end of it, is good enough justice.
For others, they go to the other extreme.

What do you think would be actual good justice and why you think that is the case.

[1213]

For some folk, the idea of some people just dying and that is the end of it, is good enough justice.
For others, they go to the other extreme.

What do you think would be actual good justice and why you think that is the case.

Bible tells hell is a place where soul and body are destroyed. And that is for those who are unrighteous.

These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.
Mat. 25:46

For the wages of sin is death, but the free gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6:23

And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell.
Matt. 10:28

I think that is good and just. Reason for that is, if unrighteous would live forever, he would make life eternal suffering for all.

[JehovahsWitness]

[Replying to post 1 by William]

I'm against all forms of torture; I think death (non-existence), not torture, should be the ultimate price one pays for evil. Some people's behaviour is so evil that they forfeit their right to be alive, pure and simple. Keeping someone alive only to torture them however is the sign of a sadistic psychopath. Keeping someone alive only to torture them forever is the sign of an eternally sadistic psychopath. Someone that admires and justifies the behaviour of a sadistic pyscopath that tortures his victims is in my opinion either himself sadistic or ... extremely religious.






RELATED POSTS

Is "hell" just?
http://debatingchristianity.com/forum/v ... 948#843948


FURTHER READING

HELL: The Lie That Made God Cruel
https://www.jw.org/en/publications/maga ... ruel-hell/

[William]

[Replying to post 2 by 1213]

Bible tells hell is a place where soul and body are destroyed. And that is for those who are unrighteous.

So you are saying that hell is just something which describes a process where individuals are annihilated, not where they suffer a torturous fate forever?

I think that is good and just. Reason for that is, if unrighteous would live forever, he would make life eternal suffering for all.

But if he were kept in a fiery torment forever, as some people believe will be the case, then he would not be able to make life eternal suffering for all.

[William]

[Replying to post 3 by JehovahsWitness]

I'm against all forms of torture; I think death (non-existence), not torture, should be the ultimate price one pays for evil. Some people's behaviour is so evil that they forfeit their right to be alive, pure and simple. Keeping someone alive only to torture them however is the sign of a sadistic psychopath. Keeping someone alive only to torture them forever is the sign of an eternally sadistic psychopath. Someone that admires and justifies the behaviour of a sadistic pyscopath that tortures his victims is in my opinion either himself sadistic or ... extremely religious.

What if it wasn't a case of anyone being ordered to hell, but a case of people deeming themselves worthy of that punishment and creating it for themselves?

What if the proces of freedom of choice doesn't stop at the boarder of life and afterlife?

What if the whole process was a means to an end and the idea was to bring an entity and all its lost children back from the realm of psychosis and the darkness of ignorance and hellp it to heall from the afflictions it put on itself and it's children?

What if there is no such thing as death and no one had a choice in the matter?
That would mean that your idea of the 'ultimate price' couldn't happen.
How would that make you feel?
How would the evil be contained so that it did not infect the good?
Wouldn't it have to first be exposed?
What if this process exposed evil to itself and the properties of the afterlife allowed for this to happen?

Wouldn't that be a good form of justice?

And what if the judgement individuals (children of the entity) imposed upon themselves, was not permanent but simple reflected the nature of their expressed evil or good works and that they were not left completely to their own self induced fate but good individuals who had long since gone through similar processes and healed, were working together to help these unfortunates heal and be whole again?

[Jagella]

For some folk, the idea of some people just dying and that is the end of it, is good enough justice.
For others, they go to the other extreme.

What do you think would be actual good justice and why you think that is the case.

True justice to me is fair play. I don't see how hurting wrong doers is true fair play. I think that we should not punish evil-doers. We should only protect innocent people from them.

[Jagella]

[Replying to post 1 by William]

I'm against all forms of torture; I think death (non-existence), not torture, should be the ultimate price one pays for evil. Some people's behaviour is so evil that they forfeit their right to be alive, pure and simple. Keeping someone alive only to torture them however is the sign of a sadistic psychopath. Keeping someone alive only to torture them forever is the sign of an eternally sadistic psychopath. Someone that admires and justifies the behaviour of a sadistic pyscopath that tortures his victims is in my opinion either himself sadistic or ... extremely religious.

You really need to have a talk with Jehovah, then. In Revelation 9:1-11 he tortures people for five months with stinging locusts. The torment is so bad that Jehovah's victims will long to die. As you say, anybody who would torture people this way is a sadistic psychopath.

[DPMartin]

For some folk, the idea of some people just dying and that is the end of it, is good enough justice.
For others, they go to the other extreme.

What do you think would be actual good justice and why you think that is the case.

doesn't matter what you or I think would be actual good justice or why, we don't make that call, nor does anything we think is going to change it.


but from the Kingdom of God view, God's Judgement is Life, any other judgement is not, therefore results in death. hence one must receive God's Judgement now, or receive the result of their own judgement, even though the same is a dead soul walking already.

[William]

[Replying to post 8 by DPMartin]

doesn't matter what you or I think would be actual good justice or why, we don't make that call, nor does anything we think is going to change it.

I do get the impression in relation to Abramites and their religious views, but - just as with the above - it is only that and no more.

[William]

[Replying to post 6 by Jagella]

True justice to me is fair play. I don't see how hurting wrong doers is true fair play. I think that we should not punish evil-doers. We should only protect innocent people from them.

In relation to the OPQ, what would an example of what you are stating above, be?