What does this verse prove?

[Elijah John]

I, even I, am YHVH; and beside me there is no savior.
King James Version

For debate:

What does this verse prove, Biblically?

Does it prove that Jesus is YHVH?

Or does it prove that YHVH, not Jesus, is the Savior?

[ttruscott]

I, even I, am YHVH; and beside me there is no savior.
King James Version

For debate:

What does this verse prove, Biblically?

Does it prove that Jesus is YHVH?

Or does it prove that YHVH, not Jesus, is the Savior?

No one has proven either pov definitely to me, and since you are asking, probably not to you either - we get to choose what we believe suits us the best, right?

[Elijah John]

I, even I, am YHVH; and beside me there is no savior.
King James Version

For debate:

What does this verse prove, Biblically?

Does it prove that Jesus is YHVH?

Or does it prove that YHVH, not Jesus, is the Savior?

No one has proven either pov definitely to me, and since you are asking, probably not to you either - we get to choose what we believe suits us the best, right?

What do you make of the fact that the verse clearly states that only YHVH is Savior, yet many people call Jesus Christ, "Savior"?

"What suits us best"? I would say what works best for us. And the question was not because I haven't resolved this or don't have a definitive position on the matter, but rather I thought it would be a good topic for debate.

[2timothy316]

Jehovah sent Jesus and gave him everything he needed to save mankind, so the scripture is solid. Jesus said that his main reason he came to Earth was, not to save mankind but because he loves his Father. (John 14:31) So Jesus give credit to his God and Father.

Yet the Bible, God's Word, says that both Jehovah and the Lamb Jesus, are to receive honor and glory from all living things. (Revelation 5:13)

So they both get credit for being mankind's savior. Each giving honor to the other. Jehovah credited for the plan and the command to do it, yet Jesus credited for the execution of that plan.

[bjs]

[Replying to Elijah John]

I, even I, am YHVH; and beside me there is no savior.

Today in the town of David a Savior has been born to you; he is the Messiah, the Lord. (Luke 2:11)


I don’t like the word “prove� because it really only applies to mathematics. However, if both of these verses are true then it strongly suggest that Jesus is YHVH.

[postroad]

[Replying to post 4 by 2timothy316]


Isaiah 42:8
“I am the Lord; that is my name! I will not yield my glory to another or my praise to idols.

Isaiah 48:11
For my own sake, for my own sake, I do this. How can I let myself be defamed? I will not yield my glory to another.

Isaiah 45:22-25 New International Version (NIV)

22 “Turn to me and be saved,
all you ends of the earth;
for I am God, and there is no other.
23 By myself I have sworn,
my mouth has uttered in all integrity
a word that will not be revoked:
Before me every knee will bow;
by me every tongue will swear.
24 They will say of me, ‘In the Lord alone
are deliverance and strength.’�
All who have raged against him
will come to him and be put to shame.
25 But all the descendants of Israel
will find deliverance in the Lord
and will make their boast in him.


Isaiah 45:20-22 New International Version (NIV)

20 “Gather together and come;
assemble, you fugitives from the nations.
Ignorant are those who carry about idols of wood,
who pray to gods that cannot save.
21 Declare what is to be, present it—
let them take counsel together.
Who foretold this long ago,
who declared it from the distant past?
Was it not I, the Lord?
And there is no God apart from me,
a righteous God and a Savior;
there is none but me.
22 “Turn to me and be saved,
all you ends of the earth;
for I am God, and there is no other.
New International Version (NIV)
Holy Bible, New International Version®, NIV® Copyright ©1973, 1978, 1984, 2011 by Biblica, Inc.® Used by permission. All rights reserved worldwide.

[2timothy316]

[Replying to post 4 by 2timothy316]


Isaiah 42:8
“I am the Lord; that is my name! I will not yield my glory to another or my praise to idols.

Jesus isn't an idol.

Isaiah 48:11
For my own sake, for my own sake, I do this. How can I let myself be defamed? I will not yield my glory to another.

Cherry picked verse out of context. Read the whole chapter and that verse takes a new meaning. He is speaking of other so-called gods that he wouldn't share glory with.

"I told you long ago. Before it came about, I caused you to hear it, So that you could not say, ‘My idol did this;My carved image and my metal image commanded this.’ Is 48:5

"Look! I have refined you, but not in the form of silver. I have tested you in the smelting furnace of affliction. For my own sake, for my own sake I will act, For how could I let myself be profaned? I give my glory to no one else." Is. 10 AND 11

[Elijah John]

[Replying to Elijah John]

I, even I, am YHVH; and beside me there is no savior.

Today in the town of David a Savior has been born to you; he is the Messiah, the Lord. (Luke 2:11)


I don’t like the word “prove� because it really only applies to mathematics. However, if both of these verses are true then it strongly suggest that Jesus is YHVH.

If Jesus is Jehovah, then what is the Father's name. Remember, Jesus said "hallowed be thy name", not "hallowed be our name".

Also, if a truth is esatblished in the "Old" Testament, then someone comes along and writes a contradictory verse, which one shall we believe?

[Elijah John]

[Replying to post 4 by 2timothy316]


Isaiah 42:8
“I am the Lord; that is my name! I will not yield my glory to another or my praise to idols.

Jesus isn't an idol.

Isaiah 48:11
For my own sake, for my own sake, I do this. How can I let myself be defamed? I will not yield my glory to another.

Cherry picked verse out of context. Read the whole chapter and that verse takes a new meaning. He is speaking of other so-called gods that he wouldn't share glory with.

"I told you long ago. Before it came about, I caused you to hear it, So that you could not say, ‘My idol did this;My carved image and my metal image* commanded this.’ Is 48:5

Idols can be humans too, can't they? If Jesus is not God, then glory credited to him that should be reserved for Jehovah alone seems a form of idolatry.

[ttruscott]

I, even I, am YHVH; and beside me there is no savior.
King James Version

For debate:

What does this verse prove, Biblically?

Does it prove that Jesus is YHVH?

Or does it prove that YHVH, not Jesus, is the Savior?

No one has proven either pov definitely to me, and since you are asking, probably not to you either - we get to choose what we believe suits us the best, right?

What do you make of the fact that the verse clearly states that only YHVH is Savior, yet many people call Jesus Christ, "Savior"?

I accept that Christ our saviour is part of the divine Unity called YHWH...who therefore is also saviour because their Unity is perfect.

...but rather I thought it would be a good topic for debate.

How can a topic with no proof and only once source for evidence be a good topic for debate? It will just be are rehash of opinions. Maybe another forum that is more amenable to dialectic....?