Who was Paul's God?

[Elijah John]

Who was Paul's God?

Was it "Christ"? Or was it Jehovah?

I use the rendering "Jehovah" for the Tetragrammaton because I am especially interested in seeing how Jehovah's Witnesses handle the primacy Paul places on "Christ" above all.

Consider:

For me to live is Christ and to die is gain.

and:

I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.

.

etc, etc.

[Tcg]

[Replying to post 1 by Elijah John]

He makes it very clear in this passage from Romans 1:

• 8 First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for all of you, because your faith is being reported all over the world. 9 God, whom I serve in my spirit in preaching the gospel of his Son, is my witness how constantly I remember you 10 in my prayers at all times; and I pray that now at last by God’s will the way may be opened for me to come to you.

The phrase, "God, whom I serve", answers the query clearly. Additionally, he is depending on "God's will" to allow him to visit the church at Rome.



Tcg

[Elijah John]

[Replying to post 1 by Elijah John]

He makes it very clear in this passage from Romans 1:

• 8 First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for all of you, because your faith is being reported all over the world. 9 God, whom I serve in my spirit in preaching the gospel of his Son, is my witness how constantly I remember you 10 in my prayers at all times; and I pray that now at last by God’s will the way may be opened for me to come to you.

The phrase, "God, whom I serve", answers the query clearly. Additionally, he is depending on "God's will" to allow him to visit the church at Rome.



Tcg

Yes, Paul pays lip service to the Father as "God". But in effect, for all practical purposes, it seems that "Christ" is his actual, go-to God.

Otherwise, why not say "I can do all things through God who strengthens me?"

Or "for me to live is God, and to die is gain?

"Christ" was Paul's everything, in effect, his God.

[tam]

Peace to you,


Paul is very clear that his God is the Father (JAH) and his Lord is Christ.


Yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, [Jesus] Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.




Peace again!

[Elijah John]

Peace to you,


Paul is very clear that his God is the Father (JAH) and his Lord is Christ.


Yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, [Jesus] Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.




Peace again!

Granted, but that is lip service. How else do you explain the two verses I cited where "Christ" is Paul's everything? Shouldn't that role be reserved for God alone?

Consider how blasphemous it would sound were someone to say "for me to live is Moses, and to die is gain".

Or "I can do all things through Moses who strengthens me".

"Christ" is where Paul's heart resided, not so much God except perhaps very indirectly with a bit of theoretical theology.

Unless, of course, Paul was a Trinitarian, then it's all the same right?

[Checkpoint]

Peace to you,


Paul is very clear that his God is the Father (JAH) and his Lord is Christ.


Yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, [Jesus] Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.




Peace again!

Granted, but that is lip service. How else do you explain the two verses I cited where "Christ" is Paul's everything? Shouldn't that role be reserved for God alone?

Consider how blasphemous it would sound were someone to say "for me to live is Moses, and to die is gain".

Or "I can do all things through Moses who strengthens me".

"Christ" is where Paul's heart resided, not so much God except perhaps very indirectly with a bit of theoretical theology.

Unless, of course, Paul was a Trinitarian, then it's all the same right?

Paul does not give mere lip service to the supremacy and uniqueness of God.

God is no longer "God alone" but shares His throne with His beloved Son with whom He is well-pleased, and concerning whom commanded us all to "Listen to him".

That's what both Paul and the early Church did.

[2timothy316]

Who was Paul's God?

Was it "Christ"? Or was it Jehovah?

I use the rendering "Jehovah" for the Tetragrammaton because I am especially interested in seeing how Jehovah's Witnesses handle the primacy Paul places on "Christ" above all.

Consider:

For me to live is Christ and to die is gain.

and:

I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me.

.

etc, etc.

"For all things I have the strength through the one who gives me power." Comes from Philippians 4:13. Interestingly the word 'Christ' is not in the manuscript.

So is 'the One' who supplies us with strength, Jehovah or Jesus? I'll let Paul answer that which is found just a few verses down from verse 13 in verses 19 and 20. "In turn my God will fully supply all your need according to his riches in glory by means of Christ Jesus. Now to our God and Father be the glory forever and ever. Amen."

God and Father, this is none other than Jehovah. So seems pretty clear, Jehovah supplies everything yet the supply line is through Jesus His Son.

[Elijah John]

God is no longer "God alone" but shares His throne with His beloved Son with whom He is well-pleased, and concerning whom commanded us all to "Listen to him".

Really? When did that change, and by whose authority?

I am YHVH, there is none else, there is no God beside me:..

Isaiah 45.5a

"No God beside me." Why no mention of any "Son of God" at His side?

[Checkpoint]

God is no longer "God alone" but shares His throne with His beloved Son with whom He is well-pleased, and concerning whom commanded us all to "Listen to him".

Really? When did that change, and by whose authority?

I am YHVH, there is none else, there is no God beside me:..

Isaiah 45.5a

"No God beside me." Why no mention of any "Son of God" at His side?

Yes E.J., really.

That changed when Christ ascended to the only true God, YHVH, the Father, who had authorised it in Psalm 110 centuries before it took place.

There was no mention of it in Isaiah 45:5 because "the Son of God" was not there yet.

[Elijah John]

"For all things I have the strength through the one who gives me power." Comes from Philippians 4:13. Interestingly the word 'Christ' is not in the manuscript.

Oops. Looks like I misquoted Paul here. The peril of quoting from memory.

But still, there's the "for me to live is Christ and to die is gain" verse. Seems "Christ" was Paul's everything, in effect, his God.

If not "Christ" then "The-Father-as-known-though-Christ" (does Paul ever mention the Father by name?)

If "Christ was not Paul's "self-contained" god, then Christ seems to have been inseparable from his understanding or experience of the Father.

For the rest of us non-Pauline believers, the Father alone suffices. The others (including the Son) are "simply" messengers. But the message is (or should be) Jehovah, not "Christ."

Thomas Paine was right when he said "instead of God a man is preached"

And didn't Paul say something to the effect of "I preach Christ and him crucified".

Why not preach Jehovah?