How did Jesus grow so big?

[marco]

Having read umpteen defences, eulogies, apologias for Jesus, I am persuaded he was perhaps a well-intentioned man. Obviously reports about him have erased any flaws, as one would expect so we read between the lines for negatives.

Anyway he appeared on the preaching circuit at thirty and gave the impression he was God-sent. His oratory used a warm connection between himself and his Father. If God did speak from the sky then that's all there is to it. I don't believe he did, so I see the gospels as containing lies and this seems obvious when we read Matthew.



Why are we still discussing Jesus today in countries he had no clue about? Is the endurance of his name evidence of truth? Or what factors, outside of Christ's control, might have built a giant religion?

[marco]

[Replying to post 1 by marco]

I'm often told that Jesus is the most famous man in the world. I think that means the name is widely spoken. So was Caesar's, translated to Kaiser and Czar. For a time I was impressed by the argument that truth persists, and even grows with time into something awesomely beautiful. But falsehood grows as well: a small lie can quickly become a monster.

However, when I read of the desert trader Muhammad founding a new religion and when I see across the globe Islam spreading faster than Christianity, which had a 600 year start, I wonder if there is any reason to value Christ's longevity.

[Willum]

How did Jesus grow so big?

ANSWER: Roman vitamins.


So, the Roman Empire was a propaganda machine. It was probably the first best successful one.

When it invaded a country it used religion to usurp it. Claiming their god, know a Zeus (Deus), Jupiter (Dys Pater), or Iove (Jehovah) was the true god, and had said they were conquers because the gods had given them mandate.

Well, from the 3rd century BCE they improved this technique.
It turned on them,

Eventually they converted those who believed their nonsense, and those believers sent people back to Rome. Rome, no dummies, took it, and used it again.

That is why it spread throughout the Roman world and then only with the expansion of it's derivative empires. England for example spread it to the Americas.

And what is the proof?
It is very convincing even though it promotes talking snakes as its cannon.
Also, Jesus promotes the paying of taxes, obeying government and of course peace.

[marco]

How did Jesus grow so big?

ANSWER: Roman vitamins.

I have seen an attempt at cooking garum - stinking fish sauce. I'm not sure which Roman vitamins Jesus would have taken. I'm told he was, physically, a small man.

That is why it spread throughout the Roman world and then only with the expansion of its derivative empires. England for example spread it to the Americas.

And what is the proof?
It is very convincing even though it promotes talking snakes as its cannon.
Also, Jesus promotes the paying of taxes, obeying government and of course peace.

Yes it is a compliant religion, useful in the hands of the powerful. Islam (submission) is even better in despotic hands. A nation whose cheeks are turned is easy to rule. This explains why the extraction of Christ's message was passed on; but what was the appeal of the mendicant preacher himself? Was he just a good Billy Graham?

[Willum]

[Replying to post 4 by marco]

Assuming he even existed, whatever he was was destroyed by Rome.

Not only did Jesus not leave us any letters, carpentry, or resurrected humans as evidence of his presence, but apparently Rome took all of the Apostle's quotations and letters about him, bulk produced them, then mysteriously, destroyed them all.

[marco]

[Replying to post 4 by marco]

Assuming he even existed, whatever he was was destroyed by Rome.

Not only did Jesus not leave us any letters, carpentry, or resurrected humans as evidence of his presence, but apparently Rome took all of the Apostle's quotations and letters about him, bulk produced them, then mysteriously, destroyed them all.

Well, foolishly or not, he opened himself to speculation by failing to write anything. Instead he warned about false writers and gave no indication which ones - Paul? - were false. Of course he didn't know; he was just making guesses as to what might be.


Still it is amazing that some Jewish person rose from 30 years of obscurity and got himself killed by blaspheming, thus kicking of a vast religious following.

[Willum]

[Replying to post 6 by marco]

Point of order, Jesus was excluded from being Jewish by Deuteronomy, if he had a human father, and it would be immaterial if divine. He was also excluded by forming his own religion.
The only way he could be Jewish is by a convention that only exists sporadically.

[marco]

[Replying to post 6 by marco]

Point of order, Jesus was excluded from being Jewish by Deuteronomy, if he had a human father, and it would be immaterial if divine. He was also excluded by forming his own religion.
The only way he could be Jewish is by a convention that only exists sporadically.

Then what was he, a Samaritan? If it quacks and waddles and swims, it's a duck. And as they say nowadays, he identified as Jewish.

[Overcomer]

Marco wrote:

However, when I read of the desert trader Muhammad founding a new religion and when I see across the globe Islam spreading faster than Christianity, which had a 600 year start, I wonder if there is any reason to value Christ's longevity.

Christian Apologist Ravi Zacharias makes an excellent distinction between Islam and Christianity with regard to growth. He points out that Islam is the fasted growing enforced religion in the world. A Muslim doesn't just face ostracism for leaving Islam. He/she faces death because it is thought that someone who leaves the religion brings shame to his/her family and community.

Zacharias suggested to one Muslim leader that he should "take the foot off the throats" of his people and then see how fast the religion would grow. He says people would leave in droves. Listen here:

https://www.rzim.org/listen/just-a-thou ... -the-world

I think people followed Christ then for the same reason they do today -- his love, his goodness, his truth, his faithfulness -- and the recognition that he was and is exactly who he said he was and is -- Son of God, Son of Man, King of kings, Lord of lords, Saviour, Redeemer, Brother, Friend.

[benchwarmer]

I think people followed Christ then for the same reason they do today -- his love, his goodness, his truth, his faithfulness -- and the recognition that he was and is exactly who he said he was and is -- Son of God, Son of Man, King of kings, Lord of lords, Saviour, Redeemer, Brother, Friend.

Apparently you are not very familiar with church history:

Interview — Converting By the Sword
https://christianhistoryinstitute.org/m ... -the-sword

Christians may not use force now, but they sure did in the past. Islam is approximately 600 years younger than Christianity, so you need to give them an extra 600 years to catch up.