Jesus is God, made man

[PinSeeker]

For debate:

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The world and all natural things came into existence only through God:

• "In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth." [Genesis 1:1]
  
  "Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God... For from Him and through Him and to Him are all things." [Romans 11:33-36]
  
  "seek God... He is not far from each one of us; for in Him we live and move and exist" [Acts 17:27-28]

Likewise, the world and all natural things came into existence through Christ Jesus:

• "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being." [John 1:1-3]

Therefore, Jesus is also part of the One True God. He's just not God the Father.

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Only God is not in need of salvation, He IS our salvation:

• "The LORD is my rock and my fortress and my deliverer, My God, my rock, in whom I take refuge; My shield and the horn of my salvation, my stronghold." [Psalm 18:2]
  
  "The LORD is my light and my salvation; Whom shall I fear? The LORD is the defense of my life; Whom shall I dread?" [Psalm 27:1]
  
  “Surely, the hills are a deception, A tumult on the mountains. Surely in the LORD our God Is the salvation of Israel." [Jeremiah 3:23]

Likewise, Jesus was not in need of salvation, but IS our salvation:

• "Jesus Christ... is the stone... which... became the chief corner stone. And there is salvation in no one else... by which we must be saved.â€� [Acts 4:10-12]
  
  "God has not destined us for wrath, but for obtaining salvation through our Lord Jesus Christ..." [1 Thessalonians 5:9]]

Therefore, Jesus is also part of the One True God. He's just not God the Father.

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Only God can give His Law, and only God can fulfill His law:

• "...God spoke all these words, saying, 'I am the LORD your God... showing lovingkindness... to those who love Me and keep My commandments." [Exodus 20:1-6, Deuteronomy 5:5-10]

Jesus both gave the Law and fulfilled it:

• “If you love Me, you will keep My commandments." [John 14:15]
  
  "He who has My commandments and keeps them is the one who loves Me; and he who loves Me will be loved by My Father, and I will love him and will disclose Myself to him.� [John 14:21]
  
  "If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love; just as I have kept My Father’s commandments and abide in His love." [John 15:10]
  
  “This is My commandment, that you love one another, just as I have loved you." [John 15:12]
  
  "You are My friends if you do what I command you." [John 15:14]
  
  "Do not think that I came to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I did not come to abolish but to fulfill." [Matthew 5:17]

Therefore, Jesus is also part of the One True God. He's just not God the Father.

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Only God can redeem any person, thereby saving him/her:

• "The LORD redeems the soul of His servants, And none of those who take refuge in Him will be condemned." [Psalm 34:22]
  
  "...when the fullness of the time came, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the Law, so that He might redeem those who were under the Law..." [Galatians 4:4-5]

Jesus redeemed/redeems the Elect:

• "...when the fullness of the time came, God sent forth His Son, born of a woman, born under the Law, so that He might redeem those who were under the Law..." [the pronoun 'His' refers to God, of course, but the pronoun 'He' refers to 'Son' (Jesus); Galatians 4:4-5]
  
  "...Christ Jesus, Who gave Himself for us to redeem us from every lawless deed, and to purify for Himself a people for His own possession..." [Titus 2:13-14]

Therefore, Jesus is also part of the One True God. He's just not God the Father.

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Only God is unchanging, the same yesterday, today, and forever:

• “O my God, do not take me away in the midst of my days, Your years are throughout all generations. Of old You founded the earth, and the heavens are the work of Your hands. Even they will perish, but You endure; and all of them will wear out like a garment; like clothing You will change them and they will be changed. But You are the same, and Your years will not come to an end." [Psalm 102:24-27]

Likewise, Jesus is unchanging, the same yesterday, today, and forever:

• "Jesus Christ is the same yesterday and today and forever." [Hebrews 13:8]

Therefore, Jesus is also part of the One True God. He's just not God the Father.

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I gotta say, I really enjoyed doing that. Debate away.

[Avoice]

It sure looks convincing.

Only show me where GOD SAYS listen to Jesus. GOD SAYS Not someone says God said it. A direct quote attributed to God.

[Eloi]

Pinseeker, when Jesus Christ was a human, the temple where Jehovah was worshiped was STILL in Jerusalem. When he healed some sick people, he told them to make offerings and directed them before Jehovah's priests who were serving in the temple. No follower of Jesus confused him with God, as you do now along with so many millions more people. If you lived in the time of Jesus Christ, even Jesus himself would have called you blasphemous.

[PinSeeker]

It sure looks convincing.

Only show me where GOD SAYS listen to Jesus. GOD SAYS Not someone says God said it. A direct quote attributed to God.

In the Old Testament, God speaks through the prophets (Genesis through Malachi). In the New Testament, God speaks by His Son -- in Person and through the apostles (Matthew through Revelation) -- Hebrews 1:1-2

Every Word of the Bible, while technically indirect, is directly from the mouth of God. -- Deuteronomy 8:3, Matthew 4:4. And all Scripture is God breathed. -- 2 Timothy 3:16

And Jesus says all of the Old Testament is about Him (John 5:46).

Grace and peace to you.

[Eloi]

[Replying to PinSeeker]
That is not what the Bible says:

Heb. 1:1 Long ago God spoke to our forefathers by means of the prophets on many occasions and in many ways. 2 Now at the end of these days he has spoken to us by means of a Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the systems of things. 3 He is the reflection of God’s glory and the exact representation of his very being, and he sustains all things by the word of his power. And after he had made a purification for our sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high. 4 So he has become better than the angels to the extent that he has inherited a name more excellent than theirs.

Btw, there is not any question to debate in your first post.

[Checkpoint]

[Replying to post 1 by PinSeeker]

Jesus is also part of the One True God. He's just not God the Father.

The Word became flesh as a human, and is that yesterday, today and forever.

John 17:

1 After Jesus said this, he looked toward heaven and prayed:

“Father, the hour has come. Glorify your Son, that your Son may glorify you.
2 For you granted him authority over all people that he might give eternal life to all those you have given him.

3 Now this is eternal life: that they know you, the only true God, and Jesus Anointed, whom you have sent.

John 20:

17 Jesus said, “Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet ascended to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them, ‘I am ascending to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.’ 

1 Timothy 2:

3 This is good, and pleases God our Savior,
4 who wants all people to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth.

5 For there is one God and one mediator between God and mankind, the man, the ihe Anointed one, Jesus,
6 who gave himself as a ransom for all people.
This has now been witnessed to at the proper time.

7 And for this purpose I was appointed a herald and an apostle—I am telling the truth, I am not lying—and a true and faithful teacher of the Gentiles.

[brianbbs67]

It sure looks convincing.

Only show me where GOD SAYS listen to Jesus. GOD SAYS Not someone says God said it. A direct quote attributed to God.

This is my son,in whom I am well pleased. Matthew 3:16 says the voice is of God.

[Elijah John]

[Replying to post 1 by PinSeeker]

You'd have a better case if the same author who said those things about YHVH, said them about Jesus. But they didn't. You have "Old" Testament authors making claims about YHVH, then New Testament authors, far removed, making the same or similar claims about Jesus.

But the claims are not connected. Just because someone comes along later and makes a revision, does not prove the revision is valid.

Or just because someone cites an old claim and applies it to someone new, does not make the new claim valid.

[onewithhim]

[Replying to post 3 by Eloi]

Also....

Yes, Jesus was a creator of everything, after he himself was brought into existence by Jehovah, his Father and God (John 20:17). But does that make him God? Not any more than a jack-hammer is the man who is directing and using the tool.

Jesus created as Jehovah God Almighty directed him to create, and, using the creative power that was GIVEN to him by Jehovah.

[ttruscott]

If you lived in the time of Jesus Christ, even Jesus himself would have called you blasphemous.

Did he call Thomas blasphemous in John 20:27 Then Jesus said to Thomas, “Put your finger here and look at My hands. Reach out your hand and put it into My side. Stop doubting and believe.� 28 Thomas replied, “My Lord and my God!� 29 Jesus said to him, “Because you have seen Me, you have believed; blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.�…

Either He was accepting being called My God or He knew Thomas meant something else as per the dissenters. So not calling someone on their blasphemy is not a criteria for proof...

He did not call him on blasphemy because he did not mean a blasphemy or
He did not call him on blasphemy because he spoke the truth of his divinity...
your choice.