Moderate?

[Elijah John]

Mayor Pete, Mike Bloomberg, Joe Biden, Amy Klobuchar have all been described as "moderate" Democrats.

For debate, in what sense are any of these people "moderate"?

"Moderate" compared to who?

[Bust Nak]

At best, Democrats are left-of-center. But today's Democrats have taken a dramatic turn to the left. That is this American's perspective.

How is the center defined, the halfway point between Republicans and Democrats? Maybe this is just a case of the center shifting to the right.

[2ndRateMind]

My point is that so called "moderate" Democrat candidates for President are no such thing.

...And Bernie Sanders has policy proposals that are as close to the teachings of Jesus as you can get.

Jesus would be all for socialism. That's what he taught.

Why are the Republicans so against the teachings of Jesus?

Seems to me that Sanders sends the message that we should all look after each other. I would concur with that message. A nation, the richest nation on earth, that still has homeless and destitute among its number, has something to be ashamed of.

I am not sure Jesus taught, however one construes him, either socialism or communism. That was left to Marx, with all the millions of deaths as a direct result. I think Jesus stood merely for social solidarity*.

Why are Republicans against this? Maybe because they want the wealth they have gotten all to themselves, and feel no solidarity with the poor. After all, if they did, they would be less rich.

Fortunately, however, happiness does not depend on one's bank balance, but mainly on a quiet conscience, and the cultivation of virtue.

Best wishes, 2RM.

* see the parable of the good Samaritan. Luke 10:25-37 KJV.

[historia]

But today's Democrats have taken a dramatic turn to the left.

How is the center defined, the halfway point between Republicans and Democrats? Maybe this is just a case of the center shifting to the right.

Both of these things can be true.

According to this article from 538, and many others, the Republican Party has moved to the right:

Political scientists, using DW-Nominate scores, have concluded that the Republicans now in Congress are much further to the right of congressional Republicans in the 1970s and 1980s.

Another article from 538 shows a similar, left-ward move by the Democratic Party over that same time period:

[T]he data shows that Democrats have indeed become more liberal over time, particularly on questions related to race and immigration . . . Democrats also moved to the left on health care

Both articles use the General Social Survey (GSS) in support of that conclusion, which shows a political sorting of the American electorate over the past 30 years, as socially conservative whites have moved to the Republicans, while socially liberal whites have moved to the Democrats, making both parties less ideologically diverse.

[historia]

I think Jesus stood merely for social solidarity.

Why are Republicans against this? Maybe because they want the wealth they have gotten all to themselves, and feel no solidarity with the poor.

I don't think it's helpful to ascribe malicious intent to one's political opponents. Are there some Republicans (and Democrats) who vote purely out of self-interest? Sure. But, on the whole, most people want to be self-sufficient while helping their less-fortunate neighbors.

Broadly speaking, the Republican and Democratic parties just disagree on the best ways to achieve those goals, with Democrats preferring greater government involvement, while Republicans prefer that non-governmental organizations play a larger role.

There are pluses and minuses -- as well as second-order ramifications -- to each approach. Which is better may depend on the problem. And, in the US, there is also the question of whether certain problems are best addressed at the federal, state, or local levels.

[2ndRateMind]

[Replying to post 14 by historia]

Hmmm. Nothing is stopping the republican tendency from ending absolute poverty earth-wide by voluntary donations. There is precious little evidence that this is what they will do, without the intervention of government, however.

Best wishes, 2RM.

[2ndRateMind]

I think Jesus stood merely for social solidarity.

Why are Republicans against this? Maybe because they want the wealth they have gotten all to themselves, and feel no solidarity with the poor.

I don't think it's helpful to ascribe malicious intent to one's political opponents.

Incidentally, I wasn't ascribing malicious intent to anyone. Just ignorance and neglect. Malice implies you actively want the poor to die off, and cease to trouble your conscience. Ignorance and neglect simply assume you just don't know the plight of the poor, or, if you do, don't care enough to do anything about it.

Best wishes, 2RM.

[Aetixintro]

Mayor Pete, Mike Bloomberg, Joe Biden, Amy Klobuchar have all been described as "moderate" Democrats.

For debate, in what sense are any of these people "moderate"?

"Moderate" compared to who?

My input just in case it is wanted:
Usually, one speaks about right and left inside a party given party politics.
As such, moderate is the mainstream Democrat politics.

See for example Labour party of UK, Europe. They have oftentimes rightwing and leftwing partymembers. This has been mentioned often given Jeremy Corbeyn's leftwing stance of the party politics counter to the way Tony Blair has led the party successfully before him.

[2ndRateMind]

[Replying to post 17 by Aetixintro]

Hmmm Just for reference, my (European) attitude would put Tony Blair at centre-left, and Jeremy Corbyn at far left. From this perspective, Biden would be centre-right, and Sanders moderate left. But it has become clear from this discussion that our perceptions of left and right depend on our political environments and convictions, and I do not claim that my perceptions are superior to anyone else's.

Best wishes, 2RM.