Lazarus was the beloved disciple.

[polonius]

The gospels never say that John was the "beloved disciple." That's because Lazarus was the disciple Jesus loved.

1 Now a certain man was ill, Lazarus of Bethany, the village of Mary and her sister Martha. 2 Mary was the one who anointed the Lord with perfume and wiped his feet with her hair; her brother Lazarus was ill. 3 So the sisters sent a message to Jesus, “Lord, he whom you love is ill. 5 Now Jesus loved Martha and her sister and Lazarus. 6 So when he heard that Lazarus was sick, he stayed where he was two more days, 7 and then he said to his disciples, “Let us go back to Judea.�8 “But Rabbi,� they said, “a short while ago the Jews there tried to stone you, and yet you are going back?�

John 11

[Checkpoint]

The gospels never say that John was the "beloved disciple." That's because Lazarus was the disciple Jesus loved.

1 Now a certain man was ill, Lazarus of Bethany, the village of Mary and her sister Martha. 2 Mary was the one who anointed the Lord with perfume and wiped his feet with her hair; her brother Lazarus was ill. 3 So the sisters sent a message to Jesus, “Lord, he whom you love is ill. 5 Now Jesus loved Martha and her sister and Lazarus. 6 So when he heard that Lazarus was sick, he stayed where he was two more days, 7 and then he said to his disciples, “Let us go back to Judea.�8 “But Rabbi,� they said, “a short while ago the Jews there tried to stone you, and yet you are going back?�

John 11

Then why does John often mention "the disciple whom Jesus loved" and not even hint Jesus raised him from the dead, other than in his whole chapter 11 story?

By the way, Lazarus was not one of the 12.

[Tcg]

By the wa7, Lazarus was not one of the 12.

One did not need to be one of the twelve to have been considered a disciple:

• Matthew 27:57 When it was evening, there came a rich man from Arimathea, named Joseph, who also was a disciple of Jesus.
  
  Matthew 28:19 Go therefore and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit
  
  John 4:1 Now when Jesus learned that the Pharisees had heard that Jesus was making and baptizing more disciples than John 2 (although Jesus himself did not baptize, but only his disciples), 3 he left Judea and departed again for Galilee.
  
  John 8:30 As he was saying these things, many believed in him. 31 So Jesus said to the Jews who had believed him, “If you abide in my word, you are truly my disciples, 32 and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.�

Tcg

[polonius]

The gospels never say that John was the "beloved disciple." That's because Lazarus was the disciple Jesus loved.

1 Now a certain man was ill, Lazarus of Bethany, the village of Mary and her sister Martha. 2 Mary was the one who anointed the Lord with perfume and wiped his feet with her hair; her brother Lazarus was ill. 3 So the sisters sent a message to Jesus, “Lord, he whom you love is ill. 5 Now Jesus loved Martha and her sister and Lazarus. 6 So when he heard that Lazarus was sick, he stayed where he was two more days, 7 and then he said to his disciples, “Let us go back to Judea.�8 “But Rabbi,� they said, “a short while ago the Jews there tried to stone you, and yet you are going back?�

John 11

Then why does John often mention "the disciple whom Jesus loved" and not even hint Jesus raised him from the dead, other than in his whole chapter 11 story?

By the way, Lazarus was not one of the 12.

RESPONSE:

Note that the New Testament refers to the "DISCIPLE" that Jesus loved. Never the APOSTLE that Jesus loved. Lazarus was a disciple, not an Apostle.

If you read the New Testament you will find that Jesus has 70 disciples but only 12 apostles. Lazarus was a beloved disciple, not a beloved apostle.

[tam]

Peace to you,

[Replying to post 4 by polonius]



If Lazarus was the disciple Christ loved, then Lazarus was also an apostle (one of the Twelve), since Christ shared the last supper with the 12 apostles, the disciple Christ loved being among them. (oh, and apostles are also disciples)


Same discussion as on your other thread though:

viewtopic.php?t=34470




Peace again to you!

[Checkpoint]

The gospels never say that John was the "beloved disciple." That's because Lazarus was the disciple Jesus loved.

1 Now a certain man was ill, Lazarus of Bethany, the village of Mary and her sister Martha. 2 Mary was the one who anointed the Lord with perfume and wiped his feet with her hair; her brother Lazarus was ill. 3 So the sisters sent a message to Jesus, “Lord, he whom you love is ill. 5 Now Jesus loved Martha and her sister and Lazarus. 6 So when he heard that Lazarus was sick, he stayed where he was two more days, 7 and then he said to his disciples, “Let us go back to Judea.�8 “But Rabbi,� they said, “a short while ago the Jews there tried to stone you, and yet you are going back?�

John 11

Then why does John often mention "the disciple whom Jesus loved" and not even hint Jesus raised him from the dead, other than in his whole chapter 11 story?

By the way, Lazarus was not one of the 12.

RESPONSE:

Note that the New Testament refers to the "DISCIPLE" that Jesus loved. Never the APOSTLE that Jesus loved. Lazarus was a disciple, not an Apostle.

If you read the New Testament you will find that Jesus has 70 disciples but only 12 apostles. Lazarus was a beloved disciple, not a beloved apostle.

Perhaps, but you left my question unanswered.

If you can, if you care to, please answer it.

[polonius]

The gospels never say that John was the "beloved disciple." That's because Lazarus was the disciple Jesus loved.

1 Now a certain man was ill, Lazarus of Bethany, the village of Mary and her sister Martha. 2 Mary was the one who anointed the Lord with perfume and wiped his feet with her hair; her brother Lazarus was ill. 3 So the sisters sent a message to Jesus, “Lord, he whom you love is ill. 5 Now Jesus loved Martha and her sister and Lazarus. 6 So when he heard that Lazarus was sick, he stayed where he was two more days, 7 and then he said to his disciples, “Let us go back to Judea.�8 “But Rabbi,� they said, “a short while ago the Jews there tried to stone you, and yet you are going back?�

John 11

Then why does John often mention "the disciple whom Jesus loved" and not even hint Jesus raised him from the dead, other than in his whole chapter 11 story?

By the way, Lazarus was not one of the 12.

RESPONSE:
Perhaps it was because is not really the writer of the Gospel we call John's.

We may never know for certain who wrote the Gospel of John, any more than we can know who wrote the books of Matthew, Mark and Luke. We do know that John is a gospel apart, however. Early Matthew, Mark and Luke are so alike in their telling that they are called the Synoptic Gospels, meaning “seen together�—the parallels are clear when they are looked at side by side. Matthew and Luke follow the version of events in Mark, which is thought by scholars to be the earliest and most historically accurate Gospel. John, however, does not include the same incidents or chronology found in the other three Gospels, and the fact that it is so different has spurred a debate over whether John’s Gospel is historical or not, something that has been noted in Gospel of John commentary for hundreds—even thousands—of years. (from the Biblical Archeology Society)

[Elijah John]

The gospels never say that John was the "beloved disciple." That's because Lazarus was the disciple Jesus loved.

1 Now a certain man was ill, Lazarus of Bethany, the village of Mary and her sister Martha. 2 Mary was the one who anointed the Lord with perfume and wiped his feet with her hair; her brother Lazarus was ill. 3 So the sisters sent a message to Jesus, “Lord, he whom you love is ill. 5 Now Jesus loved Martha and her sister and Lazarus. 6 So when he heard that Lazarus was sick, he stayed where he was two more days, 7 and then he said to his disciples, “Let us go back to Judea.�8 “But Rabbi,� they said, “a short while ago the Jews there tried to stone you, and yet you are going back?�

John 11

Moderator Clarification

This is a great topic, but please frame your OP as a subject for debate with a question, so we don't have to move it to Random Ramblings.

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[polonius]

Sorry! I'll phrase my argument as a question.

Gospel of John

25 Standing by the cross of Jesus were his mother and his mother’s sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary of Magdala. 26When Jesus saw his mother and the disciple there whom he loved, he said to his mother, “Woman, behold, your son.� 27Then he said to the disciple, “Behold, your mother.� And from that hour the disciple took her into his home.

Lazarus lived in Bethany about a half hour walk from Jerusalem. John the Apostle, on the other hand, lived with the other Apostles in Galilee about a three day journey from Jerusalem.

Rather obviously, whose home was Mary brought to
"from that hour"?

[bjs]

[Replying to polonius]

The obvious problem with this is that it leaves us to wonder why the author of John referred to himself as “the disciple that Jesus loved� throughout his Gospel, but called Lazarus by name. If Lazarus and the beloved disciple were the same person, why did the author us overly complex grammatical structures to avoid using his own name – for instance at the Last Supper – but then freely use the name Lazarus when the story focus on Lazarus.

Saying that that Lazarus was the beloved disciple adds an extra layer of complexity without any justification for it. Therefore, Lazarus was probably not the beloved disciple.