A recent response to a post contained a very common belief among
Catholics:
"The CC has declared that ….."
Do you believe everything that the Catholic Church declares? Shall we look at some "infallible" teachings?
But is everything declared to be so by the Church, true?
Moderator: Moderators
Re: When was the existence of a Trinity first taught?
Post #21What are you talking about??brianbbs67 wrote: You miss characterize Iraneous here. He was as dogmatic as his teacher, Polycarp. He even wrote the Pope about the easter issue and 14th of nissan which was passover. It went something close to this, "As you know my tea]cher Polycarp was very orthodox in his beliefs as am I but very forgiving in non orthodox things such as the date of Easter". Right there the Pope is told Easter is not doctrinal. It still isn't. This applied to Athanasuis also.
I was showing evidence of the belief in the TRINITY among the Early Church Fathers. This has nothing to do with the Quartodecimen Controversy and Easter. Besides - you got Irenaeus's position wrong.
I didn't "mis-characterize" anybody . . .
Re: When was the existence of a Trinity first taught?
Post #22MarysSon posted:
"The same if true for the Trinity. It wasn't officially defined until the Church was about 300 years old - but it was ALWAYS taught."????
RESPONSE: "Alwasy" taught??? Is it in the Gospels?
But you don't give any example before 177 AD when the legend began. It became a formal official teaching at the Council of Nices because Conatantine told the bishops to stop quibbling and make it an official teaching.
"The same if true for the Trinity. It wasn't officially defined until the Church was about 300 years old - but it was ALWAYS taught."????
RESPONSE: "Alwasy" taught??? Is it in the Gospels?
But you don't give any example before 177 AD when the legend began. It became a formal official teaching at the Council of Nices because Conatantine told the bishops to stop quibbling and make it an official teaching.
Re: When was the existence of a Trinity first taught?
Post #23[quote="polonius"]
MarysSon posted:
"The same if true for the Trinity. It wasn't officially defined until the Church was about 300 years old - but it was ALWAYS taught."????
RESPONSE: "Alwasy" taught??? Is it in the Gospels?
Yet you yourself can't give any example before 177 AD when the legend began. It became a formal official teaching at the Council of Nicea because Constantine told the bishops to stop quibbling and make it an official teaching. The Pope didn't make the decision
MarysSon posted:
"The same if true for the Trinity. It wasn't officially defined until the Church was about 300 years old - but it was ALWAYS taught."????
RESPONSE: "Alwasy" taught??? Is it in the Gospels?
Yet you yourself can't give any example before 177 AD when the legend began. It became a formal official teaching at the Council of Nicea because Constantine told the bishops to stop quibbling and make it an official teaching. The Pope didn't make the decision
Re: When was the existence of a Trinity first taught?
Post #24polonius wrote:Note that the early Christians remained devout Temple worshipping Jews including "Hear O Israel, the Lord is One". They didn't have a Trinity. When some began to claim that Jesus was divine, they were anathmatized and driven from the synogues! Read the Gospel of John,polonius wrote: MarysSon posted:
"The same if true for the Trinity. It wasn't officially defined until the Church was about 300 years old - but it was ALWAYS taught."????
RESPONSE: "Always" taught??? Is it in the Gospels?
Yet you yourself can't give any example before 177 AD . It became a formal official teaching at the Council of Nicea because Constantine told the bishops to stop quibbling and make it an official teaching. The Pope didn't make the decision
Re: When was the existence of a Trinity first taught?
Post #25QUESTION Didn't the Quartodecimen Controversy have to due with arguing the correct date of Easter? What did that have to do with a Trinity?MarysSon wrote:What are you talking about??brianbbs67 wrote: You miss characterize Iraneous here. He was as dogmatic as his teacher, Polycarp. He even wrote the Pope about the easter issue and 14th of nissan which was passover. It went something close to this, "As you know my tea]cher Polycarp was very orthodox in his beliefs as am I but very forgiving in non orthodox things such as the date of Easter". Right there the Pope is told Easter is not doctrinal. It still isn't. This applied to Athanasuis also.
I was showing evidence of the belief in the TRINITY among the Early Church Fathers. This has nothing to do with the Quartodecimen Controversy and Easter. Besides - you got Irenaeus's position wrong.
I didn't "mis-characterize" anybody . . .
Re: When was the existence of a Trinity first taught?
Post #26Yes - MY point, exactly . . .polonius wrote: QUESTION Didn't the Quartodecimen Controversy have to due with arguing the correct date of Easter? What did that have to do with a Trinity?
Were there really two sons of Mary named Jesus?
Post #27A simple test regarding the inertance of scripture.
When did Matthew claim that Jesus was born?.See Matt 2.
When did Luke claim that Jesus was born? See Luke 2
Notice the ten year differnce. One or both Gospels are "inspired" nonsence
Should I post a series of scriptural errors so if someone triies to prove a point by quoting scripture, readers will recognize how weak an argument that is.
When did Matthew claim that Jesus was born?.See Matt 2.
When did Luke claim that Jesus was born? See Luke 2
Notice the ten year differnce. One or both Gospels are "inspired" nonsence
Should I post a series of scriptural errors so if someone triies to prove a point by quoting scripture, readers will recognize how weak an argument that is.
Re: When was the existence of a Trinity first taught?
Post #28Was this added to Matthew's gospel?
I believe there
are four or five reports of Baptism in scripture. All are in the name of Jesus alone. Look it up. No mention of a Trinity.
It nowhere claimed tha the
Re: When was the existence of a Trinity first taught?
Post #29Ummmmm, note that the Gospel of John actually proclaims Jesus to be God:polonius wrote: Note that the early Christians remained devout Temple worshipping Jews including "Hear O Israel, the Lord is One". They didn't have a Trinity. When some began to claim that Jesus was divine, they were anathmatized and driven from the synogues! Read the Gospel of John
John 20:27-29
Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here, and see my hands; and put out your hand, and place it in my side. Do not disbelieve, but believe.� Thomas answered him, “My LORD and my GOD!� Jesus said to him, “Have you believed because you have seen me? Blessed are those who have not seen and yet have believed.�
Re: When was the existence of a Trinity first taught?
Post #30Nope - this was ALWAYS in Matt. 28:19.polonius wrote: Was this added to Matthew's gospel?
I believe there
are four or five reports of Baptism in scripture. All are in the name of Jesus alone. Look it up. No mention of a Trinity.
Funny that the ONE time Jesus gave explicit instructions on HOW to Baptize - HE said to do it in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit . . .
